DOC NOSS-Victorio Peak OR The Caballo Mountains

[L.C. BAKER]

That line goes right through Glorieta Pass.

I have never been down there. Is that a significant spot for treasure lore? I am aware of the famous battle that took place there.

Curious L.C.

 

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[sdcfia]

I have never been down there. Is that a significant spot for treasure lore? I am aware of the famous battle that took place there.

Curious L.C.

Only that it's rumored by old timers around Santa Fe that Jesse James used the ranch house at the old Pigeon Ranch in the early 1900s. For what, I have no idea, but the ranch was in Glorieta Pass. Before this could be true, you would have to accept that Jesse was still alive in the 20th century.

 

[UncleMatt]

In rummaging around through old threads, I came across something interesting to connect to other sources. Examine the photos below:





These two photos were supposedly taken many decades apart. The first supposedly taken by Doc Noss way back in the day, and the second taken just a few years ago. Now the guy who posted the second photo claims they come from a cave in the Caballos, where his brother has a claim. I have examined these photos very closely, and they are indeed showing the same ladder in the same cave. I have seen photos like the first that were supposed to illustrate what Noss found at VP, but taking into account this new evidence, that seems unlikely. It was in the Caballo cave, not VP.

I will try to contact the person who posted the second photo to see about perhaps obtaining a cutting from the ladder so it can be dated. If you want concrete answers about who did what and when, that would be a good place to start. There is another pair of photos showing another ladder that appears to be much older than the first that I am still working on.

 

[sdcfia]

I got an "Invalid Attachment" message for the photos. Try the "Insert Image" option.

 

[UncleMatt]

lol, that is how I posted them to begin with

 

[UncleMatt]

Sometimes they display in the post, sometimes you have to click on the links to get them to show, not sure why this is going on

added later: I re-posted the photos, and they appear from my end to be displaying normally now. Please let me know if they are not from your end.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

my apologies for the post last night , after reading it today , i can see how it looks like i was whining about the ban ,
no i don't care about the ban , i earned it .

i do however feel bad for np's friend who tried to do he right thing , as the story goes , only to get his eyes opened to what it is really like when you graduate from treasure hunter to treasure finder .

that is the part that does not settle well , sorry about the confusion .

My apologies if I misread your post, it came across as disputing the timeout.... It is all good......[emoji106]

Sent from my QMV7A using Tapatalk

 

[UncleMatt]

I'll look into it, thanks for the response

 

[sdcfia]

Sometimes they display in the post, sometimes you have to click on the links to get them to show, not sure why this is going on

added later: I re-posted the photos, and they appear from my end to be displaying normally now. Please let me know if they are not from your end.

The photos look good now. The two pictures were obviously taken at the same place. Thanks.

 

[kanabite]

It would be news, I'm sure, but is that really of any surprise? Look at what was done to those people at the hands of Euros. Sure, some tribes aligned with these groups at different times, but those could be some valuable documents, perhaps even incriminating. Perhaps even that they did not LEGALLY belong to the Pueblo Indians of NM. I have no doubt Native American society works no different than ours in the sense that if it is true, do you think every Pueblo Indian knows? Or only certain ones? You seem surprised this wouldn't be common knowledge to everyone today, if true. We live in a world wrapped in secrets.

Secrets are what lubricates the gears of the Invisible Machine behind the veil and makes its motions possible ...

Now, I cannot place any value upon the veracity of the claim, other than to note it as a claimed fact, but it came from this book:

Amazon.com: The Pueblo Revolt: The Secret Rebellion That Drove the Spaniards Out of the Southwest eBook: David Roberts: Kindle Store

It has been a couple years since I checked out a copy from the library and read it, but it was a claim made in that book.

hi nobody and here is a link for you , you may have to read between the lines . im still not sold on the big conspiracy , i think it is more about human nature involving greed / secrets with the treasure stuff ,but who knows for sure ?
on a side note i have always wondered if the truth to our origins lies hidden somewhere deep in a "treasure cavern " out there somewhere , something that would shake beliefs and matters of faith to the very core if ever it came to light , but hey, that's just me .lol
take care.///bob

[QUOTEPublic disdain for dry accuracies is similarly evident in the success story of the Franciscan Thévet (1512-1592). Before becoming royal historiographer and guardian of the royal cabinet of curiosities, Thévet had traveled to Italy, Spain, North Africa, Egypt and had participated on Durand de Villegagon's ill-fated French expedition to Brazil. The original use he made of Aztec manuscripts revised his status in the history of anthropology, but this was not at all the cause for his fame in his day.[6] The court rewarded him for the fabulous stories that he related in his Singularitez de la France antarctique (1558) and Cosmographie universelle (1575). He was among the first to use the new technique of engraving to publish illustrations with his text. For more than two centuries European editors borrowed from his and the Protestant De Brys' pictorial repertories to illustrate new travel reports.
Michel Montaigne (1533-1592) has long been designated as an early cultural relativist and propagator of the "Noble Savage" theme. Historiographical revision of his moral skepticism in the essay "Des cannibals," his Lascasian defense of the Indians in "Des coches," and his mention of the Chinese in "De l'experience" concludes, however, that Montaigne also had no interest in aliens for their own sake. Most of his material was borrowed.[7] He metamorphized the classical Golden Age into the bon sauvage in order to document that modern Frenchmen were moral pygmies compared to the Ancients.[8] Although his criticism of the Spanish conquest is unique for its secularism, it cannot be assumed that the skeptical tradition rose from the geographical discoveries. Humanist skepticism was more likely linked to revulsion from the Religious Wars as it was to the increased availability of classical texts from the printing press.[9]

][/QUOTE]

M. C. Meijer's "Misunderstanding Natives in the Seventeenth Century"

 

[UncleMatt]

Okay, here is the next set of ladder photos, presented for group consideration:





Again, the first is supposedly from the cavern at VP taken by Noss, the second is only a few years old. Both showing the same ladder at vastly different points in time, and located in the Caballos, not VP.

note: that is supposedly Doc's foot in the first photo.

 

[UncleMatt]

How can this be? Do we have any photos of the interior of VP taken by Doc at all in reality? Another explanation might be the modern photos were taken at VP somehow, though I did hear back from the guy who posted them, and he assures me they are from his brother's old cave claim. He has not been there in years.

 

[gollum]

How can this be? Do we have any photos of the interior of VP taken by Doc at all in reality? Another explanation might be the modern photos were taken at VP somehow, though I did hear back from the guy who posted them, and he assures me they are from his brother's old cave claim. He has not been there in years.

There were pics taken in VP in the old days. What I heard was that when Harold Beckwith got involved, those pics disappeared. Funny thing that Harold and Marvin Beckwith got $1,000,000 to drop their interests in VP. Makes you wonder.

Mike

 

[UncleMatt]

Welp, only one way to clear this all up definitively, and that's to go slither into that cave and see if the ladders are still there, or if there is a cavern matching that in the photos where the ladders once stood. Here is the thread where I found the newer photos: http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/v...p-trying-get-permit-remove-doc-noss-gold.html

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Secrets are what lubricates the gears of the Invisible Machine behind the veil and makes its motions possible ...

Well put my friend.

L.C.

 

[gollum]

Matt,

I have a question for you. Where did you read, or who told you, that those old pics of the wooden ladders were from VP? You assume that because Doc's biggest involvement was with VP, that those pics are from there. Remember, Doc and Ova used to camp at Cleato Springs (not far from Bat Cave). Doc was known to Letha and Larry to have explored a lot of the Caballos. That cave in the newer pics is not exactly a secret amongst locals. I would almost be willing to bet that the new pics were made to match Doc's Old Pics (same prespective and angles).

I have said it several times; I believe it is more than likely Doc found a second Treasure Cave in the Caballos based on his map. When he was getting all the flack and grief for VP, he went looking for Cave#2. I think he found it and just didn't tell ANYBODY.

Mike

 

[L.C. BAKER]

Springfield mentioned more than once that he believes there to be something big in the Gila Headwaters, which that line goes through, as well as a suspicion of something in the Purgatoire Headwaters in So CO/No NM, which your line is a bit south of. Springfield worked a KGC/Masonic site in NM for years, so take all of that for whatever it may be worth ...

Thanks for the confirmation.
L.C.

 

[UncleMatt]

Matt,

I have a question for you. Where did you read, or who told you, that those old pics of the wooden ladders were from VP? You assume that because Doc's biggest involvement was with VP, that those pics are from there. Remember, Doc and Ova used to camp at Cleato Springs (not far from Bat Cave). Doc was known to Letha and Larry to have explored a lot of the Caballos. That cave in the newer pics is not exactly a secret amongst locals. I would almost be willing to bet that the new pics were made to match Doc's Old Pics (same prespective and angles).

I have said it several times; I believe it is more than likely Doc found a second Treasure Cave in the Caballos based on his map. When he was getting all the flack and grief for VP, he went looking for Cave#2. I think he found it and just didn't tell ANYBODY.

Mike

Well for starters the old photo of the 2nd ladder I posted is shown as the first photo on the photograph gallery on victoriopeak.com, a fact which was first brought to your attention by sfloto back in 2011.

"Gollum In the other thread you misunderstood my question, I was wondering about the Two pictures they use in the website for book one but do not appear in the actual book The shot of the single rung ladder and the double ladder both in the caballos. It seemed strange that feature these pics in the website but not in the book."

You said you would check with Jack about that in that thread, and said it was a sore spot with you as well, did Jack ever get back to you about that? I also notice that now victoriopeak.com is no longer showing the photo with the ladder with 2 separate uprights as sfloto observed on their site in 2011. I'm hopeful Jack can get back to you on this at some point. http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/v...ilogy-victorio-peak-book-1-a.html#post2479920

Why would they show a photo of a ladder in the Caballos on their website about Victorio Peak, without mentioning it wasn't from Victorio Peak? For effect I am sure. However, they do go on at length about Doc's adventures in the Caballos in Book 1, so maybe that is why they have it posted there.

 

[sdcfia]

<cut>
I have said it several times; I believe it is more than likely Doc found a second Treasure Cave in the Caballos based on his map. When he was getting all the flack and grief for VP, he went looking for Cave#2. I think he found it and just didn't tell ANYBODY.

Mike

Logic breaks down for me at this point. What benefit comes to Noss by going to look for a second treasure cave at this point in time? If he could locate a second cache, he would have been faced with the same Gold Act problems that nagged him in dealing with the gold he claimed he removed from VP - an unlimited amount of gold that he claimed he could still access from there via his "secret entrance" (yet another Doc lie?). It seems much more likely to me that the source of Doc's gold was always in the Caballos - presumably Willie's Cave. The more interesting question might be, if Willie was still accessing his Caballo cave after he relocated to California, was Doc also still also tapping it during his VP scamming years? And if not, why not?

 

[UncleMatt]

Doc was focused on finding ALL seven locations shown on the map he was following. Treasure hunters are never satisfied with some of the treasure, they want it all. Just like Doc did, and just like any of us would...