Wagoner's Lost Ledge

[markmar]

Circles

I found an absurd answer, like this story, for how Wagoner survived in the cold nights. He had a thermal ointment brought from an old Viking wizard. He would oil himself with that ointment and fall asleep naked.

 

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[cuzimloony]

So, for Mexican miners existed thick wood but for a hiker not? I can't understand your mindset. Are you a robot?

[Outro]
Round and round and
Round and round and
Round and round and
Round and round and
Round!

 

[cuzimloony]

So, for Mexican miners existed thick wood but for a hiker not? I can't understand your mindset. Are you a robot?

One thing I miss from Pennsylvania, is large trees. There are none here. It doesn't rain enough for a tree to get large. Only at springs are there large trees and there aren't enough to sustain centuries of outdoor fires from natives, ranchers, miners....and hikers.
The GoPro Hero 13 is 5K, not 4 so........ and I'm not going to black out, hide and lord any knowledge over my fellow THunters. I don't want us going in circles.

 

[SPARTANOC]

So, for Mexican miners existed thick wood but for a hiker not? I can't understand your mindset. Are you a robot?

The whole "circle" thing is getting me dizzy, Markmar.

I think we can safely say, the Wagoner as tough as he might have been - he would never of survived in the Winter out there with little to no gear, like we use today - let alone what they used back then. Yes, most of the year - probably wouldn't be an issue for the old guy to spend a night or so out there, but Cizimloony really does make the good point, of thinking that a guy with health issues (breathing issues) - to be able to get out there in the Winter and STAY out there for any length of time (more than a day), just doesn't make sense.

Don't throw out 'common sense' with the bathwater when it comes to looking at these old stories. We can all research all day long, but one still shouldn't leave out the simplest stance of common sense in the end. Just saying....

-SpartanOC

 

[markmar]

The whole "circle" thing is getting me dizzy, Markmar.

I think we can safely say, the Wagoner as tough as he might have been - he would never of survived in the Winter out there with little to no gear, like we use today - let alone what they used back then. Yes, most of the year - probably wouldn't be an issue for the old guy to spend a night or so out there, but Cizimloony really does make the good point, of thinking that a guy with health issues (breathing issues) - to be able to get out there in the Winter and STAY out there for any length of time (more than a day), just doesn't make sense.

Don't throw out 'common sense' with the bathwater when it comes to looking at these old stories. We can all research all day long, but one still shouldn't leave out the simplest stance of common sense in the end. Just saying....

-SpartanOC

Barry Storm wrote Wagoner would go for three days, nobody else. Knowing where the mine is, I would say how someone could make the round trip in one day.
What Wagoner would do in the cold night of the winter, was just my opinion and an answer to a question made by cuzinloony. I didn't know an opinion would take back so much bashing.
if the questions are made in regards to find a motivation to underestimate and to mock people, then maybe is better to remain everybody silent. When someone doesn't use his brain, for sure will use his legs to make trips searching in vain, or in circles. Round and round like a hound.

 

[markmar]

One thing I miss from Pennsylvania, is large trees. There are none here. It doesn't rain enough for a tree to get large. Only at springs are there large trees and there aren't enough to sustain centuries of outdoor fires from natives, ranchers, miners....and hikers.
The GoPro Hero 13 is 5K, not 4 so........ and I'm not going to black out, hide and lord any knowledge over my fellow THunters. I don't want us going in circles.

I didn't mean fir or oaks as a thick wood. I mentioned it after in a paranthesis. But you maybe lost that post, can't understood or do it in purpose to ignore.

 

[cuzimloony]

Barry Storm wrote Wagoner would go for three days, nobody else. Knowing where the mine is, I would say how someone could make the round trip in one day.
What Wagoner would do in the cold night of the winter, was just my opinion and an answer to a question made by cuzinloony. I didn't know an opinion would take back so much bashing.
if the questions are made in regards to find a motivation to underestimate and to mock people, then maybe is better to remain everybody silent. When someone doesn't use his brain, for sure will use his legs to make trips searching in vain, or in circles. Round and round like a hound.

You know, when I said I was going to go out there everyone was supportive, except 1 person.
When I came back with pics and video, everyone was appreciative, supportive and actually encouraged me to do more. Everyone that is, except for 1 person.
Markmar has been so insecure and jealous of my efforts, that he even said I WOULD BE KILLED, among other garbage to try and discourage me from going.
Now, Im reading about how people "use their legs when they dont use their brains," which is clearly said by someone who only leaves the house for doctors appointments.
Im getting fed up with this fat mouthed loser, sorry everyone.
I dont know why my videos are causing him such insecurity, but Im enjoying it now. Im going to make some videos just for him now.
I invite you to leave your living room markmar, come to the Sups and threaten me in a way that's not online.
Shouldn't telling someone they're going to be killed (and it wasnt said as a word of caution, friend to friend. It was a threat, considering the other garbage that came out of his keyboard) be a reason for a permanent ban from TNet?
Im not that petty. Let me just say, as a shorter guy, I dont get an opportunity very often to feel "bigger than my britches." Im not an intimidating guy in the slightest, and seeing how insecure and jealous markmar is of me and my efforts, and considering the things he's "typed" to and about me, Im going to take this opportunity by the horns.

 

[SPARTANOC]

Barry Storm wrote Wagoner would go for three days, nobody else. Knowing where the mine is, I would say how someone could make the round trip in one day.
What Wagoner would do in the cold night of the winter, was just my opinion and an answer to a question made by cuzinloony. I didn't know an opinion would take back so much bashing.
if the questions are made in regards to find a motivation to underestimate and to mock people, then maybe is better to remain everybody silent. When someone doesn't use his brain, for sure will use his legs to make trips searching in vain, or in circles. Round and round like a hound.

Markmar,

No one said you can't have an opinion - what's strange is you won't recognize the common sense Cuzimloony has stated AND you change the story (not just this one), on multiple occasions. Sometimes you speak as if you were there - right along with whom ever we are discussing about. Then when someone confronts your statements as strange, you then get defensive. No one is dismissing your opinions, as that's what we all do here and we DO enjoy your impute. We really do. The thing that drives most here crazy are the, round and round of none sense. I could be reaching, but there might be a language barrier you're experiencing (as we all are) and due to some of what you write is difficult to decipher; might be the very reason why things get exasperated, compounding the confusion of what's been stated. It's only a thought, not a dig at you.

-SpatanOC

 

[cuzimloony]

Here is what Tom Kollenborn though of the hike I did, and by extension, the hike the Wagoner took, according to Tom's and the bs map.

 

[cuzimloony]

If im looking at this correctly, there is a number 10 with a circle inside another circle (spanish gold symbol?) on Julia's map, right at/near modern day Whiskey Springs. This is near The Wagoner's "spot" on the bs map right?
Any thoughts on what that might mean?

 

[markmar]

You know, when I said I was going to go out there everyone was supportive, except 1 person.
When I came back with pics and video, everyone was appreciative, supportive and actually encouraged me to do more. Everyone that is, except for 1 person.
Markmar has been so insecure and jealous of my efforts, that he even said I WOULD BE KILLED, among other garbage to try and discourage me from going.
Now, Im reading about how people "use their legs when they dont use their brains," which is clearly said by someone who only leaves the house for doctors appointments.
Im getting fed up with this fat mouthed loser, sorry everyone.
I dont know why my videos are causing hin such insecurity, but Im enjoying it now. Im going to make some videos just for him now.
I invite you to leave your living room markmar, come to the Sups and threaten me in a way that's not online.
Shouldn't telling someone they're going to be killed (and it wasnt said as a word of caution, friend to friend. It was a threat, considering the other garbage that came out of his keyboard) be a reason for a permanent ban from TNet?
Im not that petty. Let me just say, as a shorter guy, I dont get an opportunity very often to feel "bigger than my britches." Im not an intimidating guy in the slightest and seeing how insecure and jealous markmar is of me and my efforts, and considering the things he's "typed" to and about me, Im going to take this opportunity by the horns.

The bigger BS I read in my life. I'm sure your eyes are brown. You can go everywhere you want, because i don't give a s&it, I'm envy only because you have a GOpro and I haven't one, to record all the hounds out there, when my doctors gime their assent to get out my house. Round and round like a hound (quatro). You have to learn to accept answers to your provocations, lil city boy.

 

[markmar]

If im looking at this correctly, there is a number 10 with a circle inside another circle (spanish gold symbol?) on Julia's map, right at/near modern day Whiskey Springs. This is near The Wagoner's "spot" on the bs map right?
Any thoughts on what that might mean?
View attachment 2180582

Don't answer, is a trap!

 

[SPARTANOC]

If im looking at this correctly, there is a number 10 with a circle inside another circle (spanish gold symbol?) on Julia's map, right at/near modern day Whiskey Springs. This is near The Wagoner's "spot" on the bs map right?
Any thoughts on what that might mean?
View attachment 2180582

I'm not sure THAT map (Julia's) is even a legit map. From what I've been told - that's a bogus one and leads to nothing....

....maybe PotBelly Jim can elaborate?

-SpartanOC

 

[cuzimloony]

I'm not sure THAT map (Julia's) is even a legit map. From what I've been told - that's a bogus one and leads to nothing....

....maybe PotBelly Jim can elaborate?

-SpartanOC

A bogus map? NO WAY! lol
This was in the Kollenborn, well, the Swanson book in my previous post.
I just saw the marking in our "area of interest" of the Wagoners Ledge and thought it might be worth a discussion.

 

[SPARTANOC]

A bogus map? NO WAY! lol
This was in the Kollenborn, well, the Swanson book in my previous post.
I just saw the marking in our "area of interest" of the Wagoners Ledge and thought it might be worth a discussion.

Well, from what little I know about Treasure symbols, Garret states as followed (see insert) - see bottom right for symbol.

 

[cuzimloony]

Well, from what little I know about Treasure symbols, Garret states as followed (see insert) - see bottom right for symbol.

View attachment 2180583

The sun symbol doubles as a symbol for God, and gold too. Im not sure Julia would have been versed in that though....

 

[SPARTANOC]

The sun symbol doubles as a symbol for God, and gold too. Im not sure Julia would have been versed in that though....

She wouldn't have known....

As for the symbol representing Gold - I believe the center hole needs to be filled in, to represent a gold symbol, referencing gold near by...

 

[cuzimloony]

She wouldn't have known....

As for the symbol representing Gold - I believe the center hole needs to be filled in, to represent a gold symbol, referencing gold near by...

Right and agreed. Why would Julia have this symbol on her map? What would it mean to her?
On my hike, I noticed nothing out of the ordinary in "this" area, but I didn't have this map on my mind when I went through and didn't pay special attention to this spot.

 

[SPARTANOC]

Right and agreed. Why would Julia have this symbol on her map? What would it mean to her?
On my hike, I noticed nothing out of the ordinary in "this" area, but I didn't have this map on my mind when I went through and didn't pay special attention to this spot.

With regards to the Jacob story - the Waltz map I believe is the ONLY valid map. The question then begs; did Julia have the Waltz map when she went out there?

 

[cuzimloony]

With regards to the Jacob story - the Waltz map I believe is the ONLY valid map. The question then begs; did Julia have the Waltz map when she went out there?

Im not trying to steer this to the Waltz story. My apologies. I was looking into Whiskey Springs in relation to the Wagoner, and just happened to notice (its a few pages away in the Swanson book) this spot on her map in the same general area.
After this experience, treasure maps dont mean much to me anymore, however, they are a necessary evil and need to be discussed in this TH world.
So, the Julia map, the Wagoner bs map AND the Mexican girl story all lead to this area, or at least there were strange symbols on the Julia map in this area.
Those are the distractions, published maps, (LOOK HERE!!) imo....... but that needs to be fleshed out.
Im not changing the theme of the thread. It's just that there are multiple stories leading to this area and imo should be discussed all w/i the same context.