New site?...with different clue versions?

[wrmickel1]

The Horse and the Priest landmarks are so old as the mountain itself. Mother nature was in good mood when made these landmarks. Too big to be hand made.
A superstitious person would believe they were made by a God to mark a specific place. A place out of the reallity. Someone could only wonder by looking at them, and make him feel so small and so weak in front of this magnificence.

markmar

Agreed Sir. But made by Mother Nature 100% No.

Babymick1

 

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[Mc4500]

Hey, Wayne thanks for the information and input. As far as the book, I am not going to get into much on the stones, other than the information that is contained on them. The stones are a book in them selfs. I really find it interesting, but I am more interested in the info contained on them, which I will discuss in the book. But as far as Travis and RG and all that stuff, I am not going to get into, because it does not matter, and has nothing to do with the map value of the stones. (the parts that are valid). This has been my point, what we have found has nothing to do with TT and RG. As the saying goes " To close to the trees to see the forest". If finding something credible is the goal, then that information really on who did what is not so important to us. We have found a place that will shock a lot of folks I am sure, in fact just yesterday I made a significant discovery that again fits the stones. I know talk is cheap, and for now, It will have to stay so. My goal is not to be a dame expert on every dame thing related to the LDM (an expert on every little thing a master of none). My goal, in the beginning, was to have a plan for research that came at it from a different view. Surprise, it worked. Wayne what I am trying to say is that are book will be as accurate as possible from what we are doing, and finding and to put those facts out there sometime in the not too distant future. What I am saying is we will put out there what we have and documentation to go with it. To do that I will tell our journey (Arcana Exploration), and how it all evolved, It will be truthful, the bad and the best. I know we could find a stash of tools with Jacob Waltz marked on them and some folks still would not believe. So again the only thing I really would like to know is who did the original map info on the stones? WE may never know that? But I think that info is buried somewhere. So again I am not and have no need or interest in knowing every little contradicting tibit on the stones. What we have found had nothing to do with all that TT and RG stuff, it is useless and meaningless to us. I will lightly touch on the history of the stone in the book but will focus more on the info on them, and how it directly matches to the Alpha site. You know having the site for several years and having about 1400 HD photos of the whole site has allowed me to reverse engineer many things. What I found yesterday has had me puzzled for about a year, until a day or two ago, when I photoshopped a photo and blew it up, and found something. Howard and I had breakfast today at Bob Evans and I showed it to him. He smiled and shook his head and said make sure you save this for the book. Wayne, it was something on the Preist Stone that I thought was probably nothing, but again the PS actually is credible and actually does tell a story that is more complex than I originally thought but at the same time is not interpretive, but factual, and can be verified. To those who say the info on the stones is not crediable ( I am saying the map value info) they will have to go to rehab. Time for my 2am walk. Wayne Thanks for your input. Jeff.

So a quick question to you, or anyone else who claims to have found the LDM, what was the trap that he placed?

"Be careful in opening the shaft, as I have placed a trap that will kill any man who accidentally finds the mine."

 

[azdave35]

So a quick question to you, or anyone else who claims to have found the LDM, what was the trap that he placed?

"Be careful in opening the shaft, as I have placed a trap that will kill any man who accidentally finds the mine."

it is highly questionable if he ever said that...most of these so called clues floating around never came from waltz

 

[Matthew Roberts]

Everyone should understand the context of the stone map analysis by Desert Archaeology Inc. (DAI).

In 2004 the Flagg Foundation wanted to divest itself of the stone maps. Flagg had no clear title to the stones, the stones were not part of the Flagg identity which was gem and mineral collections and an outside individual was trying to lay claim to the stones.

Ray Grant, president of Flagg was trying to rid Flagg of the stones once and for all. A Flagg board meeting voted to get rid of the stones which were assumed by Flagg to be worthless oddities. Part of the board said before the stones were tossed in the dumpster they ought to at least be tested.

Grant used Flaggs connection with AzHiways to publicize the efforts to test the stones. Desert Archaeology Inc was chosen for this reason and this reason alone. DAI tailors their business not to sole archaeology but rather mainly to finding ways for their clients to satisfy regulatory and government requirements and to achieve positive outcomes for their clients. (direct quote from their business website). You can read between the lines why Flagg chose DAI.

DAI came back with exactly the results Flagg wanted and they were free to dispose of the stones. The SMHS stepped up and offered to take them off of Flaggs hands. DAIs results are ridiculous and unprofessional and all points are easily refuted by thousands of examples. DAI showed no examples of their conclusions and nothing of reference to back their findings as is done in every serious and professional archaeologic project.

 

[somehiker]

https://desert.com/

....related link

https://www.archaeologysouthwest.org/about/

 

[Al D]

So a quick question to you, or anyone else who claims to have found the LDM, what was the trap that he placed?

"Be careful in opening the shaft, as I have placed a trap that will kill any man who accidentally finds the mine."

Don’t waste your time, they do not respond to nay sayers and their web site is a fish pond for money donations, just a get rich quick scheme

 

[Al D]

Everyone should understand the context of the stone map analysis by Desert Archaeology Inc. (DAI).

In 1994 the Flagg Foundation wanted to divest itself of the stone maps. Flagg had no clear title to the stones, the stones were not part of the Flagg identity which was gem and mineral collections and an outside individual was trying to lay claim to the stones.

Ray Grant, president of Flagg was trying to rid Flagg of the stones once and for all. A Flagg board meeting voted to get rid of the stones which were assumed by Flagg to be worthless oddities. Part of the board said before the stones were tossed in the dumpster they ought to at least be tested.

Grant used Flaggs connection with AzHiways to publicize the efforts to test the stones. Desert Archaeology Inc was chosen for this reason and this reason alone. DAI tailors their business not to sole archaeology but rather mainly to finding ways for their clients to satisfy regulatory and government requirements and to achieve positive outcomes for their clients. (direct quote from their business website). You can read between the lines why Flagg chose DAI.

DAI came back with exactly the results Flagg wanted and they were free to dispose of the stones. The SMHS stepped up and offered to take them off of Flaggs hands. DAIs results are ridiculous and unprofessional and all points are easily refuted by thousands of examples. DAI showed no examples of their conclusions and nothing of reference to back their findings as is done in every serious and professional archaeologic project.

Thank You Matthew, now maybe this episode of proof that the stone tablets are a hoax can finally be laid to rest.

 

[somehiker]

" Woodcut from an 18th-century chapbook about the prophetess and supposed witch Mother Shipton, featured in Chap-books of the Eighteenth Century (1834) by John Ashton "

From......https://publicdomainreview.org/2017/05/04/woodcuts-and-witches/

 

[somehiker]

http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/t...ring-1675-1715-early-17th-century-buckle.html

https://www.google.com/search?q=jes...KHa39AtMQsAR6BAgJEAE&biw=1095&bih=632#imgrc=_

 

[Mc4500]

" Woodcut from an 18th-century chapbook about the prophetess and supposed witch Mother Shipton, featured in Chap-books of the Eighteenth Century (1834) by John Ashton "

From......https://publicdomainreview.org/2017/05/04/woodcuts-and-witches/

That's pretty cool!

 

[Al D]

" Woodcut from an 18th-century chapbook about the prophetess and supposed witch Mother Shipton, featured in Chap-books of the Eighteenth Century (1834) by John Ashton "

From......https://publicdomainreview.org/2017/05/04/woodcuts-and-witches/

Excellent post, more evidence that the general stylization of the figures on the H/P stone are correct for the time period when it is believed that they were carved, we now, thanks to Matthew, have the motive behind DAI’s conclusion, we jut need to discover the same for C. Polzer S.J.

 

[markmar]

markmar

Agreed Sir. But made by Mother Nature 100% No.

Babymick1

And which part of the Horse landmark you believe to be handmade?

 

[Matthew Roberts]

" Woodcut from an 18th-century chapbook about the prophetess and supposed witch Mother Shipton, featured in Chap-books of the Eighteenth Century (1834) by John Ashton "

From......https://publicdomainreview.org/2017/05/04/woodcuts-and-witches/

And there are literally thousands of examples that refute DAIs findings by simple Google search by individuals with no archaeology experience. DAI,s business is to help clients who have obstacles to their goals/projects overcome their problems with the government and regulations. Their total lack of examples and references to back their findings proves they offered an opinion that gave a positive outcome to their client which is DAI,s business and business model.

 

[azdave35]

And there are literally thousands of examples that refute DAIs findings by simple Google search by individuals with no archaeology experience. DAI,s business is to help clients who have obstacles to their goals/projects overcome their problems with the government and regulations. Their total lack of examples and references to back their findings proves they offered an opinion that gave a positive outcome to their client which is DAI,s business and business model.

i'll say it again..if anyone wants the real truth about travis and the stone maps talk to the people that were there recently...you will find the answers to your questions

 

[Mc4500]

it is highly questionable if he ever said that...most of these so called clues floating around never came from waltz

I understand your point and I agree with you to a degree , but there is no way for you or any of us to be completely certain which "clues" are valid and true, unless there's an exact transcript of the conversation that magically shows up after all these years. However, to me, no one clue has any more validity than the other. I take every clue, map ect with a grain of salt and at face value. It doesn't matter who said it, I look at it as information. Even petrech (however you spell it) said that he couldn't remember everything that Waltz said.

So whether he said it or not, it's in the lore, and in my opinion can only be ruled out if someone has actually (definitively) found the mine.

 

[azdave35]

I understand your point and I agree with you to a degree , but there is no way for you or any of us to be completely certain which "clues" are valid and true, unless there's an exact transcript of the conversation that magically shows up after all these years. However, to me, no one clue has any more validity than the other. I take every clue, map ect with a grain of salt and at face value. It doesn't matter who said it, I look at it as information. Even petrech (however you spell it) said that he couldn't remember everything that Waltz said.

So whether he said it or not, it's in the lore, and in my opinion can only be ruled out if someone has actually (definitively) found the mine.

actually the mine has been found and nobody died in a death trap

 

[somehiker]

And there are literally thousands of examples that refute DAIs findings by simple Google search by individuals with no archaeology experience. DAI,s business is to help clients who have obstacles to their goals/projects overcome their problems with the government and regulations. Their total lack of examples and references to back their findings proves they offered an opinion that gave a positive outcome to their client which is DAI,s business and business model.

They are first of all professional archaeologists, who would never put their necks on the block by encouraging "treasure hunters" in a magazine article. I guess they all forget that it was treasure hunting which led to the birth of their profession, and treasure hunters still provide them with many leads and discoveries to study and preserve for future generations.

An even older example of the same heart iconography.....Templar

 

[Mc4500]

actually the mine has been found and nobody died in a death trap

Again I said difinatively!

And I, as well as many others on here don't believe anyone has actually found it.

 

[somehiker]

And it's not like any other old carving of a horse on a slab of stone has never been found.

This one is about 12,000 yrs old....

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-48539803

 

[Matthew Roberts]

They are first of all professional archaeologists, who would never put their necks on the block by encouraging "treasure hunters" in a magazine article. I guess they all forget that it was treasure hunting which led to the birth of their profession, and treasure hunters still provide them with many leads and discoveries to study and preserve for future generations.

An even older example of the same heart iconography.....Templar

somehiker,....... Everyone should also understand that everyone involved in the stone map analysis came out a winner. AzHiways got a great story for their magazine, DAI got tons of free publicity for their part in the AzHiways article and Flagg unloaded a problem that had been hanging around their neck for 30 years. The only loser was the general public.