Pirate Treasure-Trying to get a permit to dig up

[Bigdogdad]

WOW ECS, You're good. I hope you didn't fry your computer looking all this up tonight to try to prove me wrong. That is your intent, right? Or are you just trying to "help"? I have known this story since 1987. I have read all about what history has to say. Now let's see. The story you found on the internet says that the commander was ordered to cease all hostilities. Did you know that the merchant ship was sunk after this order. It was a diversion. Because NONE of the books talk about 4 men in a rubber raft how do you presume to know thats why he would not leave the area. The attempted sinking of the sub went on for an extended period. The sub had plenty of chances to leave. It was a sitting duck in 125 feet of water. The commander of the sub even tried to fake them out by blowing debris out the torpedo tubes.

He was not allowed to leave until the men returned from their mission. Don't try to make me look like I don't know what I am talking about. You will look like a fool. You know that this sub was not Hitler's because........because.......because you say so? If you dig a little harder and keep pressing those keys and keep moving your mouse around and keep trying to find more facts to bombard me with you will come across the info that this sub was "rumored" to be Hitlers sub. Them darn rumors. This was WAR. Germany was in chaos. This sub sinking was the LAST OFFICIAL ACTION of WWII. Don't try to lecture me on this!!!

Your insistence on trying to make fun of my stories is about to come to an end. You can't even seem to get the facts on these threads straight let alone my story or the stories from 67 years ago. I said nothing about the diamonds being in a parking lot, they were next to a parking lot. I have never claimed anything about a "chest" of silver. Montauk Point is on Long Island which is part of New York not New Jersey.

ECS-Go start your own thread. Oh that's right you did. Sorry no one was interested. Go post some more on the Swamp Gold thread. You are no longer welcome on this thread. Leave willingly or I will ask that you be banned. Your petty attempts to try to discredit me have not worked. You have only made yourself look like a jealous little 12 year old.

You don't think any German officers came to America after the war? You know this because the internet told you? Let it go ECS, why does it matter so much to you?

 

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[Bigdogdad]

The commander of the U-boat was ordered by DONITZ,on May 5,1945 to cease all hostilities,not to wait for 4 sailors on a rubber raft.The U-853 was commanded by OBERLEUFNANT HELMUT FROMSDORF,a hardcore ayran Nazi,who had recently sunk a merchant marine ship.
He was hiding in 110ft of water with snorkel up because he was being pursued by the US NAVY and COAST GUARD.
The U-853 was sunk,May 6,1945,will all 55 hands onboard.
May 8,1945,Germany surrendered.
The U-234 story illustrates the fact that Germany wanted its technology sent to Japan,it was not concerned with shipping and hiding treasures,or aiding escaping Nazis.That came later with ODESSA and der Spinne.
Once again,HITLER DID NOT HAVE A PRIVATE U-BOAT.
Where do you come up with this nonsense?Maybe YOU need to learn how to do real research.
It is also interesting that this "diamond treasure " is in a parking lot,like your chest of pirate silver.
Is it also next to an INTERSTATE or the Jersey Turnpike?

Just saving this for posterity.

 

[Bigdogdad]

For the record-I have traveled by plane to Montauk Point as part of this story. I have flown to New Jersey. I have driven to Montauk. I have driven to New Jersey three times as part of this submarine treasure story. This was all before personal computers, cell phones, google etc. I have put my heart into this story. I have had to pour through old newspapers by hand 1400 miles from my home in Southwest Florida to try to piece the whole puzzle together. There was information that was only passed from person to person regarding different aspects of this treasure. Some of these diamonds made it to Florida back in the 60's. This is a very complex story. It in itself is a Disney movie. I do not make up parts of a story on my own.

I am sorry if I get a little angry about the way my stories are treated. These people are talking about my life as a treasure hunter. I take it all VERY personal.

This ECS dude has probably known the U-853 story for about a day and a half. In the old days I would drop an "Fbob" on him. This is a kinder, gentler world we are supposed to now live in.

ECS- I will give you one more chance. This is the cache hunting forum. I would like you to share the most interesting personal cache hunting story of your own, on this thread. Keep it to one post. Make it as long as you would like. If you are not willing or can't, then do not post on here.

 

[ECS]

1. ECS, I have known this story since 1987. I have read all about what history has to say... NONE of the books talk about 4 men in a rubber raft...

2. You know that this sub was not Hitler's because........because.......because you say so?... this sub was "rumored" to be Hitlers sub. Them darn rumors...



3.ECS- You are no longer welcome on this thread. Leave willingly or I will ask that you be banned...

4.You don't think any German officers came to America after the war?

1. This story has been in treasure magazines and books since the 1960's.Yes,the rubber raft tale was in those stories.
2. You know this was Hitler's sub because? Read TRUDL JUNG's account of the last days in the bunker.She was Hitler's secretary,privy to all information and visitors, and survived the war.
3. Whenever someone questions your nonfacts,you always resort to ridicue and threats.Why is that?Could it be the fragility of the tale told?
Getting me and others banned from TN is no better than NAZI the book burning of the 30's & 40's.
4. PROJECT PAPERCLIP.authorized by President Truman,was a US WAR DEPT's JOINT INTELLIGENCE OBJECTIVES AGENCY that brought many NAZI officers and scientists to America.
These NAZI's helped to develop our space program,chemical & biological weapons development,and deployed in intelligence.I can provide you with a list of names.
Once again,BDD,I do not depend on the internet for all of my information.I have a vast library of books,many now out of print,for most of my research.
QUESTION: Was one of the raft surviving KREIGSMARINE submariners,Otto von Wolkeberg?

 

[Bigdogdad]

1. This story has been in treasure magazines and books since the 1960's.Yes,the rubber raft tale was in those stories.
2. You know this was Hitler's sub because? Read TRUDL JUNG's account of the last days in the bunker.She was Hitler's secretary,privy to all information and visitors, and survived the war.
3. Whenever someone questions your nonfacts,you always resort to ridicue and threats.Why is that?Could it be the fragility of the tale told?
Getting me and others banned from TN is no better than NAZI the book burning of the 30's & 40's.
4. PROJECT PAPERCLIP.authorized by President Truman,was a US WAR DEPT's JOINT INTELLIGENCE OBJECTIVES AGENCY that brought many NAZI officers and scientists to America.
These NAZI's helped to develop our space program,chemical & biological weapons development,and deployed in intelligence.I can provide you with a list of names.
Once again,BDD,I do not depend on the internet for all of my information.I have a vast library of books,many now out of print,for most of my research.
QUESTION: Was one of the raft surviving KREIGSMARINE submariners,Otto von Wolkeberg?

ECS- Did you happen to notice that every time you question and then make fun of and mock my stories, you are able to find information that seems to back them up? I would list them all but I am not in the mood for your childishness. Look at some of your last posts. You mocked the rubber raft story but yet you found reference to it. I said there were survivors and you have found reference to one and are wanting to verify a name.

In a prior post you said that there were no survivors. What happened to that fact? My nonfacts? Prove me wrong. Comparing me getting you off this thread to Nazi book burning. That is so inappropriate that I can't believe you actually said it. ECS- Your problems are much worse than I thought.

You stated your facts about all the Nazi's going to South America, but yet you now state many of them came to America.

You will find reference to Hitler and this sub but will probably not admit it as I suspect is the case with the Rocky Bluff silver. Whether it was his sub or not really has nothing to do with the treasure, I just threw it in as it was supposed to be the truth.

I am done answering your repeated attempts to make me look bad. This is totally against the spirit and rules of TN. I owe you no explanations for anything. Again, I think you have gained some sort of points with all this. You have only shown yourself to be a sad little person.

My story is just as I told it. Mr. ECS- the Special Prosecutor- has failed to make a case. My friend's dad found the 88mm shells. I believe I know where the diamonds are now. I am done answering questions about the U-853. End of this story. Anybody want to hear another one?

I suppose I should start a new thread but the silver story is not over. This thread is all I have the patience for.

 

[ECS]

ECS- Did you happen to notice that every time you question and then make fun of and mock my stories, you are able to find information that seems to back them up? 1.
You mocked the rubber raft story but yet you found reference to it. 2. I said there were survivors and you have found reference to one and are wanting to verify a name.

3.In a prior post you said that there were no survivors. What happened to that fact?

.
4.You stated your facts about all the Nazi's going to South America, but yet you now state many of them came to America.



5. Again, I think you have gained some sort of points with all this.

My friend's dad found the 88mm shells. I believe I know where the diamonds are now. End of this story. Anybody want to hear another one?

1.Old 1960's treasure legend magazines are not the best source of facts.
2.The US NAVY report stated no survivors.
3.You mentioned two survivors-is Otto von Wolkeberg one of your "survivors"?
4.You alluded to the fact that "high ranking Nazis 'came to America searching for their looted treasure left by U-boats.
Project Paperclip brought them here for other reasons. Der Spinne & ODESSA was the escape route for high ranking Nazis and their looted wealth to South America.
5. I didn't know we were playing for points.

 

[Bigdogdad]

1. If old magazines are not good for facts why are you using them to argue your points. I don't read them.
2. The Navy saw no survivors come up when they destroyed the sub. The raft guys were obviously no where to be found. DuH!
3. I don't personally know the names of the raft guys nor do I care.
4. I didn't say the high-ranking Nazi's made it to America to recover the treasure. I simply stated that was what it was hidden for.
5. I ALWAYS play to WIN. I stated you have won NO points.

Why do you keep bringing up unrelated irrevelant stories in regards to what I put on here? Are you just showing off your impressive reasearch skills?

In case anyone is wondering what this Bigdogdad vs ECS feud is about I will explain. ECS showed his lack of getting the details straight in regards to his own and my posts. This was on the Swamp Gold thread. He got spanked by me and has not gotten over it. So now he comes to this thread to harrass me. I know I should ignore him but as you can see I do like to argue, especially when I am right.

 

[ECS]

PAGE 6 #113 on this thread

You can take the U-853 off your list.


Today, decades after the sinking of the U-853, mystery still surrounds this wreck. Why did she attack and sink the Black Point one day after the cease fire order had been given by the acting Fuhrer? Did the U-853 receive and then ignore the order, or was the order never received? Several theories persist regarding the “true” nature of the U-853’s mission. Some say that she was designed to be Hitler’s private escape craft. Others maintain that she was transporting millions of dollars worth of mercury, cash and gold. In fact, several salvage attempts have been made on the vessel, none of which have ever resulted in the recovery of treasure. Indeed, in 1961, a full scale salvage attempt was seriously considered which would have attempted to raise the U-853 from the bottom. This project never proceeded further than the planning stages.

This salvage attempt is what started all the stories in the treasure legend magazines in the 1960's.
Most of the story is based on conjecture,NOT historical fact.
But why let facts get in the way of a good story?

 

[ECS]

In case anyone is wondering what this Bigdogdad vs ECS feud is about I will explain. ECS showed his lack of getting the details straight in regards to his own and my posts. This was on the Swamp Gold thread. He got spanked by me and has not gotten over it. So now he comes to this thread to harrass me. I know I should ignore him but as you can see I do like to argue, especially when I am right.

SPANKED!!!! Now that is a good one!
Tell them about the shaman called CLOUD MOUNTAIN and the CLOUD MOUNTAIN in the Everglades next to I-75.
You can always dispute the facts,but ,BDD,the facts always remain.

 

[Bigdogdad]

ECS-Maybe I am missing something here. Are you trying to make me look good or make yourself out to be a goober, or both? You quoted Fisheye's post. Where do you think he got that information? It was not from me. He obviously got it from somewhere. I read all of it before in books, not magazines. Everything Fisheye posted I already knew 25 years ago. I also believe I know the answers to the questions in the article he got the information from. Did you notice the bit about the sub supposedly being Hitlers private sub. My mistake, I said "personal sub". There was no mercury. There were 12-14 88mm shells stuffed with gold, diamonds, paper currrency and sealed with wax. My friends dad found them in the Montauk Point Lighthouse State Park. They were buried "beside" the parking lot.

Pretty cool, huh. I have reason to believe that my friends dad saw the Germans hide the shells. There is a very good set of reasons why he would have been there at that exact time. I don't know ALL the details as I was not there. In fact I was not born until 1955. I do not need to know all the facts. The facts that are important to me are where the diamonds are now. That's the million dollar plus question and I have the answer. For more details read my book. I don't want to spoil the book but I will tell you now that I do not give out the exact locations. Under the right set of circumstances I will attempt that recovery. Hey maybe on TV on my own treasure show or maybe as part of a Disney movie. Maybe ECS can play the part of the smug skeptic.

Facts? I am not disputing any facts, you are.

I will be glad to share some of the Alligator Alley gold story.

 

[Bigdogdad]

ECS-Wouldn't that be something if BCH finds someone that has a map that says the gold is at or near the same location as my "Cloud Mountain". It would not surprise me. There is gold at Cloud Mountain. I am convinced it is where I think it is. It would only make sense that someone else has come up with the same location by some other means. I guess whoever gets to it first "wins". Gee whiz, my spot is 1000 feet from the interstate and somebody else has stated that it is 1000 feet from the interstate in the same area. Must be an omen from the "Shaman".

 

[lastleg]

While on the road this afternoon I caught some of the Laura Ingram radiocast, she was speaking with Adam Smith,
the legendery award winning reporter from the Tampa Tribune. After the typical blah, blah, blah, blah on politics
Laura asked Adam what else of interest was going on in Tampa and surprisingly he mentioned a local . . . choke,
choke . . . uh . . . durn, out of gas, I couldn't believe it.

 

[vor]

Did bigdog make it to the bigtime?

 

[lastleg]

Yahoo says a Tampa salvagor has made a huge recovery of gold bars and jewels. It was from a downed WWII British freighter.
No mention of a submarine.

 

[lastleg]

CORRECTION: Now they are saying 48 tons of silver bars, pictures included.

 

[vor]

Who would have guessed. 240 tons of silver bars and German u-boats.

Odyssey pulls silver bars from British shipwreck [Tampa Tribune, Fla.] - Businessweek

I thought that you were going to say that the Rocky Bluff story broke.

 

[Bigdogdad]

My story will be in the Tampa Bay Times. I am not sure when. The Odyssey silver coins had been stored in a warehouse in an industrial park near my home. I had talked to Gregg Stemm about getting his help to go after the sunken gold off of the main island in our county. He told me he was only interested in the deep sunken treasures. He is doing quite well at it. The ones in my story are in less than 20 feet of water. There are at least 7-9 locations. These potential sites were identified through a unusual process. Of course the majority of the usual skeptics won't believe a word I say about it.

Some reading my thread may wonder why I claim to know about all this treasure but have no real treasure to show for it. Part of the reason is that I have generally either been in too big a hurry or just didn't know what I was doing. Being under equipped and capitalized did not help. I am hoping things are about to change. I have decided to take a entirely different approach than I have in the past to all aspects of mytreasurestory.

I have been hoping to aquire my own working capital through my different ventures, (inventions, DVD's, etc). I wanted to not need any of the treasures for myself. After 20+ years I am just going to let it all hang out so to speak. I came to treasurenet to purposely make bold claims of untold vast treasure hoards and see what happens. This approach will force me to act and will bring the truth (and hopefully the treasures) to the surface.

I am attempting to put into motion several of the best treasure leads to see what happens. The Rocky Bluff silver is first and it will come to some sort of conclusion soon. I will be in South Florida this weekend to begin to set another one in motion. The North Carolina gold pots will be happening soon. I will do my best to find out if my information is correct. No matter how much research is done, no matter how much talking and planninig is done, to find the buried treasures you HAVE TO DIG.

My success rate in the past has been pretty bad to say the least. It was not for lack of trying. Hopefully my worst mistakes are behind me. I continue to check on the Rocky Bluff site daily. Whatever may be there is still there. It is actually not my best lead. But it is close to home and not very deep. I have purposely made a big deal about it and have broadcast this site to a lot of people. It will soon be broadcast to perhaps millions of people. It is very possible that I may look like a total fool. I am ready to take the chance. I am done holding back. I am in the process of tying up all the loose ends in my life.

My wife is off from work tomorow and her plan is to have the E-book up and running in a day or two. I have complete confidence in her. She also knows the treasure stories and has been very involved in some of them. She is a total believer in me and the treasures. She has been to Montauk, Englewood, Georgia and more with me while going after the gold. silver and diamonds. When anyone comes on here implying that I am some sort of fraud they are also implying to me that she is in on it. We do not take this kindly. She is one of the nicest persons anyone around knows but when you knock me she will fight back. Too many people mistake kindness for weakness. Neither my wife nor I are the least bit weak in any way. Do not continue to underestimate US.

 

[releventchair]

Sometimes you just gotta keep turning over rocks to find a crawdad. Sounds like a rare gem of a mrs. That sure counts!. Unsolicited advice, but don,t forget a break for a few to enjoy simple pleasures. Even once your pockets are full. Be safe. H.H. thanks for sharing.

 

[Bigdogdad]

releventchair-The secret to the crab catching is to always walk upstream against the current so as not to muddy the waters upon which you search. Find the biggest rocks and slowly flip them over. Wait for it to clear. The crabs are always waiting. Ever so slowly put your hand into the water and come up behind your prey. Then quickly grab them in the middle. You cannot be afraid of getting pinched. I have done it 10,000 times in the past as a kid growing up in a small town in Ohio. Crabs, turtles, bugs, or snakes it didn't matter. These were some of our "treasures".

I tell some of my earliest childhood memories of treasure hunting as a kid, in my book. I was hooked from the time that I can remember. Hornet nests, rocks, hearing a locust and tracking it down and then catching it. The year of the 17 year locusts my "pockets were full", of locusts. Snakes were the best. I must have caught a thousand. I am now just a kid in a grownup body. Its all about the adventure of the hunt. No research needed.

Now for some serious advice to would-be hunters. Cache hunting is not for everyone. If you want some easy hunting, get a metal detector and go to the park or beach. The odds are you will find something. This is what most people do. I am sure they have a good time. They will also be more likely to have something to show for it. I am sure that TH's all have their own collection of cool things they have found to show people just as I do. You really have to be dedicated and patient to go after the big caches. I kind of fell into a pretty wild story with the U-853 treasure.

My friend whose dad found the 88mm shells was 8 years old when I met him. I was 12. He was sitting on a rock on the edge of a pond with a small scuba tank strapped to his back. Nobody else was around. I had just recently moved to Florida from Ohio and had never seen a scuba tank. He asked me if I wanted to try it. I said sure. He helped me strap it on and showed me how it worked. With no further training I entered the pond and swam to the the bottom. There were turtles and gar fish everywhere. It opened a whole new world to me. It was super cool for a kid from Ohio. We became the best of friends.

He never talked about the trips he and his dad took to Montauk every summer. We grew up together. After his mother's death in the 80's he found a picture of himself at 7 years old in Montauk and the memories came flooding back. Every year his dad would teach and tell him the story of the submarine and then they would fly in his dad's plane to Long Island. His dad would take him and show him where he buried the diamonds. It is a long story and that is why I started writing my book. I had no idea at the time where the story would lead me. I made many mistakes.

The most important thing is to try to surround yourself with people that have positive attitudes. These types are getting harder to find in today's cynical world. Opposites might attract but believe me you don't want to hook up with a negative non-believer if your going after some serious treasure. These negative types will try to drain the life and energy out of you. I have been involved with way too many of them. They make you question your own beliefs to the point that you question what you know to be fact. Stay away from them at all costs. Do things by yourself if you have to. I have driven thousands upon thousands of miles by myself to get to where I am today.

My mind is clear. I know what I need to do. One step at a time. Don't look back. Watch for the brass/gold/silver ring and when it comes near you grab it and don't let go. For every serious treasure hunter out digging there are probably 10,000 that would like to be but just don't either find the time or make the commitment. There are treasures waiting to be found all around us. Ask friends and relatives if they know of any treasure stories. You will be suprised at how many you will find. We all hide things. Sometimes we tell no one about them. We all will die. Stuff stays hidden. Its in attics, behind barns, beneath a fence post, under a rock. Treasure awaits those that will search for it.

 

[Bigdogsbud]

You Go Bigdogdad!

Yo Bigdogdad. When life hands you destructive criticism you make mytreasurestory.com