Please post your suggestions and comments!

[hogge]

OK so we GPS our favorite civil war camp on private property and keep a log of the finds. Now who was it we are doing this for? I know where the spot is. Is that not enough? You all are not seriously thinking of sharing coordinates of our finds are you? lol Maybe I missed something?


TnMountains

All my GPSing in done on Private Land.

No its not enough for just you to know where the land is, if you are finding significant finds. Otherwise, when you die the information dies with you. Who are you to want to keep this to yourself. Do you not care about the history you are saving, because without context its a meaningless piece of metal!

I'm not saying that sharing this with just anyone is the way to go, & I understand Silver Searcher when he worries abouts sites being banned (even though this is rare in most cases).

The fact that you don't record is as much your lose as everyone elses. It has, since I started, double my find rate, so you would be crazy not to (IMHO).

I keep these maps, along with the farmers involved & we do not share them with the Archies until we need to. ie. the field is being developed into housing/road - in which case why protect the site that will soon be concreted.

The point of me having the maps is to bring a form of professionalism which makes future attacks on me pointless. I will never be accused of robbing the countryside of its information. However, you might be in the future which will bring curtain consequences.
You can all carry on being selfish & protecting your rights to do your will, but look where its getting you. I think we have struck the right balance in the UK & I have never been stopped from detecting any site & now the Archies are helping me find other good sites to do, they are sharing what they have & helping me. Does this happen over there?

This is not all aimed at you personally, as I respect you and your input to this site, but I read above some very sad views.

WE SHOULD ALL WANT TO PRESERVE OUR HISTORY FOR FUTURE STUDY. (or do we just want to flog it on ebay!)

I don't know how it works over in the UK, but I know how it works over here. Once you start Re-writing laws or ethics codes, it opens the door for other "Groups" to interpret, or MISINTERPRET, what you were trying to say. One misplaced word in a law or code, can open the door for more restrictions. Kind of like when "your" government stepped in and confiscated ALL the firearms in England. Or don't you see anything wrong with that?

So, lets get to the point. Are you against, the proper recording of significant historial items? or are you against writing down rules?

There are very tight rules about digging the Thames Foreshore & until recently I believed it was the 3 inch rule. ie no digging over 3 inches. However, this is all changed by the National Council for Metal Detecting (NCMD), lobbying the authorities & we can now dig to the bottom of the hardpack riverbed. This shows how a organisation which prides itself in having Law obiding members can over turn unfair rules!

Do nothing or fighting back is not the way to go. Take the initative & be one step ahead is your best option.
The Portable Antiquities Scheme in the UK was thought to be a joke when it started, everyone said, 'why would I volenteer to record an items location when the Law doesn't exist to force me'. It is now so popular now that it can not keep up with the thousands of things being brought in all of the time. It's a huge successful NATIONAL RESOURSE for all to use, locations are blanked out!

Why would you have issue over any of this?

NOW your first statement in this post is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Take those 2 words "Proper" and "Significant". Who decides what the proper way to record a find is? You, the State, or the Country you live in? Who decides what a "Significant" find is. Does it have to do with say....worth over "X" amount of money? Which gives the town, municipality, county, state, or gov't, the option of taking that find from you, based on by being deemed a "Significant" historical find?? Even though it was found on private land with the permission of the landowner? When you set precident by interpretation of any written law, you open the door for MISINTERPRETATION. All this takes is "1" KEY word in ANY written law, to open the door for misenterpretation of what that law was meant for! Anti- gun advocates are taking a phrase, "Well regulated militia", by saying there is no longer a well regulated militia, to take our right to bear arms away. Gun ownership is in our countries "Bill of Rights". Now is this a RIGHT or a Privelige as you call it? So how did you feel in England, when the gov't confiscated ALL of the personal firearms in your country? Even ones that were passed down from generation to generation as family heirlooms and personal property??

 

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[CRUSADER]

OK so we GPS our favorite civil war camp on private property and keep a log of the finds. Now who was it we are doing this for? I know where the spot is. Is that not enough? You all are not seriously thinking of sharing coordinates of our finds are you? lol Maybe I missed something?


TnMountains

All my GPSing in done on Private Land.

No its not enough for just you to know where the land is, if you are finding significant finds. Otherwise, when you die the information dies with you. Who are you to want to keep this to yourself. Do you not care about the history you are saving, because without context its a meaningless piece of metal!

I'm not saying that sharing this with just anyone is the way to go, & I understand Silver Searcher when he worries abouts sites being banned (even though this is rare in most cases).

The fact that you don't record is as much your lose as everyone elses. It has, since I started, double my find rate, so you would be crazy not to (IMHO).

I keep these maps, along with the farmers involved & we do not share them with the Archies until we need to. ie. the field is being developed into housing/road - in which case why protect the site that will soon be concreted.

The point of me having the maps is to bring a form of professionalism which makes future attacks on me pointless. I will never be accused of robbing the countryside of its information. However, you might be in the future which will bring curtain consequences.
You can all carry on being selfish & protecting your rights to do your will, but look where its getting you. I think we have struck the right balance in the UK & I have never been stopped from detecting any site & now the Archies are helping me find other good sites to do, they are sharing what they have & helping me. Does this happen over there?

This is not all aimed at you personally, as I respect you and your input to this site, but I read above some very sad views.

WE SHOULD ALL WANT TO PRESERVE OUR HISTORY FOR FUTURE STUDY. (or do we just want to flog it on ebay!)

I don't know how it works over in the UK, but I know how it works over here. Once you start Re-writing laws or ethics codes, it opens the door for other "Groups" to interpret, or MISINTERPRET, what you were trying to say. One misplaced word in a law or code, can open the door for more restrictions. Kind of like when "your" government stepped in and confiscated ALL the firearms in England. Or don't you see anything wrong with that?

So, lets get to the point. Are you against, the proper recording of significant historial items? or are you against writing down rules?

There are very tight rules about digging the Thames Foreshore & until recently I believed it was the 3 inch rule. ie no digging over 3 inches. However, this is all changed by the National Council for Metal Detecting (NCMD), lobbying the authorities & we can now dig to the bottom of the hardpack riverbed. This shows how a organisation which prides itself in having Law obiding members can over turn unfair rules!

Do nothing or fighting back is not the way to go. Take the initative & be one step ahead is your best option.
The Portable Antiquities Scheme in the UK was thought to be a joke when it started, everyone said, 'why would I volenteer to record an items location when the Law doesn't exist to force me'. It is now so popular now that it can not keep up with the thousands of things being brought in all of the time. It's a huge successful NATIONAL RESOURSE for all to use, locations are blanked out!

Why would you have issue over any of this?

NOW your first statement in this post is EXACTLY what I'm talking about. Take those 2 words "Proper" and "Significant". Who decides what the proper way to record a find is? You, the State, or the Country you live in? Who decides what a "Significant" find is. Does it have to do with say....worth over "X" amount of money? Which gives the town, municipality, county, state, or gov't, the option of taking that find from you, based on by being deemed a "Significant" historical find?? Even though it was found on private land with the permission of the landowner? When you set precident by interpretation of any written law, you open the door for MISINTERPRETATION. All this takes is "1" KEY word in ANY written law, to open the door for misenterpretation of what that law was meant for! Anti- gun advocates are taking a phrase, "Well regulated militia", by saying there is no longer a well regulated militia, to take our right to bear arms away. Gun ownership is in our countries "Bill of Rights". Now is this a RIGHT or a Privelige as you call it? So how did you feel in England, when the gov't confiscated ALL of the personal firearms in your country? Even ones that were passed down from generation to generation as family heirlooms and personal property??

I never called it a privilege. I do what I feel is right (not what the state or Govt say) for future generations. I don't need written rules to do this, & I will always do what is right & honest to myself & the landowner, often to my own financial lose.

You still avoid my direct questions! Why would you not wish to keep records of significant historial finds (and YOU can be the judge of this is because you should know whats important & whats not, often more so than the Archies, or am I wrong about this?). Are you saying you don't know whats important? Make your own call or lets all agree guidelines instead of making excuses. We can decide, becuase we should understand more than most, becasuse we have the passion, do we not? If you feel no need to add to your countries history, then so be it, ITS YOUR RIGHT! Its also my right to try & encourage people to take pride in honesty, because I'm a advacate of what can be done. Do I suffer by my actions, what do you see?

 

[Silver Searcher]

OK so we GPS our favorite civil war camp on private property and keep a log of the finds. Now who was it we are doing this for? I know where the spot is. Is that not enough? You all are not seriously thinking of sharing coordinates of our finds are you? lol Maybe I missed something?


TnMountains

All my GPSing in done on Private Land.

No its not enough for just you to know where the land is, if you are finding significant finds. Otherwise, when you die the information dies with you. Who are you to want to keep this to yourself. Do you not care about the history you are saving, because without context its a meaningless piece of metal!

I'm not saying that sharing this with just anyone is the way to go, & I understand Silver Searcher when he worries abouts sites being banned (even though this is rare in most cases).

The fact that you don't record is as much your lose as everyone elses. It has, since I started, double my find rate, so you would be crazy not to (IMHO).

I keep these maps, along with the farmers involved & we do not share them with the Archies until we need to. ie. the field is being developed into housing/road - in which case why protect the site that will soon be concreted.

The point of me having the maps is to bring a form of professionalism which makes future attacks on me pointless. I will never be accused of robbing the countryside of its information. However, you might be in the future which will bring curtain consequences.
You can all carry on being selfish & protecting your rights to do your will, but look where its getting you. I think we have struck the right balance in the UK & I have never been stopped from detecting any site & now the Archies are helping me find other good sites to do, they are sharing what they have & helping me. Does this happen over there?

This is not all aimed at you personally, as I respect you and your input to this site, but I read above some very sad views.

WE SHOULD ALL WANT TO PRESERVE OUR HISTORY FOR FUTURE STUDY. (or do we just want to flog it on ebay!)

I don't know how it works over in the UK, but I know how it works over here. Once you start Re-writing laws or ethics codes, it opens the door for other "Groups" to interpret, or MISINTERPRET, what you were trying to say. One misplaced word in a law or code, can open the door for more restrictions. Kind of like when "your" government stepped in and confiscated ALL the firearms in England. Or don't you see anything wrong with that?

So, lets get to the point. Are you against, the proper recording of significant historial items? or are you against writing down rules?

There are very tight rules about digging the Thames Foreshore & until recently I believed it was the 3 inch rule. ie no digging over 3 inches. However, this is all changed by the National Council for Metal Detecting (NCMD), lobbying the authorities & we can now dig to the bottom of the hardpack riverbed. This shows how a organisation which prides itself in having Law obiding members can over turn unfair rules!

Do nothing or fighting back is not the way to go. Take the initative & be one step ahead is your best option.
The Portable Antiquities Scheme in the UK was thought to be a joke when it started, everyone said, 'why would I volenteer to record an items location when the Law doesn't exist to force me'. It is now so popular now that it can not keep up with the thousands of things being brought in all of the time. It's a huge successful NATIONAL RESOURSE for all to use, locations are blanked out!

Why would you have issue over any of this?

Cru...

some of the points you raise are valid, the loss of important data for one, but you have been on digs with archy's, watched time team on the box, and you have seen as well as me the disregard for the top six inches they scrape back with a 360 machine.

What about the archaeological data they are disregarding for the future seekers of history? they go straight through this to get to the era they are looking for, the word practice what you preach comes to mind(not you)

The roman road I have been detecting is a prime example of this action, six to eight inches of top soil removed in one go(no trowells or tooth brushes) what about the lost history lost here. and now I am having trouble detecting the spoil heaps that soon will be sold off for top soil.

Most of our detecting is done in Fields that have been ploughed for hundreds of years, finds could be a very long way from were they were originally lost, making GPS insignificant (my opinion)

Going back to the Archy's bit, the problem here is trust, I certainly don't trust them, you might ask why, when you have a prominet Archaeologist like Mick Aston f time team say things like, and I quote, in my opinion the top three feet of soil in England will be devoid of all metal ojects in the next twenty years, it doesn't fill the average metal detectorist with confidence.

And just a last note, how many finds in the British Meseum have actuall imformation on the cases stating these items were recovered by metal detecting and I don't meen the Mud larks contributions.

SS.

 

[CRUSADER]

OK so we GPS our favorite civil war camp on private property and keep a log of the finds. Now who was it we are doing this for? I know where the spot is. Is that not enough? You all are not seriously thinking of sharing coordinates of our finds are you? lol Maybe I missed something?


TnMountains

All my GPSing in done on Private Land.

No its not enough for just you to know where the land is, if you are finding significant finds. Otherwise, when you die the information dies with you. Who are you to want to keep this to yourself. Do you not care about the history you are saving, because without context its a meaningless piece of metal!

I'm not saying that sharing this with just anyone is the way to go, & I understand Silver Searcher when he worries abouts sites being banned (even though this is rare in most cases).

The fact that you don't record is as much your lose as everyone elses. It has, since I started, double my find rate, so you would be crazy not to (IMHO).

I keep these maps, along with the farmers involved & we do not share them with the Archies until we need to. ie. the field is being developed into housing/road - in which case why protect the site that will soon be concreted.

The point of me having the maps is to bring a form of professionalism which makes future attacks on me pointless. I will never be accused of robbing the countryside of its information. However, you might be in the future which will bring curtain consequences.
You can all carry on being selfish & protecting your rights to do your will, but look where its getting you. I think we have struck the right balance in the UK & I have never been stopped from detecting any site & now the Archies are helping me find other good sites to do, they are sharing what they have & helping me. Does this happen over there?

This is not all aimed at you personally, as I respect you and your input to this site, but I read above some very sad views.

WE SHOULD ALL WANT TO PRESERVE OUR HISTORY FOR FUTURE STUDY. (or do we just want to flog it on ebay!)

I don't know how it works over in the UK, but I know how it works over here. Once you start Re-writing laws or ethics codes, it opens the door for other "Groups" to interpret, or MISINTERPRET, what you were trying to say. One misplaced word in a law or code, can open the door for more restrictions. Kind of like when "your" government stepped in and confiscated ALL the firearms in England. Or don't you see anything wrong with that?

So, lets get to the point. Are you against, the proper recording of significant historial items? or are you against writing down rules?

There are very tight rules about digging the Thames Foreshore & until recently I believed it was the 3 inch rule. ie no digging over 3 inches. However, this is all changed by the National Council for Metal Detecting (NCMD), lobbying the authorities & we can now dig to the bottom of the hardpack riverbed. This shows how a organisation which prides itself in having Law obiding members can over turn unfair rules!

Do nothing or fighting back is not the way to go. Take the initative & be one step ahead is your best option.
The Portable Antiquities Scheme in the UK was thought to be a joke when it started, everyone said, 'why would I volenteer to record an items location when the Law doesn't exist to force me'. It is now so popular now that it can not keep up with the thousands of things being brought in all of the time. It's a huge successful NATIONAL RESOURSE for all to use, locations are blanked out!

Why would you have issue over any of this?

Cru...

some of the points you raise are valid, the loss of important data for one, but you have been on digs with archy's, watched time team on the box, and you have seen as well as me the disregard for the top six inches they scrape back with a 360 machine.

What about the archaeological data they are disregarding for the future seekers of history? they go straight through this to get to the era they are looking for, the word practice what you preach comes to mind(not you)

The roman road I have been detecting is a prime example of this action, six to eight inches of top soil removed in one go(no trowells or tooth brushes) what about the lost history lost here. and now I am having trouble detecting the spoil heaps that soon will be sold off for top soil.

Most of our detecting is done in Fields that have been ploughed for hundreds of years, finds could be a very long way from were they were originally lost, making GPS insignificant (my opinion)

Going back to the Archy's bit, the problem here is trust, I certainly don't trust them, you might ask why, when you have a prominet Archaeologist like Mick Aston f time team say things like, and I quote, in my opinion the top three feet of soil in England will be devoid of all metal ojects in the next twenty years, it doesn't fill the average metal detectorist with confidence.

And just a last note, how many finds in the British Meseum have actuall imformation on the cases stating these items were recovered by metal detecting and I don't meen the Mud larks contributions.

SS.

I totally understand & always take the mick when helping the Archies that they dug up all the finds & placed them in the heaps. Fact.
However, it leaves it for us, doesn't it
They help me find my recent Roman Site, & put back the finds when backfilling. Why complain.
We know that they are interested in archaeology which is undisturbed soil, ie cuts into the natural or unploughed fields. Thats what they do. They don't have the resourse to sift the topsoil for finds which are out of context.
I can say for sure that without GPS we would have only half the coin from this current site & I will try & explain why. (its not done for recording context, because we know they have moved).
Its 100 acres field, only 4-5 acres have coins in it (4-5%). When you plot them you see patterns that you don't see on the ground & might only see if you had Geophysed. These patterns lead to more finds. If we didn't have exact plots we could not know where the hell we were in 100acres. They took us to places which I would have never covered, & got me the Silver on Sat. Trust me, it helps!

I make no judgement on your style of detecting, I do mine & you do yours. I will just try & sell the benefits. The benefits are to me & the future generation.

I make no comment on Museums, as I seek no credits for what I do. I enjoy it as a hobby, much like fishing. The satisfaction does not come from having my name in lights.

Can you see how this might help? Next year we will hoover them up within 11ft accuracy!

 

[Silver Searcher]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

 

[hogge]

I want to answer your direct question but it is open ended. What are YOUR guidelines for classification of a "significant historical" find? Would my "Royal Irish Artillery, cartridge box sling belt tip" qualify as such? It's tied to one of the greatest battles in our nations history, The Battle of Saratoga. Or what about the 1783 CFT. KG III half penny? That's a significant historical find as it shows where these coins circulated to. (too bad on this one, as it's already been sold) . .........

 

[CRUSADER]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

All the Archies I have worked with are happy for us to do the spoil. Why do you say they don't want us to recover them? They have currently shown me fields crop marks which maybe a Celtic Temple & encouraged me to get permission to do it. You seem to base your thinking (I think), on some outdated old revivalry which we are trying to bridge. Many do not make those judgements on us, & if we record stuff then they have no reason to do so.

Museums give as fair market value. Sometimes better value than your ever make privately, I know this for a fact & I know those that do this for a living & they would much rather the museum pay the valuation than have the find back. What are you basing your judgement on? I don't understand? We have one of the best systems in Europe & should be happy with our lot?

 

[hogge]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

Good point.

 

[CRUSADER]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

Good point.

Its a good point, if you want to find weakness in each others practices. We can sit on both sides of the fence & throw stones for ever!

I learn more by compromise...

 

[hogge]

What is "Fair market value", on a "significant historical find"?? Oh ya...that's right..."$000.00 bcause you would have to surrender it to a museum or the state as being classified as a significant historical find.

 

[CRUSADER]

What is "Fair market value", on a "significant historical find"??

Its based on a panel of independant specialist, which take into account similar items sold recently (in the open market, including ebay), plus add more for its historial significance. We can all agrue about this & you have a right to have an indepenant valuator come in & fight your corner. I know that they are mostly better than you can achieve anywhere on the black market. Problem is it takes too long!

 

[CRUSADER]

What is "Fair market value", on a "significant historical find"??

also you should know more than most on this? You get what you get on the day & future prices will be based on it. Everything has a price? doesn't it?

For me its irrelevant.

 

[hogge]

What is "Fair market value", on a "significant historical find"??

Its based on a panel of independant specialist, which take into account similar items sold recently (in the open market, including ebay), plus add more for its historial significance. We can all agrue about this & you have a right to have an indepenant valuator come in & fight your corner. I know that they are mostly better than you can achieve anywhere on the black market. Problem is it takes too long!

Yes...but that costs $ too!

 

[Silver Searcher]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

All the Archies I have worked with are happy for us to do the spoil. Why do you say they don't want us to recover them? They have currently shown me fields crop marks which maybe a Celtic Temple & encouraged me to get permission to do it. You seem to base your thinking (I think), on some outdated old revivalry which we are trying to bridge. Many do not make those judgements on us, & if we record stuff then they have no reason to do so.

Museums give as fair market value. Sometimes better value than your ever make privately, I know this for a fact & I know those that do this for a living & they would much rather the museum pay the valuation than have the find back. What are you basing your judgement on? I don't understand? We have one of the best systems in Europe & should be happy with our lot?

The fact that you have been given imformation from your Archy's is down to your case findings,(your lucky)

the digs I have shown interest in have been out of reach(refused) even after they had finished the spiked the area concerned.

As for the Meseums giving market values, your way out, wht do you think inderpendeant valuation commitees are set up, don't get me wrong some Archy's welcome input from detectorists, but if there were a vote tommorow how many would lean towards detecting, and lets not forget the country stewardship scheme, how many of these farms signed up for that, allow detecting.

I have heard from three different detectorists about declared finds valuaitions, less than half what they can acheive privately, the lady who found the Gold plaque depicting Christ was offered three thousand pounds, when actually it was worth hundreds of thousands, shall I go on, I can quote more,

It's just a personel thing Cru, you have your thoughts based on what you know or heard , I have mine

 

[CRUSADER]

What is "Fair market value", on a "significant historical find"??

Its based on a panel of independant specialist, which take into account similar items sold recently (in the open market, including ebay), plus add more for its historial significance. We can all agrue about this & you have a right to have an indepenant valuator come in & fight your corner. I know that they are mostly better than you can achieve anywhere on the black market. Problem is it takes too long!

Yes...but that costs $ too!

&, in which case we should do it? The reality is if we were all honest in the UK the system would collapse. About 1 in 10 record items. I'm proud to be 1 of those 10, it make me different.

 

[CRUSADER]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

All the Archies I have worked with are happy for us to do the spoil. Why do you say they don't want us to recover them? They have currently shown me fields crop marks which maybe a Celtic Temple & encouraged me to get permission to do it. You seem to base your thinking (I think), on some outdated old revivalry which we are trying to bridge. Many do not make those judgements on us, & if we record stuff then they have no reason to do so.

Museums give as fair market value. Sometimes better value than your ever make privately, I know this for a fact & I know those that do this for a living & they would much rather the museum pay the valuation than have the find back. What are you basing your judgement on? I don't understand? We have one of the best systems in Europe & should be happy with our lot?

The fact that you have been given imformation from your Archy's is down to your case findings,(your lucky)

the digs I have shown interest in have been out of reach(refused) even after they had finished the spiked the area concerned.

As for the Meseums giving market values, your way out, wht do you think inderpendeant valuation commitees are set up, don't get me wrong some Archy's welcome input from detectorists, but if there were a vote tommorow how many would lean towards detecting, and lets not forget the country stewardship scheme, how many of these farms signed up for that, allow detecting.

I have heard from three different detectorists about declared finds valuaitions, less than half what they can acheive privately, the lady who found the Gold plaque depicting Christ was offered three thousand pounds, when actually it was worth hundreds of thousands, shall I go on, I can quote more,

It's just a personel thing Cru, you have your thoughts based on what you know or heard , I have mine

Those that make a living from it, take canning choices as to what to record. On average, most achieve more than the mobile they phone to get the cash in hand. I see it in operation, you may have seen the opposite, but in my experience, I have had items back which I could not get anywhere close to its valuation.

This is basically where we will always differ, you place a £ on it, I place a label on it & store it away. So we are coming from opposite ends of the world, you will always hear where people have been underpaid, I will hear where they have added to our history.

 

[hogge]

Everyone enters this hobby for different reasons. Some for history, enjoyment, excersize, time with friends or children. Others for the possibility of finding coins and relics worth $. Well, that's me. And quite frankly, I'm doing quite well at it. Not as well as I would like, but not bad. There are more people on T-Net, like me, than you know about. What you do, with your finds, is up to you. I don't want some state agency, or Archie, telling me what I should do with mine.

 

[Silver Searcher]

What is "Fair market value", on a "significant historical find"??

Its based on a panel of independant specialist, which take into account similar items sold recently (in the open market, including ebay), plus add more for its historial significance. We can all agrue about this & you have a right to have an indepenant valuator come in & fight your corner. I know that they are mostly better than you can achieve anywhere on the black market. Problem is it takes too long!

Why doe's it take to long.

I can find out what something is, what it's worth in less than 24 hours, why can't they?

1.. do they want it (Meseums)
2...can they afford it
3...how much is it worth
4...no to all three return
5..yes we want it but will need time to raise funds

but no takes one to two years

 

[Silver Searcher]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

All the Archies I have worked with are happy for us to do the spoil. Why do you say they don't want us to recover them? They have currently shown me fields crop marks which maybe a Celtic Temple & encouraged me to get permission to do it. You seem to base your thinking (I think), on some outdated old revivalry which we are trying to bridge. Many do not make those judgements on us, & if we record stuff then they have no reason to do so.

Museums give as fair market value. Sometimes better value than your ever make privately, I know this for a fact & I know those that do this for a living & they would much rather the museum pay the valuation than have the find back. What are you basing your judgement on? I don't understand? We have one of the best systems in Europe & should be happy with our lot?

The fact that you have been given imformation from your Archy's is down to your case findings,(your lucky)

the digs I have shown interest in have been out of reach(refused) even after they had finished the spiked the area concerned.

As for the Meseums giving market values, your way out, wht do you think inderpendeant valuation commitees are set up, don't get me wrong some Archy's welcome input from detectorists, but if there were a vote tommorow how many would lean towards detecting, and lets not forget the country stewardship scheme, how many of these farms signed up for that, allow detecting.

I have heard from three different detectorists about declared finds valuaitions, less than half what they can acheive privately, the lady who found the Gold plaque depicting Christ was offered three thousand pounds, when actually it was worth hundreds of thousands, shall I go on, I can quote more,

It's just a personel thing Cru, you have your thoughts based on what you know or heard , I have mine

Those that make a living from it, take canning choices as to what to record. On average, most achieve more than the mobile they phone to get the cash in hand. I see it in operation, you may have seen the opposite, but in my experience, I have had items back which I could not get anywhere close to its valuation.

This is basically where we will always differ, you place a £ on it, I place a label on it & store it away. So we are coming from opposite ends of the world, you will always hear where people have been underpaid, I will hear where they have added to our history.

That's incorrect (I place a £on it) infact I find that offensive

I make no bones that I sell my items, but for you to say I am only interested in money you totally off the mark.

 

[CRUSADER]

So what you are saying...

the Archy's only want to record what they want, don't care about things in the top soil(spoil heaps) but don't want us to recover them.

The Meseums want all our find, don't want to give us acknowledgement, and give little reward for our hard earned finds

All the Archies I have worked with are happy for us to do the spoil. Why do you say they don't want us to recover them? They have currently shown me fields crop marks which maybe a Celtic Temple & encouraged me to get permission to do it. You seem to base your thinking (I think), on some outdated old revivalry which we are trying to bridge. Many do not make those judgements on us, & if we record stuff then they have no reason to do so.

Museums give as fair market value. Sometimes better value than your ever make privately, I know this for a fact & I know those that do this for a living & they would much rather the museum pay the valuation than have the find back. What are you basing your judgement on? I don't understand? We have one of the best systems in Europe & should be happy with our lot?

The fact that you have been given imformation from your Archy's is down to your case findings,(your lucky)

the digs I have shown interest in have been out of reach(refused) even after they had finished the spiked the area concerned.

As for the Meseums giving market values, your way out, wht do you think inderpendeant valuation commitees are set up, don't get me wrong some Archy's welcome input from detectorists, but if there were a vote tommorow how many would lean towards detecting, and lets not forget the country stewardship scheme, how many of these farms signed up for that, allow detecting.

I have heard from three different detectorists about declared finds valuaitions, less than half what they can acheive privately, the lady who found the Gold plaque depicting Christ was offered three thousand pounds, when actually it was worth hundreds of thousands, shall I go on, I can quote more,

It's just a personel thing Cru, you have your thoughts based on what you know or heard , I have mine

Those that make a living from it, take canning choices as to what to record. On average, most achieve more than the mobile they phone to get the cash in hand. I see it in operation, you may have seen the opposite, but in my experience, I have had items back which I could not get anywhere close to its valuation.

This is basically where we will always differ, you place a £ on it, I place a label on it & store it away. So we are coming from opposite ends of the world, you will always hear where people have been underpaid, I will hear where they have added to our history.

That's incorrect (I place a £on it) infact I find that offensive

I make no bones that I sell my items, but for you to say I am only interested in money you totally off the mark.

thats not what I mean, the angle you are coming from is that people don't get what its worth. My point is, I don't care.

I know it means more to you than £s, bad wording on my part.

Lets not fall out again we are on the same side, I hope. This is just a debate after a few drinks (on my part)