Oak Island the Strange, the Bizarre, and Maybe the "Truth!

[tinpan]

There is no riddle, it has been proven that the Portuguese brought coconuts to the so-called New World in 1499: Not Templars or Swallows.

Cheers, Loki

Sorry which migration to the Americas . Well fancy coconuts landing on the Pacific side of South America only a few hundred miles from the narrow land bridge near where the Panama is located . Sure was not European TP

 

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[SSR]

If coconut fiber came to NS early then there must have been a need for dunnage material. What exactly do some of you think was so fragile that it was packed securely with huge amounts of coir on the way to the New World and/or back to Europe? In all likelihood we should not expect anything like this to have occurred before the maritime trade in fragile wares. Early 19th century is fine with me. That is statistically consistent with dating the degraded environmentally exposed fiber to ca.1400 +/- 600 years. That seems reasonable for this sort of dating material in that environment.

 

[lokiblossom]

If coconut fiber came to NS early then there must have been a need for dunnage material. What exactly do some of you think was so fragile that it was packed securely with huge amounts of coir on the way to the New World and/or back to Europe? In all likelihood we should not expect anything like this to have occurred before the maritime trade in fragile wares. Early 19th century is fine with me. That is statistically consistent with dating the degraded environmentally exposed fiber to ca.1400 +/- 600 years. That seems reasonable for this sort of dating material in that environment.

The test I mostly quote is one by Beta Analytic which claims a dating of between 1178-1374 with a 95% of accuracy. Most of the other tests were in the 1200 range with a +or- factor of 70 years.
Coconut fibre as coir was mostly used for ships rigging, but also for cargo packing in the Eastern Mediterranean by Arab traders during that period!
On Oak Island, there was never as much of the material as some have reported.

Cheers, Loki

 

[n2mini]

Nobody knows how much Coconut fibre was there. I've never read where anyone really claims to say how much was there other then to say alot. Enough to cover an unspecified area that they claim was the finger drains while others claim it was used to dry sea water for the salt..Whether that is a 2 bushels or 2000 bushels who knows...

 

[tinpan]

The test I mostly quote is one by Beta Analytic which claims a dating of between 1178-1374 with a 95% of accuracy. Most of the other tests were in the 1200 range with a +or- factor of 70 years.
Coconut fibre as coir was mostly used for ships rigging, but also for cargo packing in the Eastern Mediterranean by Arab traders during that period!
On Oak Island, there was never as much of the material as some have reported.

Cheers, Loki

Hi Again which species of coconut ? Then primary coir which type .At no time in any so called evidence or proof have ever used correct botanical names . Also the Templars trade coir the Arabs . Which Arabs .This can please answer questions without the child like manner .TP

 

[tinpan]

Hi coconut are native to Australia and the living ancient culture goes back 65,000 years you know than them do you Loki ? Tp

 

[ECS]

...
On Oak Island, there was never as much of the material as some have reported.

nor were there Templars as some have claimed.

 

[franklin]

nor were there Templars as some have claimed.

ECS, I am just as positive that the Templars were on Oak Island as you are believing they were not on Oak Island. Neither of us has any solid proof. All though I believe there is more in favor of the Templars being there than there are the Templars not being there.

 

[ECS]

ECS, I am just as positive that the Templars were on Oak Island as you are believing they were not on Oak Island. Neither of us has any solid proof. All though I believe there is more in favor of the Templars being there than there are the Templars not being there.

Franklin, so far, no one has produced any real solid hard evidence that can prove that the Templars or Henry Sinclair ever landed on Oak Island or Nova Scotia.
With that total lack of "solid proof" and non acceptance by the professional lettered academic historians, the logical conclusion, not based on "belief", is the Templars NOT being there.

 

[lokiblossom]

Nobody knows how much Coconut fibre was there. I've never read where anyone really claims to say how much was there other then to say alot. Enough to cover an unspecified area that they claim was the finger drains while others claim it was used to dry sea water for the salt..Whether that is a 2 bushels or 2000 bushels who knows...

Several years ago I was a member of the old UK Oak Island Forum and the amount of coconut fibre mentioned during discussions was usually rather small. The museum director would have allowed me a little to have tested at the time (which I didn't take him up on). In the coconut fibre datings and test reports it was always a small amount given judiciously to the various labs, a couple of times reported as too small an amount to test. I have never read an actual report that claims there was an abundance of the material. Only in some of the older theories (finger drains, ect.) are some larger amounts mentioned. As for the actual amount, I agree there is no accurate assessment.
A smaller amount of the fibre does give credence to the premises of lines (ropes) and riggings as well as some packings for sailing vessels with the datings a time period of the 13th to 14th century.

Cheers, Loki

 

[franklin]

Several years ago I was a member of the old UK Oak Island Forum and the amount of coconut fibre mentioned during discussions was usually rather small. The museum director would have allowed me a little to have tested at the time (which I didn't take him up on). In the coconut fibre datings and test reports it was always a small amount given judiciously to the various labs, a couple of times reported as too small an amount to test. I have never read an actual report that claims there was an abundance of the material. Only in some of the older theories (finger drains, ect.) are some larger amounts mentioned. As for the actual amount, I agree there is no accurate assessment.
A smaller amount of the fibre does give credence to the premises of lines (ropes) and riggings as well as some packings for sailing vessels with the datings a time period of the 13th to 14th century.

Cheers, Loki

Sir Henry Sinclair made four voyages to Nova Scotia. His father and his father before him made numerous trips. The last of the Knight's Templar from France sixty in number were brought over by Sir Henry Sinclair in 1395. Six were drown in Mahone Bay. Most went inland to the mountains in New Hampshire, New York and Vermont. A large group went West to Wyoming, Utah, New Mexico and Arizona. It is going to be fact as soon as it is all checked out. I have already performed all of the research. I have found 7 of the 8 markers where they left a large portion of their treasures that was carried on 8 ships in the 17th Century. A recovery of either one of the treasure is going to verify the story. May not change academics minds or history books but really who cares.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Or not. More likely not.

 

[ECS]

"Henry Sinclair, an Earl of Orkney of the late fourteenth century, didn't go to America"
-Brian Smith, NEW ORKNEY ANTIQUARIAN JOURNAL, Vol 2,2002


www.alastairhamilton.com/sinclair.htm

Academics will not change their minds because the Sinclair voyages NEVER happened.
"The story is a modern myth, based on careless reading, wishful thinking and sometimes distortions, and during the past five years or so it has taken new outrageous forms"-Brian Smith
With the recent books about Sinclair and the Templars in Nova Scotia, and the "alleged" Henry Sinclair Journals by Diana Jean Muir, the Sinclair myth continues to grow in "outrageous forms", based on nothing more than creative imagination.

One may claim to have to have performed all the research, but how does one perform research on something that NEVER happened?
How can this "modern myth" be checked out and verified when the "treasure" is found when there is NO documented evidence of a Sinclair or Templar voyage to Oak Island/Nova Scotia?
Of course, it will never will, but the wishful thinking and distorted pseudo history will continue as long as gullible believers in "hidden history" by the fabrications of the leagued of pulp quasi-historians for profit, and ignore the professional history academics who have conducted real hard research with documents that still exist and have been reviewed by their peers for verification.
Diana Jean Muir, the current perpetrator on the Sinclair myth, claimed she destroyed the "original" copies of the alleged previous copied Sinclair Journals, no examination or review, or even if these "originals" actually existed except for her word.
It is no wonder why the professional academic community doesn't accept these Sinclair Journals as authentic history.

 

[Al D]

Sir Henry Sinclair made four voyages to Nova Scotia. His father and his father before him made numerous trips. The last of the Knight's Templar from France sixty in number were brought over by Sir Henry Sinclair in 1395. Six were drown in Mahone Bay. Most went inland to the mountains in New Hampshire, New York and Vermont. A large group went West to Wyoming, Utah, New Mexico and Arizona. It is going to be fact as soon as it is all checked out. I have already performed all of the research. I have found 7 of the 8 markers where they left a large portion of their treasures that was carried on 8 ships in the 17th Century. A recovery of either one of the treasure is going to verify the story. May not change academics minds or history books but really who cares.

You got one thing right about your ridiculous story, who cares ?

 

[ECS]

Sir Henry Sinclair made four voyages to Nova Scotia. His father and his father before him made numerous trips...
I have already performed all of the research...

Please cite the source of all of the research performed that prove that Sir Henry Sinclair made these voyages and are not just a "modern myth".
*NOTE* Diana Jean Muir is not considered a legitimate source.

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

And I bet a beer that "seven of the eight markers" which have been found are in some devious code.

 

[franklin]

And I bet a beer that "seven of the eight markers" which have been found are in some devious code.

No you would be wrong. The "Markers have a small amount of treasure at each one and they are buried about six feet deep. There are direction markers with a bored hole to find the next location by sunlight to go to etc etc."

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Easy way to prove that.

 

[franklin]

Yes sir. Some day but not today.

 

[ECS]

... The last of the Knight's Templar from France sixty in number were brought over by Sir Henry Sinclair in 1395...
A large group went West to Wyoming, Utah, New Mexico and Arizona. It is going to be fact as soon as it is all checked out...

Was that the Knights Templar Black Horse Patrol that traveled the West leaving four sided stone markers because they ran out of coir during the long journey across America?
Legend is that a modern day Shriner group adopted that name as homage of those brave Templars.