Jesse James Treasures: Do They Likely Still Exist?

[45th_Johnny]

There was a lot of that going on back when box cameras were used. I may be wrong you may be right.

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Agony and Death on a Gold Rush Steamer: The Disastrous Sinking of the Side-Wheeler Yankee Blade - Grab it through Amazon!

[Honest Samuel]

I have the right to be left handed.

 

[Texas Jay]

Here are two photos of the real Jesse James. The one on the right was taken when he was about 28. The one on the left was taken when he was over 100 years old. The one on the right is accepted by EVERY traditionalist "authority" I know of as being an authentic photo of Jesse Woodson James. Carl Breihan, who was one of "Dalton's" biggest deniers, made a huge blunder when he chose these two photos to head his article in "Frontier Times" magazine entitled The Last Pretender. His blunder? Both photos clearly show the long scar that runs all the way down and across his left cheek from where the top of his ear attaches to his head! I have several copies of the photo of the younger Jesse that I've found online over the years. In some of the later ones, the scar has been "painted over" so that people wouldn't notice it. The photo of young Jesse even appears to show the rope burn scars on his neck when you enlarge it, the same scars that were present on Dalton's neck when his body was autopsied at Granbury. By the way, I purchased the magazine in this photo from an eBay seller so that I could read the article. The article is as full of Breihan's contradictory claims as many of his books are.
This will be my last post on this thread because reasonable people can only draw one of two possible conclusions from these two comparison pics. One is that both photos are of the same man and that man is J. Frank Dalton (which no traditionalist Jesse James authority will agree with). The other is that Dalton went so far as to slash his left cheek to make a scar that's identical to the one on young Jesse and also faked rope burn scars on his neck to match those of young Jesse James in the photo. Both photos are either of Jesse Woodson James or neither is.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

IMHO, they are the SAME... John Frank Dalton; look at the "hairline". J. Frank Dalton was a "body double" for Jesse James... and COUSIN! I would be like a COP, and say... "Show me YOUR hands!"

 

[Rebel - KGC]

SO! We have THREE "pics" of J. Frank Dalton "as" Jesse James...

 

[franklin]

As for the photographs being reversed, google William Coche buying of the photograph of Billy the Kid. About $1.4 Million invested.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

As for the photographs being reversed, google William Coche buying of the photograph of Billy the Kid. About $1.4 Million invested.

MAY be true about "The Kid"... NOTHING said about JJ; are Pics" from the Civil War "Reverse"...?

 

[Rebel - KGC]

ANYWAY, focus is on "Facial Recognition" per "Post" # 705... three "pics" found of J. Franklin Dalton "as" Jesse James, TWO "as" JJ the YOUNG Outlaw. NO middle finger "missing digit"...

 

[Rebel - KGC]

ECS provided a GREAT "Link" that indicates JFD as JJ; "pic" of Outlaws JJ, FJ, "The Deacon", & "Ranger Captian". "Google" THE MYTHS OF ROBBERS CAVE: A Tale of Jesse James ("Post" # 689). JJ has FULL fingers; NO missing digit". Gotta be JFD! Long slender fingers! AND! "JJ" (JFD) has his rifle as if he was RIGHT-HANDED! JFD WAS! (Seen in his 1948 film, as he handled his pistol)... check it out!

 

[45th_Johnny]

MAY be true about "The Kid"... NOTHING said about JJ; are Pics" from the Civil War "Reverse"...?

Rebel, Especially in the Civil War. Almost ever town had a novice photographer looking to make some money. Add the the amount of soldiers wanting to send pictures too wives, mothers, girlfriends etc... The camera was setup in a small tent or studio. The subjects would be sent in one or two at a time. All of the glass plates had to be processed by hand. When the Picture was taken the negative was a reverse image, hence the name NEGATIVE.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Should we "throw out" ALL of those "pics", then...? Can YOU prove JJ's "pics" are reverse... OR! Just "assume" it...? "Reverse Pics" doesn't really change facial features, does it...?

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Looking for "Pic" of JMJ (Jeremiah Mason James); JJ's incarnation as his cousin, after "JJ's" "death" in 1882 (NOT); found on Page 125, in 1906 with "interesting" hair-line. MAY have been a genetic "trait" in the James' family. Several of JMJ prior to 1882, on page 127... JESSE JAMES SECRET: Codes, Cover-Ups, & Hidden Treasure by Pastore/Woods.

 

[45th_Johnny]

Reb, basically, I was thinking about the hand with the missing finger and the scars. Right or left? I am not looking for treasure, at my age I am looking for my next cup of coffee and the way to the bathroom. I only know of one James treasure story, I will post it when I get the chance.

 

[Kace]

Hey...This is interesting..I just got in from my first Of 3 Hunts!! Can't wait to show you guys some pics and what I've learned. I Do want your opinions. They should be up Tuesday or Wednesday.

Before I left I wrote a Huuugggeee..even for me post. lol!

I decided not to post it because I wanted to give TJ a chance to post the pics of Young Jesse James..Outlaw that he is going by that say JFD Is JWJ..Outlaw.

I see that TJ posted the verified documented JWJ photo next to the verified documented JFD photo. Thats not YOUNG JFD...that is JWJ. Nor is that pic of JWJ anywhere near the same person as JFD. Look back at the Frontal Head Shot of JFD...it's not published much because he is cross-eyed, just like his young photos. I said Older People Scar Easier and JFD Could of Cut Himself to try and match JWJ and/or Rudy Turilli Could of Done that cut to cause scarring too. Guilty, I said that! Hairline, Nose and Ears are Way Different Too. Not to mention the left middle finger that miraculously grew back. And I Left It At That.

YOUNG JFD DID HAVE A CHEEK SCAR....It Was Still There As An OLD JFD. TJ can finish that story in comparison to JWJ's scarring too or I can.

I wanted TJ to do Two Things...

Post The Real Photographs of Young JFD that were asked for... To compare to Young JWJ. I didn't post what I was going to, to let TJ post first. But I Can Post Young JFD Photos.

Then I wanted him to post "The Rest of The Story" about JFD's Funeral since he addressed me when I said it wasn't paid for. Tell everyone who paid for It and the Tombstone. And Who Bolted when the Bill was First Presented and When BUD tried to pay it...

Then tell everyone everything about Bud Harcastle's attempted exhumation of JFD in Detail and ALL the screw ups that I chose not to post including the court cases involving The Fake James Family and Lying To The Judge, Henry Holland and Family and Why the Second Request was Denied etc...I didn't bring up Bud Hardcastle.

Pick up where I left off on Meremac..Dill, Turilli, How Orvus Lee Howk aka Jesse James lll got in the mix Including the John James aka JWJ Fraud Case, Where JFD got his information on JWJ and how that was exposed, JFD's Final Days and go on to the Original Funeral and Burial. Then Continue with Bud's second request for exhumation, the one that was Approved and Then End with The Second Request for Exhumation that was Denied. And Why. What DNA comparisons they were going to use etc..

Might as well finish with Why there wasn't another exhumation request after that and what BUD and others are doing now to capitalize on JWJ/JFD. Include all promised deals with magazines, TV shows, Appearances etc and what compensation was received or promised. Monies spent and lost etc. TJ said it was his last post on this topic...if he doesn't want to finish the stories, I can.

We said when we started this topic that we would put all the evidence together and see if Courtney or JFD could have been JWJ..Outlaw within a reasonable doubt.

I'm guilty of not posting the whole story in detail on JFD after the funeral bill....Including
OL Howk aka Jesse James lll, Jesse James lV and Brothers, Sam Raush,Estes Funeral Home,BUD Hardcastle, Meremac Caverns including Dill and Turilli all the way up to the Details of All Court Cases and Evidence Submitted Involving Everyone I've Listed.

But I can...If TJ wants to do it that's Great. If Not I'll Post It By Tuesday Night.

I also didn't post everything about BDD, photos and claims and court cases because Courtney didn't publicly claim to be JWJ. I am still trying to link him to JWJ..Outlaw.

I Chose Not to post those details because it would of been a brutal assault on a lot of people..living and dead. I also would of included those who are still trying to make money off of those claims by either lying or Not doing Due Diligence by investigating and researching those claims before Marketing Them As Fact. Those that are just reusing proven false claims. Once you attach your name to claims and State them as Fact you need to be Sure you are right and not misleading people, Especially If You Are Trying To Profit From Them. Those court cases proved that in Spades.

I am sure members wonder why I care so much if it's Fact or Fiction and the answers are easy. We are All here on this topic because of the conflicting stories we were told or read from a young age to present. We are trying to sort it out. Kids see this stuff and believe it because a website, newspaper or magazine posted sensationalized Headlines and Bogus Stories. Tourist attractions,don't advertise in NEON that their attraction is for entertainment only and there is No Factual Proof To Their Claims.

Now we are trying to see who's who, where they were and see if there is anything left behind. I believe there is, from Jesse James etal as a Bank,Stagecoach,Riverboat and Train Robber, And working for the Southern Cause and all that encompasses on a larger scale.

This topic is pretty easy to prove WHO ISNT Jesse James..Outlaw...And it's a pretty good GUESS where all the players went. Hello, VA,TN,MO,OK,CA.

Unlike magazines,websites,blogs,appearances,entertainment movies or books, "Follow ME on Jesse James excavations or treasure hunts Reality TV" where you hope to get paid..Some people, entities and businesses actually keep good,verifiable, documented records.

It's a good idea to Start there and Not in the Middle or End.

I'm open to All opinions or theories...There is some truth to everything, even if it's used to prove or disprove something.

Kace

 

[Kace]

Should we "throw out" ALL of those "pics", then...? Can YOU prove JJ's "pics" are reverse... OR! Just "assume" it...? "Reverse Pics" doesn't really change facial features, does it...?

No it does Not change facial features and reversing pictures and cropping is being done today with computer photography programs. I'll post some examples of alleged JWJ's family pics that were reversed and cropped compared to the originals.

Some people trying to make a buck even try to pass original paper photos as reversed or old tin types concerning Outlaws.

 

[Kace]

Looking for "Pic" of JMJ (Jeremiah Mason James); JJ's incarnation as his cousin, after "JJ's" "death" in 1882 (NOT); found on Page 125, in 1906 with "interesting" hair-line. MAY have been a genetic "trait" in the James' family. Several of JMJ prior to 1882, on page 127... JESSE JAMES SECRET: Codes, Cover-Ups, & Hidden Treasure by Pastore/Woods.

I think you are right on the some of the hairlines being similar in the family. There were several in the family on both sides that were close in age that looked a lot alike. The finger is the Major Difference to an outsider.

 

[Kace]

SO! We have THREE "pics" of J. Frank Dalton "as" Jesse James...

Exactly...

 

[Kace]

Rebel, Especially in the Civil War. Almost ever town had a novice photographer looking to make some money. Add the the amount of soldiers wanting to send pictures too wives, mothers, girlfriends etc... The camera was setup in a small tent or studio. The subjects would be sent in one or two at a time. All of the glass plates had to be processed by hand. When the Picture was taken the negative was a reverse image, hence the name NEGATIVE.

Hey 45th, You are primarily talking about Tintype Photos, right?

 

[Kace]

Reb, basically, I was thinking about the hand with the missing finger and the scars. Right or left? I am not looking for treasure, at my age I am looking for my next cup of coffee and the way to the bathroom. I only know of one James treasure story, I will post it when I get the chance.

45th-Sorry for jumping in here but there are more than a few documented accounts that his LEFT middle finger was missing at the main knuckle due to an accidental discharge while cleaning his gun. There are also more than a few photos of his Left middle finger missing at the knuckle that substantiates the accounts.

He was also known to wear gloves that were appropriate for the season to hide the missing part of the digit. The family members or other men that stood in for him on occasion would do this as well because it was so well documented on reward posters that gave identifying information as well as the posters that showed his picture, sometimes the photo had Frank James in it as well as His Description.

At the time Pinkerton Agents firebombed the James/Samuels farm, an agent saw who He Believed were Jesse and Frank James arrive home on horseback. Later, after the tragedy that occurred due to his reporting he was asked if he didn't positively ID JWJ by the missing part of the middle finger and he said that both men were wearing gloves but they looked like Jesse and Frank James Photos that he had been given. It wasn't them.

 

[45th_Johnny]

Hey 45th, You are primarily talking about Tintype Photos, right?

Kace, yes Tintypes.

If anyone is not aware, the DNA used to identify JWJ, was mitochondrial DNA. The DNA from JWJ's mother, which was shared with her mother and her sisters. This included the Dalton's and others. This DNA would probably not be found in any of his sons, but could have been found in a daughter.

Just finished looking at some Civil War tintypes. The easiest way to tell is the buttons are on the wrong side of the jackets, in the reversed images.