The "Peralta" Stone Maps --- On Their Own

[Cubfan64]

Latin heart = legitimate artifacts in the museum.

So if I understand you correctly, you're saying the Latin Heart is a legitimate artifact and the SMHS museum holds the original? As far as I'm aware, the original Latin Heart (described as being a black stone - basalt or slate) was destroyed by Bill Hidden years ago - all that survived was a rubbing or drawing or something which replicas were made from but I could be wrong

 

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[starman 1]

Hello Old,

Thanks for your response and it has been helpful.

It seems your position is that the Stone Maps are a modern creation and are based on older maps and a group of stones. The Stone Maps are just part and parcel of a larger map system and only contain at best a partial solution. Also you seem to be saying Travis created the heart insert.

You also contend that the Latin Heart is a modern creation and who really knows where it came from. it seems the information on the Latin Heart which is in old latin is of no importance or the fact that the trail map has room for both the heart insert and the latin heart is well not an issue.

It seems we can agree on one thing that is neither Travis or Charley Miller had the background to create the Latin Heart. Well who then did it? That seems an interesting mystery. The likely suspect is Travis. He had the skill set to create the Latin Heart, the time, and historical information that would allow him to create it.

If he did create it then it is likely he did not understand it but understood that it had some importance to the Trail Maps. And that significance is what is really at the bottom of this.

So what is the significance? Mr. Hatt through his years in the mountains and exploration believed, "that the Peralta Stone Maps, the Latin Heart, and the Stone Crosses were all manufactured by the same person or group of persons and that what they each depict applies to the same area". Page 16, The Peralta Stone Maps, author: Jim Hatt.

This obviously supports the position that the information on the Trail Maps and the Latin Heart is real and more importantly works together to find the final solution. It seems clear, at least to me, for many reasons the information on the Trail Maps and Latin Heart is in fact real and whether they were both created by Travis from historical documents or they were found is of little importance. What is important is that they work. And also it is important to understand the significance of Greek Symbology on one of the maps Travis had. The question is why?

The why tells us this. The Latin Heart speaks from a time of about 900 A.D. The Trail Maps much much older. The map with Greek Symbols much older. Together they paint a picture that the mystery of all of this is far, far deeper than Travis, a lot deeper. Deeper than the Church. And if you do not look far far back in time the answer you find will only close gates not open them.

Let`s see. In terms of Charley Miller there is a body of evidence that he found the Latin Heart. By the way do you know who Charley Miller really is? Not sure who Rhodes Wilson is perhaps you can share. I have seen nothing to suggest this person found the Latin Heart.

As far as where the copy of the Latin Heart comes from that was in the public view who knows. We have the testimony of Jim Hatt, and we know who was making stones in Texas. In terms of who to believe my money would be on Hatt, given that Kollenburn told several folks the stone maps were created by a stone cutter he knew in Arizona. Believe Mr. Ribaudo can give you information on that.

If the copy came from Texas there are several suspects, one that I personally knew that knew the Tumlinson`s well believed the maps were all about something that was quite ancient. In fact he searched for it for several years. If memory serves it seems he spent his time on Tortilla Mountain.

To conclude to dismiss the Latin Heart is to dismiss the stone maps because they are part of the same system of information that leads one to the truth.

Good luck

Starman

 

[Old]

Here's the text from J. Hatt's words...........

I asked Al about it, and he began telling me the history of the Latin Heart as he knew it. He told me he had learned from Charlie Miller exactly where Tumlinson had found the stone maps and that several other people also knew about that location. According to Al, one of them went back to the spot years after Tumlinson gave up on finding any more stone map pieces, and that person, being a little more persistent and searching a wider area than Tumlinson had, found the Latin Heart lying right on top of the ground.
Al may have mentioned his name, or maybe not, if he did I can no longer recall it.

Analyzing this, a couple of things jump out. According to Hatt, Hatt didn't become interested in the LH until 1990. That book ends our time period from 1950 - 1990. Charlie Miller is the source of Al's story but Miller is not the finder of the LH.

Hatt relates that Al "may" have told him who found it but if so, he (Hatt) couldn't recall the name........ Hatt didn't have any problem recalling Miller as the source of Al's story so.......that's not the name he "could have" forgotten. The who is "one of the several other people ".....who also knew about the location. That's who found it. Not Miller according to Miller's rendition.

Now; just who is this other mystery person whose name can not be remembered That's what I'm trying to telling you. If it is anyone closely related, its Rhodes Wilson. According to Al's story Miller and this mystery person had the LH for a long period of time before it came to Al's attention who then related the story to Hatt; and much later than the "recovery of the duplicate" from Texas. Book ends of time period moves from 1950 -1975. Also Wilson's himself was originally and his family still were, from Texas. A convenient tie back to TK's trip to retrieve a "copy".

The burning question in all of this is when did Wilson supposedly return to the site and recover the LH? Al tells us years after Travis gave up looking for more stones but doesn't mention anything about his death. Time book ends move to about 1952-1960; assuming Miller accurately related a true story to Al who then accurately related the story to Hatt.

I can track Travis' explorations (in which Wilson and Miller) were heavily involved through about 1958. I can tell you with a high level of certainty that Travis knew nothing about a LH or Stone Crosses. If Travis had heard about a discovery during his life time he would have written about it and made inquiries. There are none found. There are several inquiries of a different nature but none that allude to the LH or SCs. He knew these men well. Traveled with them often.

The only conclusion I can draw, based on what I know to be true, is that the LH surfaced (at least publicly) after Travis' death. He's not the source of the LH. I'd bet the ranch he never laid eyes on it. There is a whole host of suspects that come into play after Travis death. Pick any number of them. Some of them, as I alluded to earlier, put out rewards for additional stones. Was the stone made for this purpose

So......that gets us back to our original dilemma. Which came first. The large stones or the small grey ones. The small grey ones eliminate the possibility of authenticity of the LH and the SCs as part and parcel of the same puzzle.

I know what I've seen and I know what I've been told. My money is on the small grey ones. Your mileage may vary.

lyn

 

[somehiker]

So if I understand you correctly, you're saying the Latin Heart is a legitimate artifact and the SMHS museum holds the original? As far as I'm aware, the original Latin Heart (described as being a black stone - basalt or slate) was destroyed by Bill Hidden years ago - all that survived was a rubbing or drawing or something which replicas were made from but I could be wrong

Hi Paul:
I presume the poster is referring to the set of replica Crosses and Latin Heart made by Jim H. , which the SMM has in it's collection.
During my visits with Jim, we had discussed the three stones and what Jim knew about their history, as well as how each of us thought they could fit possible scenarios.
Jim had gifted me his last set of replica crosses, from where they hung on the wall above his computer monitors. He also made sure I was well equipped and supplied for each of my own forays into the mountains on subsequent days, refusing to accept any payment offers for anything I used, including frozen bottles of water from his freezer chest or favoured energy snacks and drinks. I stayed at his place for a couple of hours after that last hike we were all together on, which was the last time you and I had the last chance to talk to him face-face, during which he shared a few things about the stones which I had never seen or read anywhere, even to this day, as well as the who's and the what's as to why he had been so upset about the early investigations into Jesse Capen's disappearance. Frankly, I would have lost my cool as well, and DID while reading some of the posts on this forum by those who tried to implicate him.....mainly out of spite IMO.....even though I am not as quick to anger as he was. If you recall the weekend where you failed to show at the Rendezvous that Friday night, and our conversation about it afterwards, I'm sure you will understand.

 

[Matthew Roberts]

Old, Cubfan, somehiker,

Old is correct, Travis Tumlinson could not have seen or known of the Stone Crosses because they were discovered after his death.

Travis Tumlinson "may" have known about the Latin Heart because it was discovered about the time he passed away in the early 1960's. He never mentioned the Latin Heart so it appears he was unaware of its existence.

Both the original Stone Crosses and the Latin Heart are gone, destroyed. We know what they look like because of an early photograph of the Stone Crosses and a paper copying of both sides of the Latin Heart.

Al Reser came out and stayed at my ranch at New River on several occasions. He would drive out from Apache Junction, stay for dinner and sleep overnight in the bunkhouse. He would stay up late into the night sitting out on the porch of the bunkhouse telling stories of his times in the mountains. I have him on tape telling many of his stories and accounts. I have him on tape telling the Latin Heart story. He tells of Charley Miller's account but does not mention Rhodes Wilson as the finder of the Latin Heart. Also, Bill Holden had nothing to do with either the Stone Crosses or Latin Heart. That was started by a man who made up several stories and passed them around the Dutchman community to try and see who would pass on the gossip. Hatt and this man were friends and Hatt helped him spread a few of the stories.

Al knew Charley Miller very well. Al lived on Lawson drive in Apache Junction just south of Broadway and Miller lived in a trailer court not far from Al. It was Miller who had the Latin Heart and destroyed it. After Al died I went to Miller's place to let him know Al had passed away and ask him some questions I had but the manager there said he had moved out and left no forwarding address. Al had an address book with Miller's information but the lady that came and cleaned up Al's place threw out everything that wasn't of value to her. That was the last I knew of Miller.



Al Reser at the ranch in New River

 

[Cubfan64]

Old, Cubfan, somehiker,

Old is correct, Travis Tumlinson could not have seen or known of the Stone Crosses because they were discovered after his death.

Travis Tumlinson "may" have known about the Latin Heart because it was discovered about the time he passed away in the early 1960's. He never mentioned the Latin Heart so it appears he was unaware of its existence.

Both the original Stone Crosses and the Latin Heart are gone, destroyed. We know what they look like because of an early photograph of the Stone Crosses and a paper copying of both sides of the Latin Heart.

Al Reser came out and stayed at my ranch at New River on several occasions. He would drive out from Apache Junction, stay for dinner and sleep overnight in the bunkhouse. He would stay up late into the night sitting out on the porch of the bunkhouse telling stories of his times in the mountains. I have him on tape telling many of his stories and accounts. I have him on tape telling the Latin Heart story. He tells of Charley Miller's account but does not mention Rhodes Wilson as the finder of the Latin Heart. Also, Bill Holden had nothing to do with either the Stone Crosses or Latin Heart. That was started by a man who made up several stories and passed them around the Dutchman community to try and see who would pass on the gossip. Hatt and this man were friends and Hatt helped him spread a few of the stories.

Al knew Charley Miller very well. Al lived on Lawson drive in Apache Junction just south of Broadway and Miller lived in a trailer court not far from Al. It was Miller who had the Latin Heart and destroyed it. After Al died I went to Miller's place to let him know Al had passed away and ask him some questions I had but the manager there said he had moved out and left no forwarding address. Al had an address book with Miller's information but the lady that came and cleaned up Al's place threw out everything that wasn't of value to her. That was the last I knew of Miller.

View attachment 1610531

Al Reser at the ranch in New River

Thanks for the correction on who destroyed the latin heart and why Bill Hidden's name came up. I understand the desire to spread gossip to try to figure out who you can trust or who can't keep their mouth closed, but over time that sort of thing gets all missed up and people (like me in this case) take one of those stories and think it was the honest truth. No wonder hunting for treasures is such a mess

 

[motel6.5]

Does anyone have a guess ? why the Latin-Heart was designed to be removeable..Might their have been a other item underneath the heart, or could the heart have fitted into a niche on a other stone to further identify a location.

 

[Lucky Baldwin]

.....
That is the information on the Latin Heart is not modern Latin, it is a Latin that was prevalent about 900 A.D.
.....

How do you know this?

 

[OldManOfTheRiver]

Because it's just common sense to destroy the original and then make copies. Way too convenient. How about this. They are demonstrably fake.

If YOU had an original copy of the Declaration of Independence would you shred it and then forge a new one. Talk about circular logic. Sheesh.

 

[Cubfan64]

Starman 1 - in one of your recent posts you stated...

...By the way do you know who Charley Miller really is?...

Other than hearing the name associated with the finding of the Latin Heart, can you shed light on who Charley Miller is?

 

[starman 1]

Hello Old,

Perhaps we can agree on one thing and that is if Travis created the trail maps and heart insert his role was much the same as a production worker on an assembly line building an automobile. He simply put the parts together and his knowledge of the car is that of an assembler not that of a creator. He maybe curious and extend his efforts to understanding. Is an assembler a creator, maybe in a limited sense but only in a limited sense. I have to say I use that word without a lot of precision in my previous posts so hopefully when I refer to Travis as a creator I will be understood.

So from your perspective the trail maps are in their ground a star map. A map that is advanced yet relies on small stones and other maps for their authenticity. So it must follow that the small stones are star maps too and cover a wider scope and even more sophisticated. So who were the folks who had the sophistication to create such things? Perhaps the same folks that were sophisticated enough to create the Latin Heart using a language that was common around 900 A.D. Folks that were sophisticated enough to create an insert that would fit into the trail map. And I might add they did so in such a way that the Latin Heart works with the Trail Maps to identify locations in the range. Do you really believe folks capable of doing this were even interested in getting money for their creation? Furthermore such folks would have a detailed knowledge of the range. A knowledge that Travis simply did not have.

it seems the folks who created the Latin Heart had far more in common with folks creating star charts than you suspect. And of course if they were the same people maybe even their descendants possess such knowledge and much more. And you can bet they knew the information you have would never lead you to anything because your information is incomplete. The only question is then did they create the Latin Heart to confuse even further or was it created to actually lead to the truth. Believe what you will but they lead to the truth with the trail maps.

You see in a sense you are right the Latin Heart is not a part of the project as you have defined it, because you only see the project from the perspective of an auto assembler that sees a head light that he is adding to a car, the car is the final product not the headlight and that is all Travis thought this was about. Nope this is about the stars and that mystery is far greater than what you folks are into. Your star chart is about a galaxy not just the neighborhood.

And it really matters little which came first the small stones or the trail maps and the Latin heart they are all about the same things. And who knows maybe one was created on Monday and the other on Tuesday, and why?, well they all work together. And yet with all this Mr. Ribaudo`s solution is correct. How does that fit into your understanding?

Good luck and thanks for your help in understanding where your folks are at.

Starman

Hello Mr. Baldwin,

Good question about the Latin Heart. If this subject interests you take the time to read Jim Hatt`s small work dealing with the Stone Maps, titled "The Peralta Stone Maps", his statement regarding that the creator of the Latin Heart was familiar with celestial navigation is of particular importance and dovetails with Old`s assertion the trail maps are a star chart. Hopefully I am saying that correctly. Really the best way to deal with this is simply take the Latin Heart copies and compare the language to ancient texts and see what you find. Who knows maybe you will have a completely different understanding. If you are very brave take the time to familiarize yourself with Bob Ward`s work, "Ripples of Lost Echo`s". That work will make your head spin but never less a lot of fun.

Hello Old Man.

Good luck on your upcoming adventure in the Superstitions. Believe the location you mentioned should be fruitful. A bit away from where you will be is Horse Mesa where Sims Ely remarked he had the best day of his dutch Hunting experience and where Robinson believed Ely found the Lost Dutchman. Who really knows.

Not sure if the fact the Latin Heart is no longer available proves it is fake. If the original of the Declaration of Independence had been lost in say a fire would that provide copies were not accurately reflecting the original? If the Latin Heart is fake perhaps the trail maps are also. That would be bit odd since some folks do agree they work together to identify locations in the range. Perhaps they are in a sense fake and real at the same time. Maybe it just depends on the user as to what they mean.

I noticed you are from either Tenn. or Ga. Since you are looking for the Lost Dutchman I assume you are a Georgia Tech fan and use to failure. Well with Paul Robinson as coach imagine we will win games we should not. Also have you spent time in N. Georgia looking for gold? Spent a lot of my misspent youth placer mining on the Etowah River north of Atlanta. A lot of fun. If you are interested in Jacob Waltzer spend some time researching the Battle Branch Mine on the Etowah River and some time in the records at the museum in Dahlonega.

Starman

Hello Cub Fan,

Good question, have to say I gave my word to someone I would not reveal the answer to that question. If he chooses to do so fine, or he may pm you with his name. His call. Fine person.


Starman

 

[cactusjumper]

Hello Old,

Perhaps we can agree on one thing and that is if Travis created the trail maps and heart insert his role was much the same as a production worker on an assembly line building an automobile. He simply put the parts together and his knowledge of the car is that of an assembler not that of a creator. He maybe curious and extend his efforts to understanding. Is an assembler a creator, maybe in a limited sense but only in a limited sense. I have to say I use that word without a lot of precision in my previous posts so hopefully when I refer to Travis as a creator I will be understood.

So from your perspective the trail maps are in their ground a star map. A map that is advanced yet relies on small stones and other maps for their authenticity. So it must follow that the small stones are star maps too and cover a wider scope and even more sophisticated. So who were the folks who had the sophistication to create such things? Perhaps the same folks that were sophisticated enough to create the Latin Heart using a language that was common around 900 A.D. Folks that were sophisticated enough to create an insert that would fit into the trail map. And I might add they did so in such a way that the Latin Heart works with the Trail Maps to identify locations in the range. Do you really believe folks capable of doing this were even interested in getting money for their creation? Furthermore such folks would have a detailed knowledge of the range. A knowledge that Travis simply did not have.

it seems the folks who created the Latin Heart had far more in common with folks creating star charts than you suspect. And of course if they were the same people maybe even their descendants possess such knowledge and much more. And you can bet they knew the information you have would never lead you to anything because your information is incomplete. The only question is then did they create the Latin Heart to confuse even further or was it created to actually lead to the truth. Believe what you will but they lead to the truth with the trail maps.

You see in a sense you are right the Latin Heart is not a part of the project as you have defined it, because you only see the project from the perspective of an auto assembler that sees a head light that he is adding to a car, the car is the final product not the headlight and that is all Travis thought this was about. Nope this is about the stars and that mystery is far greater than what you folks are into. Your star chart is about a galaxy not just the neighborhood.

And it really matters little which came first the small stones or the trail maps and the Latin heart they are all about the same things. And who knows maybe one was created on Monday and the other on Tuesday, and why?, well they all work together. And yet with all this Mr. Ribaudo`s solution is correct. How does that fit into your understanding?

Good luck and thanks for your help in understanding where your folks are at.

Starman

Hello Mr. Baldwin,

Good question about the Latin Heart. If this subject interests you take the time to read Jim Hatt`s small work dealing with the Stone Maps, titled "The Peralta Stone Maps", his statement regarding that the creator of the Latin Heart was familiar with celestial navigation is of particular importance and dovetails with Old`s assertion the trail maps are a star chart. Hopefully I am saying that correctly. Really the best way to deal with this is simply take the Latin Heart copies and compare the language to ancient texts and see what you find. Who knows maybe you will have a completely different understanding. If you are very brave take the time to familiarize yourself with Bob Ward`s work, "Ripples of Lost Echo`s". That work will make your head spin but never less a lot of fun.

Hello Old Man.

Good luck on your upcoming adventure in the Superstitions. Believe the location you mentioned should be fruitful. A bit away from where you will be is Horse Mesa where Sims Ely remarked he had the best day of his dutch Hunting experience and where Robinson believed Ely found the Lost Dutchman. Who really knows.

Not sure if the fact the Latin Heart is no longer available proves it is fake. If the original of the Declaration of Independence had been lost in say a fire would that provide copies were not accurately reflecting the original? If the Latin Heart is fake perhaps the trail maps are also. That would be bit odd since some folks do agree they work together to identify locations in the range. Perhaps they are in a sense fake and real at the same time. Maybe it just depends on the user as to what they mean.

I noticed you are from either Tenn. or Ga. Since you are looking for the Lost Dutchman I assume you are a Georgia Tech fan and use to failure. Well with Paul Robinson as coach imagine we will win games we should not. Also have you spent time in N. Georgia looking for gold? Spent a lot of my misspent youth placer mining on the Etowah River north of Atlanta. A lot of fun. If you are interested in Jacob Waltzer spend some time researching the Battle Branch Mine on the Etowah River and some time in the records at the museum in Dahlonega.

Starman

Hello Cub Fan,

Good question, have to say I gave my word to someone I would not reveal the answer to that question. If he chooses to do so fine, or he may pm you with his name. His call. Fine person.


Starman

Starman,

I find it of passing interest that Mr. Hatt was, himself, familiar enough with "celestial navigation" to recognize that code on the Latin Heart. Was he the first Dutch Hunter to make that connection?

Take care,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Lucky Baldwin]

....
Is an assembler a creator,
....

An assembler knows how the parts go together, a creator knows why they do.

 

[OldManOfTheRiver]

Hello Old,


Hello Mr. Baldwin,

Good question about the Latin Heart. If this subject interests you take the time to read Jim Hatt`s small work dealing with the Stone Maps, titled "The Peralta Stone Maps", his statement regarding that the creator of the Latin Heart was familiar with celestial navigation is of particular importance and dovetails with Old`s assertion the trail maps are a star chart. Hopefully I am saying that correctly. Really the best way to deal with this is simply take the Latin Heart copies and compare the language to ancient texts and see what you find. Who knows maybe you will have a completely different understanding. If you are very brave take the time to familiarize yourself with Bob Ward`s work, "Ripples of Lost Echo`s". That work will make your head spin but never less a lot of fun.

Hello Old Man.

Good luck on your upcoming adventure in the Superstitions. Believe the location you mentioned should be fruitful. A bit away from where you will be is Horse Mesa where Sims Ely remarked he had the best day of his dutch Hunting experience and where Robinson believed Ely found the Lost Dutchman. Who really knows.

Not sure if the fact the Latin Heart is no longer available proves it is fake. If the original of the Declaration of Independence had been lost in say a fire would that provide copies were not accurately reflecting the original? If the Latin Heart is fake perhaps the trail maps are also. That would be bit odd since some folks do agree they work together to identify locations in the range. Perhaps they are in a sense fake and real at the same time. Maybe it just depends on the user as to what they mean.

I noticed you are from either Tenn. or Ga. Since you are looking for the Lost Dutchman I assume you are a Georgia Tech fan and use to failure. Well with Paul Robinson as coach imagine we will win games we should not. Also have you spent time in N. Georgia looking for gold? Spent a lot of my misspent youth placer mining on the Etowah River north of Atlanta. A lot of fun. If you are interested in Jacob Waltzer spend some time researching the Battle Branch Mine on the Etowah River and some time in the records at the museum in Dahlonega.

Starman

Hello Cub Fan,

Good question, have to say I gave my word to someone I would not reveal the answer to that question. If he chooses to do so fine, or he may pm you with his name. His call. Fine person.


Starman

Hello Starman,

I've played around all over these hills, especially in the Cohutta Wilderness Area concerning the Waterhouse Treasure. As a local with deep ties to the region I have access to entire valleys in the Cohutta that are privately owned. The Waterhouse Treasure is interesting in that they were gold dore bars complete with a Spanish bellows in a cave or mine that had been closed, however the directions were never given to the deposit and it mimics the Lost Dutchman to a certain extent as does the legend of the bus driver in or near Toccoa who was befriended by a Cherokee and taken to a cave of gold and allowed to get all he could carry. He was blindfolded in and out out of the area. These legends are thousands of miles apart yet so similar I consider them urban legends. Why are two stories from two different areas so similar?

I really enjoy finding Native American settlements and have found one of which I can give you a whole Yuchi town that was destroyed by the Cherokee up from Hiwassee Island at the prodding of South Carolina traders. The Yuchi are very interesting. A total linguistic outlier with just a handful of speakers today. The Yuchi were traders and at one time the dominant tribe in the area before the Cherokee moved in. Years of disease and assimilation into the Creek decimated the tribe. I found this town myself and unlike some here have no qualms sharing it. The Yuchi had model towns with circular houses, defensive pallisades and a raised ceremonial center. This particular town had been situated almost directly across the river from a Cherokee town for 100 years in peace. They traded but remained separate from the Cherokee. In 1714 every man, woman and child was killed. Many of them committed suicide in the town center to prevent being killed. The whole area is on a natural defensive peninsula bounded by a Euchee Creek. There are no markers or archaeological digs that have ever been done, save mine however the state of Tennessee did dig a Cherokee town close to this site at Candies Creek, however they attributed that town to the siege and were wrong! Heck I was just there yesterday on my ski boat. I've walked it numerous times. It has a raised 5 foot berm angled, over the area and the raised area of the religious center in the center of town is still visible in planted and now thinned pines. This is the stuff I like, and here is the town I found. I am kind proud of finding it too, and I've explored every cave in the cliffs for miles above and below the town in the hopes of finding something cool. My computer is messing up so I'll reboot it and post the Yuchi town location. I can't dig it myself because it doesn't feel right digging a site where 40 to 100 people committed suicide. It is really heartbreaking to go sit there and imagine their terror. But I found this town and am applying the same logic to the LDM. No matter what I find with respect to the LDM.

Here is the previously lost Yuchi Town of the Rabbit Clan, Chestowee Town , totally destroyed by Cherokee in 1714. Desoto had his way with the tribe first. The People of The Sun were doomed by the Spaniards and later Englishmen and the Cherokee. Those that did survive merged with the Creek and migrated to Florida.



Here is a bit on the Yuchi Tribe: https://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/yuchi-indians.htm

And here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuchi

And the GPS coordinates as promised: 35°13'33.72" N 84°40'59.65" W

 

[motel6.5]

There was a priest who used a device called a Astrolobe to chart distances useing the stars. He was educated in Europe and most likely well versed in Latin. Most of you have heard of him, Father Kino. Their aren"t really that many persons to pick who might have envisioned the Latin Heart/Crosses as a code to a cave of valuables. They had to be not just educated,but smart and cunning and in control without opposition.

 

[Lucky Baldwin]

Hello Starman,

I've played around all over these hills, especially in the Cohutta Wilderness Area concerning the Waterhouse Treasure. As a local with deep ties to the region I have access to entire valleys in the Cohutta that are privately owned. The Waterhouse Treasure is interesting in that they were gold dore bars complete with a Spanish bellows in a cave or mine that had been closed, however the directions were never given to the deposit and it mimics the Lost Dutchman to a certain extent as does the legend of the bus driver in or near Toccoa who was befriended by a Cherokee and taken to a cave of gold and allowed to get all he could carry. He was blindfolded in and out out of the area. These legends are thousands of miles apart yet so similar I consider them urban legends. Why are two stories from two different areas so similar?

I really enjoy finding Native American settlements and have found one of which I can give you a whole Yuchi town that was destroyed by the Cherokee up from Hiwassee Island at the prodding of South Carolina traders. The Yuchi are very interesting. A total linguistic outlier with just a handful of speakers today. The Yuchi were traders and at one time the dominant tribe in the area before the Cherokee moved in. Years of disease and assimilation into the Creek decimated the tribe. I found this town myself and unlike some here have no qualms sharing it. The Yuchi had model towns with circular houses, defensive pallisades and a raised ceremonial center. This particular town had been situated almost directly across the river from a Cherokee town for 100 years in peace. They traded but remained separate from the Cherokee. In 1714 every man, woman and child was killed. Many of them committed suicide in the town center to prevent being killed. The whole area is on a natural defensive peninsula bounded by a Euchee Creek. There are no markers or archaeological digs that have ever been done, save mine however the state of Tennessee did dig a Cherokee town close to this site at Candies Creek, however they attributed that town to the siege and were wrong! Heck I was just there yesterday on my ski boat. I've walked it numerous times. It has a raised 5 foot berm angled, over the area and the raised area of the religious center in the center of town is still visible in planted and now thinned pines. This is the stuff I like, and here is the town I found. I am kind proud of finding it too, and I've explored every cave in the cliffs for miles above and below the town in the hopes of finding something cool. My computer is messing up so I'll reboot it and post the Yuchi town location. I can't dig it myself because it doesn't feel right digging a site where 40 to 100 people committed suicide. It is really heartbreaking to go sit there and imagine their terror. But I found this town and am applying the same logic to the LDM. No matter what I find with respect to the LDM.

Here is the previously lost Yuchi Town of the Rabbit Clan, Chestowee Town , totally destroyed by Cherokee in 1714. Desoto had his way with the tribe first. The People of The Sun were doomed by the Spaniards and later Englishmen and the Cherokee. Those that did survive merged with the Creek and migrated to Florida.

View attachment 1610954

Here is a bit on the Yuchi Tribe: https://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/yuchi-indians.htm

And here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuchi

And the GPS coordinates as promised: 35°13'33.72" N 84°40'59.65" W

Very nice find! Gratz! And I tried to give you hiking advice... please forgive my ignorance.

 

[Cubfan64]

Hello Cub Fan,

Good question, have to say I gave my word to someone I would not reveal the answer to that question. If he chooses to do so fine, or he may pm you with his name. His call. Fine person.


Starman

Fair enough - I'll watch my PM's and hope to get a response. Can I assume the museum in Dhalonega, GA you're referring to is the Dahlonega Gold Museum and the records they have there?

 

[azdave35]

Fair enough - I'll watch my PM's and hope to get a response. Can I assume the museum in Dhalonega, GA you're referring to is the Dahlonega Gold Museum and the records they have there?

cubfan...everyone comes on here with what they claim is very important info but very private....in my opinion they don't know anything and are just looking for attention...why would a guy come on here spouting off about something if he cant prove it?...he is craving attention...15 seconds of fame maybe?

 

[OldManOfTheRiver]

Very nice find! Gratz! And I tried to give you hiking advice... please forgive my ignorance.

I don't think you are ignorant at all. Driving a ski boat and looking around low lands for earthworks is easy. Hiking through a dry prickly snake infested desert is another thing of itself. I need all the help I can get bro!

 

[OldManOfTheRiver]

cubfan...everyone comes on here with what they claim is very important info but very private....in my opinion they don't know anything and are just looking for attention...why would a guy come on here spouting off about something if he cant prove it?...he is craving attention...15 seconds of fame maybe?

Happens over and over.... Over again.