The Peralta Stone Maps, Real Maps to Lost Gold Mines or Cruel Hoax?

[Blindbowman]

Joe---

I know you posted your map, and it was plain as day. Except it was too small to see much except the trail alignment (for me, anyway), which looked exact.

And you said in the text that certain other stuff matched up, but I couldn't really see the landmarks matching the squiggles on the map. And I saw the lines you drew, but I didn't catch-on that they represented lines between the holes, and I didn't really try to figure it out, again because the map was small. So I just took your word for it.

So, as it stands right now, the figures and marks on the trail maps don't seem to match anything I've ever seen on a map. It just looks like a bunch of, like I said, squiggles. I mean the creeks or canyons seem to go West to East, even. But they actually mostly go Northernly-ish to Southernly-ish, except for Tortilla Creek.

But I did have a couple things right! I said that you had the trail matched up. And I said that if a few landmarks could be identified, then some sense might be made of it. And you said the holes matched, so that could qualify as my "few landmarks" reckoning. Heh-heh.

I'm glad it came up though, because I don't think I've heard that detailed a version of step-by-step how you came to realize what it represented. So thanks for that.

Have a good one,
Don

Don,

Most all those little squiggles are only there to confuse the holder, unless you have deeper knowledge. I have purposely left out 2 references so that those who are 'Locked On' will find them for themselves, and conclude that it is Red Mountain.......Jack

sorry jack ,wrong answer ..

 

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[JackH]

The Peralta 'Heart Stone/s are a puzzle/riddle. Not a map. Clearly !

 

[Blindbowman]

The Peralta 'Heart Stone/s are a puzzle/riddle. Not a map. Clearly !

brillant .. think what ever you want ...

this why i dont come to the site any more ....

i just dont have the time to make a reply and if i said what i want to say then there would be no reason to return at all ..


good luck jack hope you enjoy the hunt as much as did ...

 

[JackH]

The Peralta 'Heart Stone/s are a puzzle/riddle. Not a map. Clearly !

brillant .. think what ever you want ...

this why i dont come to the site any more ....

i just dont have the time to make a reply and if i said what i want to say then there would be no reason to return at all ..


good luck jack hope you enjoy the hunt as much as did ...

Blindbowman,

There is No Hunt for me. I have the information I need, and offer it without recourse. I understand the 'Fever' and do not have it. Place me in the Superstition's and I couldn't get out of there fast enough to get to Red Mountain , it is there that I would have my Coronary!......Jack

 

[desertstar12]

Oh boy..here I go I have studied and followed every piece of information on Jacob Waltz for many years. I have read every book you can think of and been intrigued about this legend since I was about 6.
In the 80's I read a book called " The Killer Mountains", the true story of an Oklahoma City
PI who was hired to disprove that this ever existed. Well in the process he not only proved that it did indeed exist but in time got together a few very close friends and his Cibola Mining Company was formed and went into the Superstitions in search.
The PI's name was Glen Magill and I had the opportunity to meet and speak with him at great length about the book..(written by Curt Gentry) and his many adventures into the Superstitions. I also brought to his attention that I had spent much time following up on some of the things in the book...and disproved some of the things written. He of course shook his head and laughed that a female as myself had taken the time to do this. I also found out where the actual map that Jacob Waltz had sketched out was.
I had geological surveys from U of A Tucson showing how earth has shifted over the years...
I do believe that it is there...right under our noses and when the time is right someone will find it..if they take the time to follow up on all the leads.
Also...there is a map in the above mentioned book....hold it up to a mirror and start calculating the earths movement over time.......Vende Vidi Vici....

 

[Blindbowman]

now your where the rest of us were 30 years ago ...lol




good to see back DE

 

[JackH]

Oh boy..here I go I have studied and followed every piece of information on Jacob Waltz for many years. I have read every book you can think of and been intrigued about this legend since I was about 6.
In the 80's I read a book called " The Killer Mountains", the true story of an Oklahoma City
PI who was hired to disprove that this ever existed. Well in the process he not only proved that it did indeed exist but in time got together a few very close friends and his Cibola Mining Company was formed and went into the Superstitions in search.
The PI's name was Glen Magill and I had the opportunity to meet and speak with him at great length about the book..(written by Curt Gentry) and his many adventures into the Superstitions. I also brought to his attention that I had spent much time following up on some of the things in the book...and disproved some of the things written. He of course shook his head and laughed that a female as myself had taken the time to do this. I also found out where the actual map that Jacob Waltz had sketched out was.
I had geological surveys from U of A Tucson showing how earth has shifted over the years...
I do believe that it is there...right under our noses and when the time is right someone will find it..if they take the time to follow up on all the leads.
Also...there is a map in the above mentioned book....hold it up to a mirror and start calculating the earths movement over time.......Vende Vidi Vici....

Welcome Desertstar12,

.......JackH

 

[Oroblanco]

WELCOME TO TREASURENET desertstar12!

Thank you for posting! We look forward to reading more.
Oroblanco

 

[Twisted Fork]

DTPost - interesting theory! I look forward to reading more, if you would care to expound? Thank you in advance,
Oroblanco

Sorry to be silent for so long Oroblanco. A book no longer in print; "Faded Footprints" by Gale Rhoades and Carry Boren is the source I first encountered. 30 some odd years later and after many miles on the trail here in the Uinta Mountains and West Deserts of Utah have confirmed a great deal in my thoughts, of the reality that the Jesuits and company were surely here early on. There are carvings along some of the roads and farther in, that are folded over 6 inches deep into the bark of ancient pine trees; trees that would take 3 or more people holding hands in order to circle around the diameter of them. Some are easily over 400 years old. I have tried over and over to take pictures of them along the Lightening Ridge sections and even with different cameras have yet been able to do so as they always turn out black or blank; I know why myself but I will leave the rest up to the imagination of the reader at hand here. One gets a feeling that the Dons walked away from these places only yesterday.

Enclosed is a Master Map that can be inverted and or turned and viewed at right angles, depending on which mining site one is visiting along the endless train of mine sites along the trail from Mexico and beyond. Hope you like this one.........Twisted

 

[cactusjumper]

DTPost - interesting theory! I look forward to reading more, if you would care to expound? Thank you in advance,
Oroblanco

Sorry to be silent for so long Oroblanco. A book no longer in print; "Faded Footprints" by Gale Rhoades and Carry Boren is the source I first encountered. 30 some odd years later and after many miles on the trail here in the Uinta Mountains and West Deserts of Utah have confirmed a great deal in my thoughts, of the reality that the Jesuits and company were surely here early on. There are carvings along some of the roads and farther in, that are folded over 6 inches deep into the bark of ancient pine trees; trees that would take 3 or more people holding hands in order to circle around the diameter of them. Some are easily over 400 years old. I have tried over and over to take pictures of them along the Lightening Ridge sections and even with different cameras have yet been able to do so as they always turn out black or blank; I know why myself but I will leave the rest up to the imagination of the reader at hand here. One gets a feeling that the Dons walked away from these places only yesterday.

Enclosed is a Master Map that can be inverted and or turned and viewed at right angles, depending on which mining site one is visiting along the endless train of mine sites along the trail from Mexico and beyond. Hope you like this one.........Twisted

Twisted,

"A book no longer in print; "Faded Footprints" by Gale Rhoades and Carry Boren is the source I first encountered."

Would it be safe to assume you meant "Footprints In The Wilderness: A History Of The Lost Rhoades Mines"? "Faded Footprints" was written by George Thompson and is readily available.

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Oroblanco]

Twisted Fork wrote

Sorry to be silent for so long Oroblanco.

No problems at my end - heck I was 'absent' from our forums here for around four months, so can't exactly complain if someone else does the same.
Roy

 

[Twisted Fork]

Right you are Joe; Brain fart on my part............

 

[Twisted Fork]

I tried to take a so called investor out to the location of where the mine can be found. A place I had visited and camped at many times before; even had a few pictures back in the day. When we arrived, the first thing I noticed about my favorite cactus where I would go to smoke, was now more than a quarter mile away from where it used to be only 150 feet from the trail and camp site. Okay, my first thought is that these guys I am with are some sort of trouble or their just not supposed to be there in the first place. The area is kind of sacred to the Apache and me as well per say. Some miners who worked in the area years ago had so many mechanical breakdowns with every sort of gear that they gave up more than once. It didn't happen in other mining sites they had tackled in the past so I was told.

To me, the tablets clearly lead straight to the area and once one is there they can easily see the same for themselves. That is why a wealthy and educated miner went out there with me in the first place. So the cactus was enough for me to ride out the day with a now rather confused gentleman who just wanted to make it back to some sign of civilization as I had now clammed up on clues followed by a lack of interest to point out anything else to him. Great fun all the way around. This place gets pounded by lighting whenever a thunderhead cloud rolls overhead. Seems like the Apache call it the place of the thunder gods as I recall.

Others have experienced a variety of unexplainable events with ghosts appearing and all of that good stuff too. Nobody will ever cause me to see otherwise about this place along the Salt, in the Tontos where I found my first treasure there, A burro shoe; I figure either from the Dutchy or perhaps from one of the Peraltas. Just below the mine where there is sand, water and grass enough for a large string of hobbled burros or just one at that.

 

[Oroblanco]

Twisted Fork wrote

the first thing I noticed about my favorite cactus where I would go to smoke, was now more than a quarter mile away from where it used to be only 150 feet from the trail and camp site

Are you saying that you think someone moved the cactus? Thank you in advance,
Oroblanco

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Actually oro that would depend upon what you were smoking no? snicker

apol twisted fork, I couldn't resist and no slight intended to your post, just bugging oro.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[Twisted Fork]

I would love to think of it as just the heat or bad chicken the night before but it wasn't. This area has long since convinced me that there is an existence waiting for us beyond the life we know today as we dwell in the flesh. I get the firm impression that any number of spirits still reside in these kinds of atmospheres; whether they were drummed up by Spanish witches or Indian Shamans of old. Perhaps as demonic guardians or even the result of Apache curses that have captured and bound the dead who once walk the grounds in armor. Long story short, they are real and are out there stranded without sleep for possibly centuries and will do so until time ends. Draws up a scenario of madness that one of us might share for the moments one passes in their presence; intentions may help or hinder the hunter here, as he looks through the eyes of one deceased; one who gazed upon and held the gold of the thunder gods until his untimely death.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

I don't know, Jose,

It seems like the older I get, the farther away EVERYthing seems to be - even my own feet!!! (I must be getting taller, because I used to be able to touch my toes with my fingers, and now I can only reach my ankles)


Beth

 

[Oroblanco]

Some new information has recently come to light, posted on another forum but may be of interest to those who follow this topic. Garry Cundiff interviewed the surviving daughter of Tumlinson, Jane, and rather than tell his story I will post an extract:

The short version of the story is that we were told by the family members with whom we spoke, that Travis Tumlinson carved the stone maps.

From http://www.thelostdutchmangoldmine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1435

There are conflicting reports from the same source, however Garry also posted photos of some other stones carved by Travis Tumlinson including one with a Spanish galleon and '1535' date; it is in my opinion a bit too much to be coincidence that Travis just happened to have a hobby of carving Spanish treasure oriented stones, then finds a set of stone maps. Anyway I suggest you read the full thread if you are interested in the Peralta stones, and make your own conclusions.

Good luck and good hunting amigos, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
Oroblanco

 

[gollum]

Gee Roy,

You talk about Garry Cundiff and all his findings, but I am only "conflicting reports"? I believe that some bias is peeking out?

The "conflicting reports" that Roy is talking about is ME. I also spoke with Janie Tumlinson less than two months ago, and this is a short excerpt of our conversation:

[You]
Report · 1:15am
Absolutely. There are a lot of people that claim that the stone maps are a hoax and your father was part of it. I have always said that a person's actions speak volumes, and your father's actions were not those of someone perpetrating a hoax, after all, he kept their existence mostly a secret from 1949 until he passed away in 1961.

[Janie Tumlinson *********]
Report · 1:17am
you're right he wasn't perpetrating a hoax and he did keep their existence pretty much a secret all that time.

Take from our conversations what you will. Janie has not answered my request for clarification and Garry says that he does not intend to try and contact her again. I firmly believe that she told Garry exactly what he said she told him, and I KNOW what she told me.

Mike

 

[Oroblanco]

No offense intended Mike, and the conflicting reports are from Jane, not you personally. I mentioned Garry since that is his thread, where he has shared the results of his research.

As for a bias, what should we make of the coincidental Tumlinson stone carvings, with the same subject matter and similar style? Is that what you view it as, purely coincidental? It seems beyond coincidence to me. Thank you in advance,
Roy