Banning guns keeps people safe huh?

[Dave44]

I don't see your point, gun violence in the UK is much lower than in the US? What are you trying to say that if 1 person in a country of tens of millions are killed with a gun than any regulation is a failure? Obviously that is a foolish statement.

I think you just proved the point yourself. We have 17x as many guns per capita, we have more gun related violence. Seems pretty clear cut.

So then there is 17 times less gun violence in the United Kingdom?
What is the guns / capita in Chicago? DC? California? Do they all have correlating lower rates of crime/ capita?

Answer is no. You do not know how to read statistics.

 

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[bevo]

go to the fbi website for real stats.

 

[bevo]

FBI ? Crime Statistics for the skeptics.

 

[0121stockpicker]

So then there is 17 times less gun violence in the United Kingdom?
What is the guns / capita in Chicago? DC? California? Do they all have correlating lower rates of crime/ capita?

Answer is no. You do not know how to read statistics.

Dave no of fence but that is a pretty foolish statement. You think there is a linear statistical progression for weapons and crime?? Why would you ever think that? Have you actually ever taken a statistical analysis course?

 

[dieselram94]

And how many innocent people will get shot for each justified shooting? How many will draw their guns in anger in situations where guns have no place to be used? This is thinking from the 18 hundreds, not the 21st century, and the brits are quite happy with the fact that the police don´t have guns, and certainly that the average "Tommy" isn´t sporting guns around town.

Taz, you are very foolish. You can try to insult us American CITIZENS all you want by suggesting our thinking is from the 18 hundreds. However us as CITIZENS and not SUBJECTS have rights and one of them is the second amendment. The majority of guns drawn in anger would be those held illegally by criminals, much like this terrorist had. So just how well do your overbearing laws protect you anyways?

 

[0121stockpicker]

Taz, you are very foolish. You can try to insult us American CITIZENS all you want by suggesting our thinking is from the 18 hundreds. However us as CITIZENS and not SUBJECTS have rights and one of them is the second amendment. The majority of guns drawn in anger would be those held illegally by criminals, much like this terrorist had. So just how well do your overbearing laws protect you anyways?

Well they do have a much much lower rate of gun violence ?? So not sure you want to go down that path. Hey we have the 2nd and it is a Constitutional right. That's great. But lets not try and play the "who has got the better laws" as I'm not sure one can make a winning LOGICAL argument. Let just say we have it and its part of our culture / like baseball and rugby.

And I find this we are citizens, you are subjects BS pretty funny. Only someone who has not travelled abroad or done biz overseas would have such a view. When you travel and interact with people from around the world you will see we are all the same in the end. And given the group on this board is always complaining about our terrible gov that is going to stick us all in camps etc etc etc I am very surprised to hear you put down other governments?? I would think you would be posting how good they have it. Believe me your average Brit DOES NOT believe that THEIR gov is going to stick them in FEMA camps or kill them with a drone??

 

[dieselram94]

Picker, I was only responding to his remarks about 18 hundreds thinking. The general tone of his post was how us as Americans are stuck in the past. We have the best country in the world, however if we don't change direction soon we will have the most oppressive govt around.

 

[dieselram94]

Also, I am not sure why someone from another country thinks their opinion matters in this? Now before you get all wound up I am NOT saying they are dumb, but rather it doesn't concern them. Their culture is one were the govt is the most important entity and we up until recently subscribed to the thought that our citizens were the most important entities. Citizen vs subject...

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

And how many innocent people will get shot for each justified shooting? How many will draw their guns in anger in situations where guns have no place to be used? This is thinking from the 18 hundreds, not the 21st century, and the brits are quite happy with the fact that the police don´t have guns, and certainly that the average "Tommy" isn´t sporting guns around town.

We are in 21 century and world is a lot more dangerous....

I have a god given right and a constitutional right to keep and bear arms and I will never ever surrender that right to anyone

I have a conceal carry permit and I carry, wife and I just returned from dinner and I was armed. I carry on my body 90+% of the time when I leave home and if not on my person it is in my car.



Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[0121stockpicker]

We are in 21 century and world is a lot more dangerous....

I have a god given right and a constitutional right to keep and bear arms and I will never ever surrender that right to anyone

I have a conceal carry permit and I carry, wife and I just returned from dinner and I was armed. I carry on my body 90+% of the time when I leave home and if not on my person it is in my car.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Actually that is incorrect. Crime rate in the US are way down and at multi decade lows. Most of the crime continued to be in poor urban areas. So unless you are unfortunately in the poor section of a city you are about as safe as you've ever been in this country.

Yes the second is in the constitution but lets not try and "justify" it's existence. It's in the constitution so its a right. Doesn't make it a good or bad law so lets not try and justify it because there is no need - its a right. Just like the fifth.

 

[dieselram94]

Unfortunately the left is trying to destroy the constitution. The fight is always there. Crime may be REPORTED low but where I live it is not. I have personal experiance in this point so please don't tell me I am wrong...

 

[0121stockpicker]

Unfortunately the left is trying to destroy the constitution. The fight is always there. Crime may be REPORTED low but where I live it is not. I have personal experiance in this point so please don't tell me I am wrong...

Yes and that is unfortunate but the facts are the facts. As discussed many times before a personal experience may be an interesting datapoint but is irrelevant in a discussion.

Left destroying the constitution. I'd say bush and the patriot act was the biggest blow to the constitution in decades and decades - wouldn't you agree?

 

[dieselram94]

I agree the patriot act was a huge blow, however my previous point is, and I should have made it clearer is a lot of crime goes unreported...
Right now the left is leading many assaults on our rights, agree?

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Yes the patriot act was a huge attack on our rights and it still is as long as it remains in place. Current adminstration is keeping it in place just as Bush did......

Bush was not trying to turn us into a socialist/marxist state, Bush was not trying to run all the christian soldiers out of the military, and was not trying to disarm the american citizens either......

 

[dieselram94]

Agreed...

 

[0121stockpicker]

Yes the patriot act was a huge attack on our rights and it still is as long as it remains in place. Current adminstration is keeping it in place just as Bush did......

Bush was not trying to turn us into a socialist/marxist state, Bush was not trying to run all the christian soldiers out of the military, and was not trying to disarm the american citizens either......

Bush sent this country into a massive deficit spiral and have free socialist drugs to all the old people creating the biggest new entitlement in decades and decades to buy the AARP vote?? You sure have a very very selective memory!!

 

[dieselram94]

Obama has taken the deficit spiral and exponentially accelerated it.

 

[0121stockpicker]

Yes the patriot act was a huge attack on our rights and it still is as long as it remains in place. Current adminstration is keeping it in place just as Bush did......

Bush was not trying to turn us into a socialist/marxist state, Bush was not trying to run all the christian soldiers out of the military, and was not trying to disarm the american citizens either......

Bush was spending at a much greater rate than any democrat / "leftist" that ever came before him - save maybe when FDR turned the country socialist with socialist security and Medicare. Do you really think there is absolutely any defense for Bush's actions and track record? Its because of the bush administration that i completely lost my faith in the so called Republican Party.

 

[dieselram94]

Key point is before him Obama is after bush and a much larger spender.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Actually that is incorrect. Crime rate in the US are way down and at multi decade lows. Most of the crime continued to be in poor urban areas. So unless you are unfortunately in the poor section of a city you are about as safe as you've ever been in this country.

Yes the second is in the constitution but lets not try and "justify" it's existence. It's in the constitution so its a right. Doesn't make it a good or bad law so lets not try and justify it because there is no need - its a right. Just like the fifth.

Wrong, crime rate may be down, the fact it is way down in Florida, why is it down, because we have the right to conceal carry here, but the fact remains it is a much more dangerous time, as population goes up danger goes up.... Crime can happen anywhere, any place any time, we have had more than enough examples of that, to say or imply you only need to be concern about your safety when your in poor urban areas is ludicrus....

As far as justify it's existence, that is a right I was born with......I was born with the right to defend myself and my family's life, I was born American which only helps ensure the original right that i was born with in the first place which is the right to protect my family and myself.....