Ellie Baba
Hero Member
Now NP,
Who could that have been? If you had lived back in those days would you have told anyone about the mission or just dissed it?
El Baba
Do the Stone Tablets lead to somewhere OTHER than the Superstition Mtns?
- Thread starter Not Peralta
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Now NP,
Who could that have been? If you had lived back in those days would you have told anyone about the mission or just dissed it?
El Baba
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Not Peralta
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wrmickel1 I really dont care if it peeked any ones interest,or not, its just like I said, it has nothing to do with my theory, Its something i had laying around gathering dust ,just like you.np
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Not Peralta
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elli baba? I would think you would be counting the days,for the sun to rise over the supes,so you can see your map to the seven cities of cibola,no wonder a lot of people get lost in that place,be sure to wear tall boots,np
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Not Peralta
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cactusjumper maybe you can use your map now ,to find your next rendezvous, or bob wards cabin,or the way off this thread.np
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cactusjumper
Gold Member
NP,
Well, Bob Ward didn't really have a cabin.......did he? I know where the cabin is that he stayed in. I have a picture of him sitting outside of it. Do you have a picture of him there? Where's your next Rendezvous?
Do you have pictures of anything, other than someone else's photo of the "mission" and the Indian rock art at Spirit Mountain? Are you all done hinting that Dutch Jake was Jacob Waltz?
Joe Ribaudo
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cactuslumper I told you theres no one here for you, please,use your map and find some one who cares what you have to say,I dont ,you make my point about people that waste their time in the superstitions, and cant find anything,you just sit around and think of all the time and money you wasted,now you have nothing to do,exept bother other people.and pretend you know every thing,all you can do now is refer to your library,and pictures you have collected or gathered from other people,why dont you find yourself ,I cant help it because your dreams didnt come true,your theory didnt work,that happens,but dont be bitter,it will all work out,just think of the memories you have,because thats all that any one that treasure hunted in the superstitions has left, because they never found any thing at all,not even them selves,try some thing new ,besides bothering people,on their threads,no one wants to hear this.np ps from now on there wont be any one here for you ,its a waste of my time .np
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Ellie Baba
Hero Member
NP,
I have never entered the Supes alone, we usually go in numbers of four or more. We always have our maps, our brains and our wits about us. Most of us are all seasoned veterans except when we take some newbies with us.
Soon you too will see the Seven Cities of Zibola. There are a number of very important clues in this WordDoc.
Saint Gregory of Neocaesarea, also known as Gregory Thaumaturgus, San Gregorio Taumaturgo (Spanish) Gregory the Wonderworker, (ca. 213 – ca. 270 AD) was a Christian bishop of the 3rd century. Feast Day Nov. 17
San Gregorio Taumatugo
Saint Gregory the Wonderworker, Bishop of Neocaesarea, was born in the city of Neocaesarea (northern Asia Minor) into a pagan family. Having received a fine education, from his youth he strived for Truth, but the thinkers of antiquity were not able to quench his thirst for knowledge. Truth was revealed to him only in the Holy Gospel, and the youth became a Christian.
For the continuation of his studies St Gregory went to Alexandria, known then as a center for pagan and Christian learning. The youth, eager for knowledge, went to the Alexandrian Catechetical School, where the presbyter Origen taught. Origen was a famous teacher, possessing a great strength of mind and profound knowledge. St Gregory became a student of Origen. Afterwards, the saint wrote about his mentor: "This man received from God a sublime gift, to be an interpreter of the Word of God for people, to apprehend the Word of God, as God Himself did use it, and to explain it to people, insofar as they were able to understand it." St Gregory studied for eight years with Origen, and was baptized by him.
The ascetic life of St Gregory, his continence, purity and lack of covetousness aroused envy among his conceited and sin-loving peers, pagans that they were, and they decided to slander St Gregory. Once, when he was conversing with philosophers and teachers in the city square, a notorious harlot came up to him and demanded payment for the sin he had supposedly committed with her. At first St Gregory gently remonstrated with her, saying that she perhaps mistook him for someone else. But the profligate woman would not be quieted. He then asked a friend to give her the money. Just as the woman took the unjust payment, she immediately fell to the ground in a demonic fit, and the fraud became evident. St Gregory said a prayer over her, and the devil left her. This was the beginning of St Gregory's miracles.
Having returned to Neocaesarea, the saint fled from the worldly affairs into which influential townsmen persistently sought to push him. He went into the desert, where by fasting and prayer he attained to high spiritual accomplishment and the gifts of clairvoyance and prophecy. St Gregory loved life in the wilderness and wanted to remain in solitude until the end of his days, but the Lord willed otherwise.
The bishop of the Cappadocian city of Amasea, Thedimos, having learned of St Gregory's ascetic life, decided to have him made Bishop of Neocaesarea. But having foreseen in spirit the intent of Bishop Thedimos, the saint hid himself from the messengers of the bishop who were entrusted to find him. Then Bishop Thedimos ordained the absent saint as Bishop of Neocaesarea, beseeching the Lord that He Himself would sanctify the unusual ordination. St Gregory perceived the extraordinary event as a manifestation of the will of God and he did not dare to protest. This episode in the life of St Gregory was recorded by St Gregory of Nyssa (January 10). He relates that St Gregory of Neocaesarea received the episcopal dignity only after Bishop Thedimos of Amasea performed all the canonical rites over him.
During this time, the heresy of Sabellius and Paul of Samosata began to spread. They taught falsely concerning the Holy Trinity. St Gregory prayed fervently and diligently imploring God and His most pure Mother to reveal to him the true faith. The All-Holy Virgin Mary appeared to him, radiant like the sun, and with Her was the Apostle John the Theologian dressed in archepiscopal vestments.
By the command of the Mother of God, the Apostle John taught the saint how to correctly and properly confess the Mystery of the Most Holy Trinity. St Gregory wrote down everything that St John the Theologian revealed to him. The Mystery of the Symbol of the Faith, written down by St Gregory of Neocaesarea, is a great divine revelation in the history of the Church. The teaching about the Holy Trinity in Orthodox Theology is based on it. Subsequently it was used by the holy Fathers of the Church: Basil the Great, Gregory the Theologian, and Gregory of Nyssa. The Symbol of St Gregory of Neocaesarea was later examined and affirmed in the year 325 by the First Ecumenical Council, showing his enduring significance for Orthodoxy.
Having become a bishop, St Gregory set off to Neocaesarea. Along the way from Amasea he expelled devils from a pagan temple, the priest of which he converted to Christ. The convert was witness to still another miracle of the saint, at his word a large stone shifted from its place.
The preaching of the saint was direct, lively and fruitful. He taught and worked miracles in the name of Christ: he healed the sick, he helped the needy, he settled quarrels and complaints. Two brothers sharing an inheritance were not able to agree over the property of their dead father. There was a large lake over which they argued, for each of the brothers wanted the lake for himself. They both gathered their friends together, and were ready to come to blows. St Gregory persuaded them to delay their fight until the following day, and he himself prayed all night long at the shore of the lake which sparked the quarrel. When dawn broke, everyone saw that the lake had dried up or gone underground. Through the intense prayer of the saint, now there was only a stream, and its course defined the boundary line. Another time, during the construction of a church, he commanded a hill to move and make room at the place of the foundation.
When a persecution against Christians began under the emperor Decius (249-251), St Gregory led his flock to a faraway mountain. A certain pagan, knowing about the hiding place of the Christians, informed the persecutors. Soldiers surrounded the mountain. The saint went out into an open place, raised up his hands to heaven and ordered to his deacon to do the same. The soldiers searched the whole mountain, and they went several times right past those praying, but not seeing them, they gave up and went away. In the city they reported that there was nowhere to hide on the mountain: no one was there, and only two trees stood beside each other. The informer was struck with amazement, he repented of his ways and became a fervent Christian.
St Gregory returned to Neocaesarea after the end of the persecution. By his blessing church Feasts were established in honor of the martyrs who had suffered for Christ.
By his saintly life, his effective preaching, working of miracles and graced guiding of his flock, the saint steadily increased the number of converts to Christ. When St Gregory first ascended his cathedra, there were only seventeen Christians in Neocaesarea. At his death, only seventeen pagans remained in the city.
A letter of Origen refers to the departure of the two brothers, but it is not easy to determine whether it was written before or after the delivery of this oration. In it Origen exhorts (perhaps unnecessarily) his pupils to bring the intellectual treasures of the Greeks to the service of Christian philosophy, and thus imitate the Jews who employed the golden vessels of the Egyptians to adorn the Holy of Holies.
Father Kino was well acquainted with Church history. Look for a place name along Father Kino's travels in Pimeria Alta.
Have a great weekend!
EllieB
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ellie b very nice for you to see, what you see,and for you to beleive what you beleive,you have a nice weekend.np
Springfield
Silver Member
An Old Testament link to the American Southwest would certainly be of more interest than the usual Christian angle, but you're not going to tell us the Arc of the Covenant (which you apparently emphasized above) is located in the Superstitions, are you?
Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp
Gold Member
G'morning Ellie: Coffee? I need some myself. You posted --> 'It has a lot to do with the location of Tayopa.'
Tayopa's location is --- 27* 59' 30.15 N, 108* 45' 15.67 W. Western Chihuahua, below Yecora.
Don Jose d eLa Mancha
Tayopa's location is --- 27* 59' 30.15 N, 108* 45' 15.67 W. Western Chihuahua, below Yecora.
Don Jose d eLa Mancha
cactusjumper
Gold Member
NP,
Yes, you have told me that many times. Each and every time, afterwards, you come back to open a dialog with me. In the beginning, I only questioned your "facts" and sources. In response, you have turned the conversation to personal attacks on me, as well as my friends. You have yet to answer any reasonable questions.
You have really given us all that you have on your Spirit Mountain theory. There is nothing left to bait the hook with. Perhaps it is you in the wrong pond.
Why did you try to sell us on Dutch Jake being Jacob Waltz? It seems a very misguided attempt to make a weak attempt at placing the LDM and the Stone Maps in the area of Spirit Mountain. Have you given up on that theory?
(Still not ashamed to sign my real name.)
Joe Ribaudo
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cactusjumper
Gold Member
Before anyone goes to too much trouble trying to find Waltz's placer claim, keep in mind that my sources are vague an questionable. On the other hand, the're better than NP's. Personally, I don't believe for a second that Waltz had a legal, documented, placer claim. Of course I haven't searched for it around the Superstition Mountain Jesuit Mission yet.
Joe Ribaudo
Joe Ribaudo
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cactusjumper,theres no one here for you anymore.np
Ellie Baba
Hero Member
Springfield,
The Ark is somewhere on this planet (if it wasn't melted down for the value of gold). I for one will not make any claim that it is hidden in the Superstition Mountain area. Something very important is hidden here and not just one cache but many. Found among the Dead Sea Scrolls was a rolled up copper document. It had to be cut into four separate pieces to keep it from falling apart. This copper scroll supposedly contained an exact description of a number of famous religious artifacts and identified exactly where they were buried. Nothing was found at any of the noted locations. Apparently a copy of the scroll ended up in Southern France in Septimania (the 7th Roman Legion) area around 800 to 900 AD and was found by one of the Jewish religious Elders during their captivity there. Later on the Knight Templars were formed and off they went to Jerusalem.
Realize that I have made a long story quite short. From Wikipedia;
Septimania (French: Septimanie, IPA: [sɛptimani]; Occitan: Septimània, was the western region of the Roman province of Gallia Narbonensis that passed under the control of the Visigoths in 462, when Septimania was ceded to their king, Theodoric II. Under the Visigoths it was known as simply Gallia or Narbonensis. It corresponded roughly with the modern French region of Languedoc-Roussillon. It passed briefly to the Emirate of Córdoba in the eighth century before its conquest by the Franks, who by the end of the ninth century termed it Gothia or the Gothic March (Marca Gothica).
Septimania was a march of the Carolingian Empire and then West Francia down to the thirteenth century though it was culturally and politically separate from northern France and the central royal government. The region was under the influence of the Toulousain, Provence, and Catalonia. It was part of the cultural and linguistic region named Occitania that was finally brought within the control of the French kings in the early 13th century as a result of the Albigensian Crusade after which it came under French governors. From the end of the thirteenth century it was known as Languedoc and its history is tied up with that of France.
The name "Septimania" may derive from part of the Roman name of the city of Béziers, Colonia Julia Septimanorum Beaterrae, which in turn alludes to the settlement of veterans of the Roman VII Legion in the city. Another possible derivation of the name is in reference to the seven cities (civitates) of the territory: Béziers, Elne, Agde, Narbonne, Lodève, Maguelonne, and Nîmes. Septimania extended to a line half-way between the Mediterranean and the Garonne River in the northwest; in the east the Rhône separated it from Provence; and to the south its boundary was formed by the Pyrenees. At the base of the Pyrenees is the small and very famous town of Rennes-le-Château. Should ring a bell.
What I was trying to point out to everyone here is this: We must think just like Father Kino once thought and open up our minds to understand why he had given certain places names he had chosen. Father Kino left us so many clues to help us figure out why he was here. Look at his maps and comments found on these maps, ie: Notes Relating to Father Kino’s Maps of Pimeria Alta
Passage Par Terre A La Californie 1702, Kino Map
French phrase found on upper right hand area beneath Casa Grande left of San Fernando (named by Bernal) at Gila and San Pedro River confluence; ou de la filasse (French) = or of the oakum = old tar rope (ships rigging recycled by hand to caulk wooden ships.). Another secret; find out what the dimensions of each map equals to.
This is one that I have been working on; Found on one of Kino's maps: Hila Fluss, Gila River, Gila Rio, GRAIL 10 (one zero). Interesting wouldn't you say? Just for fun!
Oh yes! What were the other names given to the rivers by Kino, Castenada and so on. Clues and more clues, how subtle; [h=3]sub·tle[/h]
Adjective
|
Ellie B
Ellie Baba
Hero Member
Springfield,
The Ark is somewhere on this planet (if it wasn't melted down for the value of gold). I for one will not make any claim that it is hidden in the Superstition Mountain area. Something very important is hidden here and not just one cache but many. Found among the Dead Sea Scrolls was a rolled up copper document. It had to be cut into four separate pieces to keep it from falling apart. This copper scroll supposedly contained an exact description of a number of famous religious artifacts and identified exactly where they were buried. Nothing was found at any of the noted locations. Apparently a copy of the scroll ended up in Southern France in Septimania (the 7th Roman Legion) area around 800 to 900 AD and was found by one of the Jewish religious Elders during their captivity there. Later on the Knight Templars were formed and off they went to Jerusalem.
Realize that I have made a long story quite short. From Wikipedia;
Septimania (French: Septimanie, IPA: [sɛptimani]; Occitan: Septimània, was the western region of the Roman province of Gallia Narbonensis that passed under the control of the Visigoths in 462, when Septimania was ceded to their king, Theodoric II. Under the Visigoths it was known as simply Gallia or Narbonensis. It corresponded roughly with the modern French region of Languedoc-Roussillon. It passed briefly to the Emirate of Córdoba in the eighth century before its conquest by the Franks, who by the end of the ninth century termed it Gothia or the Gothic March (Marca Gothica).
Septimania was a march of the Carolingian Empire and then West Francia down to the thirteenth century though it was culturally and politically separate from northern France and the central royal government. The region was under the influence of the Toulousain, Provence, and Catalonia. It was part of the cultural and linguistic region named Occitania that was finally brought within the control of the French kings in the early 13th century as a result of the Albigensian Crusade after which it came under French governors. From the end of the thirteenth century it was known as Languedoc and its history is tied up with that of France.
The name "Septimania" may derive from part of the Roman name of the city of Béziers, Colonia Julia Septimanorum Beaterrae, which in turn alludes to the settlement of veterans of the Roman VII Legion in the city. Another possible derivation of the name is in reference to the seven cities (civitates) of the territory: Béziers, Elne, Agde, Narbonne, Lodève, Maguelonne, and Nîmes. Septimania extended to a line half-way between the Mediterranean and the Garonne River in the northwest; in the east the Rhône separated it from Provence; and to the south its boundary was formed by the Pyrenees. At the base of the Pyrenees is the small and very famous town of Rennes-le-Château. Should ring a bell.
What I was trying to point out to everyone here is this: We must think just like Father Kino once thought and open up our minds to understand why he had given certain places names he had chosen. Father Kino left us so many clues to help us figure out why he was here. Look at his maps and comments found on these maps, ie: Notes Relating to Father Kino’s Maps of Pimeria Alta
Passage Par Terre A La Californie 1702, Kino Map
French phrase found on upper right hand area beneath Casa Grande left of San Fernando (named by Bernal) at Gila and San Pedro River confluence; ou de la filasse (French) = or of the oakum = old tar rope (ships rigging recycled by hand to caulk wooden ships.). Another secret; find out what the dimensions of each map equals to.
This is one that I have been working on; Found on one of Kino's maps: Hila Fluss, Gila River, Gila Rio, GRAIL 10 (one zero). Interesting wouldn't you say? Just for fun!
Oh yes! What were the other names given to the rivers by Kino, Castenada and so on. Clues and more clues, how subtle; [h=3]sub·tle[/h]
Adjective
|
Ellie B
Ellie Baba
Hero Member
Ellie Baba
Hero Member
Sitting in front of this computer is time consuming and its about time to consume some more coffee. Come on over anytime you wonderful Tramp! Thanx for L&L.
Later,
EL B
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Not Peralta
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ellie b Im not jealous, cactusjumper has been told,theres no one here for him ,he is not welcomed on my thread .np
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cactusjumper
Gold Member
Ellie,
Many thanks my friend. There are a number of people here who are my friends. Most of them just don't want to get wrapped up in this foolishness.
NP,
As in most of the stuff you post, there is little substance or truth in what you write. I assume it is only because you are mistaken in your conclusions. There are many people who are here for me.....At least the ones who are important.
One of the things that gives away your feelings of jealousy, is the way you, obliquely, denigrate the Dutch Hunter's Rendezvous.
Joe Ribaudo
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cactusjumper theres no one here for you,np ps,if anyone wants to know why theres no one here for cactusjumper,all you have to do is review this entire thread.np
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