Possible source of stone used in Peralta tablets

[Clay Diggins]

Polzer
also the very same who wrote an article about Jesuit mines and mining activity. Later denounced all Jesuit mining activity as being fairytales and represented the Jesuit order when an ancient silver mine was discovered in Mexico, in the vane attempt to claim it for the order.

Excellent information! Could you direct me to the source for this lawsuit? I don't seem to have it in my library.

 

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[Al D]

I am missing your humor, a bit over my head

 

[Clay Diggins]

An 1879 mechanical drill could have easily carved the stones
recall that some indigenous peoples of the southwest carved in sandstone only using other stones or antler

So could a laser or a knife or a hard stick with some mud on it carve sandstone. Just because something could have happened maybe sometime isn't evidence it did happen.

I'm curious, why does the date of the electric drill use trouble you?

 

[Clay Diggins]

I am missing your humor, a bit over my head

It was a serious post. It seems you have a personal problem with me posting here. Why do you assume the knowledge I seek to acquire is a joke?

Do you or do you not have the case Polzar prosecuted for the Jesuit claim to a silver mine?

It's a simple question that isn't meant to entertain or amuse. I study law and a mineral law case involving the Jesuits in the new world would be right in my field of study.

 

[Al D]

It doesn't bother me at all,
The whole argument of authentic or hoax rest upon the perceived technology used to create the stone tablets along with the interpretation that 1847 is a date.
these tablets could have been made in the late 1800’s or even earlier.
there is no proven definitive evidence to support the conclusion that the stone tablets are a hoax.
no one wants to invest time researching a hoax, this is why that question is so important to answer

 

[PotBelly Jim]

What, there's a magazine article about this? Jeez, I never knew.

 

[Al D]

I do not have any legal documentation pertaining to the mine claim event, it was a newspaper article

 

[PotBelly Jim]

The game's back on, Giants are having a bad day.

I see the Mods deleted our LDM Fight Club posts.

My apologies to the mods, sorry to interfere with your Sunday, football games, etc. I'll be good for the rest of the weekend

 

[Clay Diggins]

It doesn't bother me at all,
The whole argument of authentic or hoax rest upon the perceived technology used to create the stone tablets along with the interpretation that 1847 is a date.
these tablets could have been made in the late 1800’s or even earlier.
there is no proven definitive evidence to support the conclusion that the stone tablets are a hoax.
no one wants to invest time researching a hoax, this is why that question is so important to answer

Well I do understand your concern about a hoax.

The question I have is what is the hoax?

The rocks are what they are, they don't purport to be a map or a treasure or anything but what they are. There is no inducement to action or encouragement to believe anything in particular.

They are decorated by random cartoon figures and piss poor "Spanish" inscriptions on some rock from near Flagstaff. I don't see any "hoax" in that.

If you see other meanings in these rocks - good for you. At this point there are as many "solutions" and treasure theories associated with these rocks as there are seekers. I don't see any consensus on their meaning.

I think these rocks are accomplishing what they were designed for. To distract, delight and confuse the viewer. They have done that quite well.

 

[Clay Diggins]

I do not have any legal documentation pertaining to the mine claim event, it was a newspaper article

I don't need legal documentation. Could you direct me to the newspaper or give me the name of the parties to the case, maybe a date or name of the mine?

If I have some basic information I have sources that will enable me to find, download and study the case.

 

[Al D]

I will try to find it, I never throw anything away, but my filing system is chaotic

 

[Idahodutch]

Well I do understand your concern about a hoax.

The question I have is what is the hoax?

The rocks are what they are, they don't purport to be a map or a treasure or anything but what they are. There is no inducement to action or encouragement to believe anything in particular.

They are decorated by random cartoon figures and piss poor "Spanish" inscriptions on some rock from near Flagstaff. I don't see any "hoax" in that.

If you see other meanings in these rocks - good for you. At this point there are as many "solutions" and treasure theories associated with these rocks as there are seekers. I don't see any consensus on their meaning.

I think these rocks are accomplishing what they were designed for. To distract, delight and confuse the viewer. They have done that quite well.

Clay, this question of what is the hoax?
I am not a stone maps guy, and I am not sure what the hoax is about either.

I think (bad idea sometimes) maybe is is more of a debate as to if the stones were created sometime in the past, and buried, then were found next to the superstitions …. Or …. Did someone carve the stones, and fake the find?

I am not trying to offend anybody, just have a question is all.
I don’t mean to be asking at such a beginners level.

Idahodutch

 

[deducer]

What, there's a magazine article about this? Jeez, I never knew.

View attachment 2104617

Imagine the same magazine offering advice on kissing ostriches is, according to someone in here, also the final authority on the authenticity of the Stone Maps?

 

[PotBelly Jim]

I believe ostrich kissing was introduced by Fr. Eusebio K. as a way to ensure the salvation of the native souls in his care. Sainthood, here we come!

Oops, sorry, someone let the fox into the ostrich hen-house. On purpose. Fr. Polzer did his work well. Not that I have anything against Fr. Eusebio or Fr. Charles.

Fr. Polzer produced accurate history, nothing deleted, nothing massaged, nothing to see here. It's all documented at an institution of higher learning therefore it is now fact and can be quoted smugly by all sorts of good folk.

I doubt anyone's going to find a record of Polzer sashaying down to Old Mexico, inquiring about mine ownership, in any database. But there is a record of it, nonetheless.

 

[Clay Diggins]

Yeah it would be foolish to expect a database of old court cases in Mexico. From what I hear they don't even know about shoes or combs there - very backwards.

For those who aren't interested in Ostrich kissing there is always these records:
Ramo Civil: 1533–1857 (Civil Division: 1533–1857). 1989.
Documentos Civiles, 1626–1886 (Civil Documents, 1626–1886). 1988.
Ramo de Tierras, 1523–1822 (Land Records, 1523–1822). 1989–1992.

I find it interesting that Mexico keeps a database of all court cases nationwide since 1533 in it's Archivo General de la Nacion in Mexico City but in the U.S. you have to search out each individual court and request a copy of the record if they still have it. Different databases for different folk.

I often see on this forum the misunderstanding about Spanish colonial and Mexican record keeping. The Spanish were obsessed with record keeping and made a note of every quill, spoon and shoe purchased and used as well as personal and family records. The Spanish were record keeping nuts and the Mexicans no less so. If it happened it got written down on paper and filed. The final dates you see on the archives above are when the entire collection was fully imaged.

 

[Clay Diggins]

Imagine the same magazine offering advice on kissing ostriches is, according to someone in here, also the final authority on the authenticity of the Stone Maps?

View attachment 2104628

Yeah reading the actual DAI report compared to the tourist article in the pretty magazine can be quite instructive.

Unfortunately the popular press isn't really equipped or designed to convey scientific reports into usable material for the public. They tend to summarize, rewrite and pick out the sensational parts for their purposes and the science gets left behind. Pretty pictures though.

Who here is relying on the pretty magazine article as a final authority? All I see in this thread is PotBelly Jim's several magazine images. I don't think he has written that he relies on the magazine article clippings as a final authority. Maybe I missed that.

 

[goldnlead77]

Sounds to me like some clay Authority has a intrest in steeling what someone else finds. Like it’s his to do what he pleases. The Jesuits are a far cry from Jesus lol. Looks like he’s here to lay claim. Farewell my brethren 🙏. I’ll keep what I find and donate what I feel suits. Thief is what thief does. I won’t post anymore about Jesuits markers, you can leave now 🤚.

 

[goldnlead77]

The maps are real. Anyone can say whatever they want, it doesn’t change the fact that they are real. Unfortunately there are people who think they can steel anything they want through laws lol. You can’t steel what you can find😃. Finders keepers losers weepers. Authority needs to find somewhere else

 

[goldnlead77]

Peoples will say they’re fake and as soon as someone finds it they’ll be the first to suit up and go to try and steal it like the sinner they are!!!!

 

[goldnlead77]

Thank you to sky…, oro, Alan, potbelly, … sorry if I missed any. God bless you guy’s. I’ll check in at a later date🍀