Banning guns keeps people safe huh?

[Treasure_Hunter]

Not a single word you posted changes the fact I was born with the right to protect my family and myself with any and all means necessary including fire arms and our Bill of Rights guarantees that right, not privilege, RIGHT.....

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[0121stockpicker]

TH the question wasn't about rights. I clearly stated that every us citizen has the right. The discussion was around your statement that the right entailed "no sacrifices". As clearly seen there are sacrifices involved in our second amendment right. This was just one example. Lets just be honest about it.

 

[0121stockpicker]

Sacrifices for our right ...


In 2007, the United States suffered some 15,000-19,000 accidental shootings. More than 600 of these shootings proved fatal.

The total number of Americans killed and wounded by gun accidents exceeds the total number killed or injured in fires.

The number killed in gun accidents is 20% higher than the total number killed in all U.S. civil aviation accidents.

In 2011, the Consumer Product Safety Commission voted to ban drop-side baby cribs because these cribs have been blamed for "dozens" of infant deaths over the entire previous decade. The 600+ accidental gun deaths in any single year amount to 50 dozen.

Back when the Centers for Disease Control were allowed to do gun research, they found that American children under age 15 were nine times more likely to die of a gun accident than children in other advanced wealthy countries.

The Centers for Disease Control reserve the term "very rare" for accidental deaths from vaccines, the number of which is zero, or close to it. If more than 600 people a year were dying from vaccines, we'd have a national uproar, if not a revolution.

Of course, guns in the home are also associated with higher rates of suicides and suicide attempts, not to mention homicides and assaults as well. About 200 Americans go to emergency rooms every day with gunshot wounds. On present trends, by 2015 more Americans will die from firearms - homicide, suicide, and accident - than from automobile accidents.

 

[0121stockpicker]

I'm pro second, but honest about some of the ramifications of our rights. Just like with freedom of speech comes ignorant white pride trash.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Sorry, but I choose freedom and liberty over safety.

The purpose of our Constitution, our Bill of Rights, even our country was never to make us safe from all danger, it was to guarantee our freedom and liberty. You want to live in a country that guarantees safety over liberty and freedom move to a socialist dictatorship..

As the great Patrick Henry said "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, Give Me Liberty or Give me death."


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[0121stockpicker]

Sorry, but I choose freedom and liberty over safety.

The purpose of our Constitution, our Bill of Rights, even our country was never to make us safe from all danger, it was to guarantee our freedom and liberty. You want to live in a country that guarantees safety over liberty and freedom move to a socialist dictatorship..

As the great Patrick Henry said "Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, Give Me Liberty or Give me death."

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Yup and that is your right. But never ever say that it does not come without great sacrifice. And sacrifice of the most innocent. At least be honest about it.

 

[krazyace]

Stats are so easy to manipulate... and most are meaningless.

Sacrifices for our right ...


In 2007, the United States suffered some 15,000-19,000 accidental shootings. More than 600 of these shootings proved fatal.

The total number of Americans killed and wounded by gun accidents exceeds the total number killed or injured in fires.

The number killed in gun accidents is 20% higher than the total number killed in all U.S. civil aviation accidents.

In 2011, the Consumer Product Safety Commission voted to ban drop-side baby cribs because these cribs have been blamed for "dozens" of infant deaths over the entire previous decade. The 600+ accidental gun deaths in any single year amount to 50 dozen.

Back when the Centers for Disease Control were allowed to do gun research, they found that American children under age 15 were nine times more likely to die of a gun accident than children in other advanced wealthy countries.

The Centers for Disease Control reserve the term "very rare" for accidental deaths from vaccines, the number of which is zero, or close to it. If more than 600 people a year were dying from vaccines, we'd have a national uproar, if not a revolution.

Of course, guns in the home are also associated with higher rates of suicides and suicide attempts, not to mention homicides and assaults as well. About 200 Americans go to emergency rooms every day with gunshot wounds. On present trends, by 2015 more Americans will die from firearms - homicide, suicide, and accident - than from automobile accidents.

 

[0121stockpicker]

And a lot of these accidents could be prevented but big gun and their massive unnamed lobbying group doesn't want to pay the extra couple bucks to make a safe product. If that unnamed lobbying group was for its members why would they support unsafe products. Sounds like they don't give a sh about members and are clearly in the pocket of big gun. Keep sending in those dues!! Lets at least be honest....

Yet when it comes to the most lethal of all consumer products, suddenly Congress becomes super-indulgent of industry fallibility. It would be a bold pharmaceutical executive who said that we didn't need child-proof bottles because it was a parent's responsibility to teach her 7 year old to stay away from the medicine chest. Yet that's just the answer we hear after incidents like yesterday's tragedy in Decatur, Ohio, when a 9 year old boy was shot in the head by his 13 year old sister.

Nobody would suggest that better product design could prevent all gun accidents. I'm certainly not suggesting it. But it's true that the most popular range of handguns in the United States, Glock, is sold without a usable visual indicator of a bullet in the chamber.


And it's equally true that again and again the industry and its representatives lend their clout to protect wrongdoers against the public.

Under [federal] law, investigators cannot reveal federal firearms tracing information that shows how often a dealer sells guns that end up seized in crimes. The law effectively shields retailers from lawsuits, academic study and public scrutiny. It also keeps the spotlight off the relationship between rogue gun dealers and the black market in firearms.

Such information used to be available under a simple Freedom of Information Act request. But seven years ago, under pressure from the gun lobby, Congress blacked out the information by passing the so-called Tiahrt amendment, named for Rep. Todd Tiahrt (R-Kan.). The law removed from the public record a government database that traces guns recovered in crimes back to the dealers.

"It was extraordinary, and the most offensive thing you can think of," said Chuck Wexler, director of the Police Executive Research Forum, a nonprofit group for police chiefs. "The tracing data, which is now secret, helped us see the big picture of where guns are coming from."

 

[0121stockpicker]

So to answer the original question of this thread - yes, banning guns would make people safer. But it would deny people their second amendment right which is deemed more important than safety. I think an honest answer to an honest question.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Yup and that is your right. But never ever say that it does not come without great sacrifice. And sacrifice of the most innocent. At least be honest about it.

No more sacrifice than driving cars or riding bikes. Death by firearms is not in the top 5 causes of death in kids under 18, but motor vehicle is the leading cause of death in kids ages 5-19..

Non fatal Injury by firearms is also not in the top 5, either but autos and bikes both are.....

Top 5 causes of death in kids ages O-19 are.....

Motor vehicle
Drowning
Suffocation
Poisoning
Fire/Burns

Top 5 non fatal causes.....

Falls
Struck by or against
Overexertion
Motor vehicle
Cut/ Pierce

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[Treasure_Hunter]

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[Treasure_Hunter]

So to answer the original question of this thread - yes, banning guns would make people safer. But it would deny people their second amendment right which is deemed more important than safety. I think an honest answer to an honest question.

Peddle it somewhere else.

What about the 100s of thousands of lives that are saved ever year because people are armed, what about the 200,000+ times a year a woman uses a gun to defend themselves, or the approx 2.5 million times a year a gun is used by a citizen to defend themselves.

Even anti gun Bill Clinton researchers admitted there were over 1.5 million cases a year of citizens using guns to protect their selves.

Far more innocent citizens die by gun fire from police than from armed citizens. Only 2% of civilian shootings involve innocent person mistaken as crook, police mistakes are at 11%, over 5 times higher.

Safer if guns are banned, what a joke, safer for who.......

It would be safer for the criminals there is no doubt in that at all, they would thrive and the rest of us would be begging for mercy.....



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[Crispin]

I can't even keep myself from getting banned from places! I know this has nothing to do with the conversation but I thought it was funny based on the title of the thread.

 

[0121stockpicker]

Peddle it somewhere else.

What about the 100s of thousands of lives that are saved ever year because people are armed, what about the 200,000+ times a year a woman uses a gun to defend themselves, or the approx 2.5 million times a year a gun is used by a citizen to defend themselves.

Even anti gun Bill Clinton researchers admitted there were over 1.5 million cases a year of citizens using guns to protect their selves.

Far more innocent citizens die by gun fire from police than from armed citizens. Only 2% of civilian shootings involve innocent person mistaken as crook, police mistakes are at 11%, over 5 times higher.

Safer if guns are banned, what a joke, safer for who.......

It would be safer for the criminals there is no doubt in that at all, they would thrive and the rest of us would be begging for mercy.....

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What ever makes you feel better about yourself. I guess I would wonder if you actually believe all that "stuff" why you feel the need to justify. I don't know too many folks justifying the first amendment??

Again lets just say its a constitutional right for better or worse but lets not try and justify it with BS. Just makes for a foolish conversation. Best.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

What ever makes you feel better about yourself. I guess I would wonder if you actually believe all that "stuff" why you feel the need to justify. I don't know too many folks justifying the first amendment??

Again lets just say its a constitutional right for better or worse but lets not try and justify it with BS. Just makes for a foolish conversation. Best.

You don't like the facts that's you choice, but the fact is fire arms save hundreds of thousands of lives a year ever single year. Hundreds of thousands of women use a firearm to stop an attempted rape or assault ever single year......Those are truths....

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[63bkpkr]

But ivan salis,
We've gotten real change its just that it is so bad and getting worse by the minute that the country could crumble and likely soon. Wait for the first armed protest and O's goons will come out in force and slay all who disagree and then the country will be locked down and will fail. Just IMO.

Oh, I'm all for ousting him from his position BUT who will take his place AND heal the harm he's done? Who will take the challenge and return this country to what a Democracy should be honest, civil, productive, good citizens not a bunch of criminals, moral, when will we stop hiding from each other as Fear is not our friend and yet it is used every day to cripple us?. And when will the citizens actually get involved in their country again and take care of it with the respect it seserves? Why do illegal imigrants still want to break into the USA, because they see hope here for a better life but they've become part of the problem not a part of the solution. Quite a few of our legal citizens are also a part of the problem!....................63bkpkr

 

[0121stockpicker]

You don't like the facts that's you choice, but the fact is fire arms save hundreds of thousands of lives a year ever single year. Hundreds of thousands of women use a firearm to stop an attempted rape or assault ever single year......Those are truths....

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Hey if need need to try and justify things so you can sleep better at night god bless. Certainly don't do it in my account. Again the second amendment is a right of us citizens - no justifications needed.

Why do you think the gun manufacturers don't add some pretty cheap parts to their guns to make them a lot safer. And why do the people at an unnamed massive lobbying group lint to make sure that they do not have to do so?? Would you pay an extra 10 or 20 dollars a weapon to save 100 children a year from accidental death or not worth it?

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Hey if need need to try and justify things so you can sleep better at night god bless. Certainly don't do it in my account. Again the second amendment is a right of us citizens - no justifications needed.

Why do you think the gun manufacturers don't add some pretty cheap parts to their guns to make them a lot safer. And why do the people at an unnamed massive lobbying group lint to make sure that they do not have to do so?? Would you pay an extra 10 or 20 dollars a weapon to save 100 children a year from accidental death or not worth it?

Nothing I say or post is to make me sleep better.

I have 4 pistols, 2 of them have features to tell you when there is a shell in the chamber, they will not fire if dropped due to another safety feature and will not fire unless finger is on trigger and safety below hammer is engaged at same time. In other words have multiple safeties.

The other 2 have the single safety and are over 20 years old. Guns produced today are far safer than guns produced 5, 10 and 20 years ago.

Are you not aware guns are already being built with multiable safeties...?

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[0121stockpicker]

Nothing I say or post is to make me sleep better.

I have 4 pistols, 2 of them have features to tell you when there is a shell in the chamber, they will not fire if dropped due to another safety feature and will not fire unless finger is on trigger and safety below hammer is engaged at same time. In other words have multiple safeties.

The other 2 have the single safety and are over 20 years old. Guns produced today are far safer than guns produced 5, 10 and 20 years ago.

Are you not aware guns are already being built with multiable safeties...?

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Why do you think the industry and their lobbyist fought these simple safety features for soooo long? Don't you think child safe weapons is something the NRA should be fighting for and not against?

 

[dieselram94]

Picker, WHAT are you talking about? Exactly which devices do you speak of?