Treasure of the 7th Seal... NOT the Beale Treasure

[Justintime]

Jefferson was a illuminati, was it founded in 1776. Most Master Masons didn't even realize that they existed.

 

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[Rebel - KGC]

Can YOU prove Thomas Jefferson was a Master Mason or Illuminati?

 

[Justintime]

What would that prove.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

DUH! Read "post" # 190 again, then... YOU said TJ was Illuminati; I asked YOU to show PROOF. TJ was very "enlightened"... BUT! A member of the Illuminati? LOL! Show PROOF!

 

[Justintime]

Can you disProve.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Can you disProve.

OF COURSE! NO records... DOCUMENTATIONS! Got a meeting to go to... BBL.

 

[ECS]

STILL TJ was NOT a FreeMason, which was MY MAIN "focus".

Thomas Jefferson was a member of Charlottesville Lodge No 90,and was involved with Door To Virtue Lodge No 44,Albermarle,Va,as was his son in law,Thomas M Randolph,grandson,Thomas J Randolph,and nephews,Peter & Samuel Carr.
Incidently,both Lewis & Clark were also Freemasons.
FAMOUS MASONS

 

[bigscoop]

This is a subject that has been debated endlessly, if TJ was or was not a Freemason? My input is simply this, when one reads all they can about TJ, including his personal letters, etc., it becomes extremely difficult to imagine that he would have belonged to any such organization because he personally held little trust in any of them.

 

[bigscoop]

"Thomas Jefferson was Illuminati. Why do you think he and Benjamin Franklin went to France to look at the site where the Ark of the Covenant was stored before it was moved to the United States."

I have never seen anything written by either man claiming this or even eluding to it. I have seen writings by other men who claim this, but nothing of these (in bold) claims by either Jefferson or Franklin. But would love to read these documents if you can direct me to them.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Bigscoop, Not everything in the World can be proven to be exact or correct, we sometimes have to take known facts and believe. The Bible is the same way there is not too much documented proof, you only have to believe and do, I believe both to be of undeniable proof.

Is THIS turning into a RELGION thread? HOPE NOT! Define "Illuminati"... if "f" mean an "Enlightened Being", TJ was that... BUT! He was NEVER a member of the FreeMasonic/Masonic Order NOR a member of the Illuminati Order. Show PROOF; NOT gonna take it on "faith". TJ WAS GREATLY influenced by ROSICRUCUAN philosophy from his years in France. and he even wrote a ANTI-Illuminati paper/letter; I will try to find it.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Witt was Illuminati?

 

[bigscoop]

Franklin, actually that's a fair question as it applies to your theory. So let me say this, there is nothing wrong with religion. However, as it applies to your theory I wish Jefferson was alive to answer this question for you. If you read his views concerning the church and those organizations related to them, you when then understand why he would never belong to such orders. Jefferson was very conscious/aware of how a personal relationship with these organizations would/could create serious conflicts of interest, he even has letters explaining his feelings about this issue. There are even a few letters in existence where he denies offers of various participations for just these same reasons.

As for things being documented, if it isn't documented then it's most likely just speculation. These men could hardly step into the public eye without it being documented or recorded by someone. The very notion that they were able to travel about and operate in some secret worldly circle is simply the creative thinking of men, much less be able to arrange super secret vaults loaded with treasures from around the world. When you consider the accumulated labor, the time, the cost, etc.......someone most certainly would have noticed and/or spoken of it.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

LOL! GREAT answer...

 

[bigscoop]

I have read a great deal about Jefferson and I can tell you this, Jefferson was keenly aware of the issues and reasons and importance of, "separation of church and state". He would never place himself in a position where it could be looked upon and/or claimed that he was taking sides, or that he was possibly being influenced in any way, he avoid this like the plague. It is for this reason that many have even made unfounded claims that he was an atheist. In reality, he was just extremely intelligent.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

TJ was a DEIST, like MANY other Founding Fathers.

 

[bigscoop]

TJ was a DEIST, like MANY other Founding Fathers.

I would say that is an accurate statement. And given his political position it is most unlikely that he would not have risked connecting himself to any organization that even hinted at possessing religious roots or motivations, no matter how secret it might have appeared to be.

 

[bigscoop]

I can not follow your last post---------Are you saying that a person can not be a politician and have a religion? If I understand what you have written that seems to be an accurate summary of what you have written above about Thomas Jefferson. Heaven help us if there is not any religious politicians. Sounds like a Mitt Romney supporter to me.

You're speculating as to a possible alternate meaning of what has actually been written/stated. There is no hidden secret meaning, only what has been stated in the opinion/assessment. Your post is a prefect example of why Jefferson would never place himself in the whole speculative religious turmoil. Already you have summarized that I am a Mitt Romney supporter. Your above post is a prime example as to why some rumors and legends endure, because others will read what you have stated and they will pass it along as if it were the gospel, when in reality it is a completely unfounded statement/claim with entirely no evidence to support it whatsoever. A hundred years from now Bigscoop will have the history of having possibly been Illuminati.

 

[bigscoop]

Exactly! He studied the bible for, "himself".....and to suit his own "personal" purposes. What I said was that he didn't personally connect himself with any religious groups or organizations. Huge difference. To this day this is why his personal religious beliefs are still in such debate.

 

[Justintime]

To undetstand fully, the "Beale Treasure", Got to understand the DoI, why was July 4, 1776, on the Aug. 2,1776,calligraphied version which they all signed, that important of a document,wrong date. (4,17)(6) masonic code. Look up 4/17 secret. Declaration Of Independence, Few Weeks latet signed to the conditions, united action. Justsayn

 

[Justintime]

4/17 secret, what's the importance of the date July 4,1776,, what does 4/17/6 represent,the biggest code ever