Jesse James Treasures: Do They Likely Still Exist?

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Kace said:
Yes, Many Have Claimed To Be JJ

The two most public claims are J.Frank Dalton and James L Courtney

Courtney is out of Texas.

Dalton is MO and then passed in Texas claiming to be 103yrs old.

With both of these guys if you google them a boatload of conflicting stories will pop up. I'd pick Courtney to start with and search whatever sounds plausible to you, then search Census, Property, Tax, Birth and Death Records as well as Military Rolls. Courtney will come up as an Union Solidier and the Dates Will Match. JJ as we all know was Confederate. You will have to look at the reasons stating the Union records show him that way and then decide what you think...

Dalton has much more to research and many more people involved.

There is a ton to research on both of these men...very convoluted and a lot to try and make sense of. Unfortunately Most detailed accounts that are out there are written by people who have/had something to gain. But the timelines and accounts can be waded through if you have the patience! lol!

ECS Posted a link a page or two back regarding a Cole Younger Interview that has some info on JWJ that does have some personal accounts from Jesse James, Jr. He was very young at the time of the shooting so his personal recollections are that of a child which he states and then the stories he tells are from his Mother, Grandmother, family and friends of his fathers which he also states. It's half of a book he wrote. I haven't finished reading his story there yet. He pretty much starts the story when they moved to KCMO from Nashville, TN.

It's a pretty cool site...Thanks ECS!



I'm HOPING the Texas members will jump in here, they have personal accounts from Courtney's descendants...And are local to where he was.

Happy Researching,
Kace
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AGREE! Time to mosey on down to Texas, I reckon...
 

Rebel - KGC said:
AGREE! Time to mosey on down to Texas, I reckon...
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lol!! I Think Courtney is the next logical stop on this trip...

Hello Texas Members.. Please start us off on James L Courtney..
 

franklin said:
Since this thread is about JJ and FJ and their gang's treasures. I will share this about the 58 depositories of gold that my partner and I found almost seven years ago. I have a photograph of an old home where JJ and FJ stayed here in Virginia in 1879. On the gable of the house and in the grass in front of the house is writings---some handwriting others in print. It tells of an enormous treasure of eight each thirty gallon pots of gold coins and 889 Large Gold Bricks. I found the house photograph from the story the old black man told me about when he sat on his grand daddy's knee over eighty years ago. We all laughed at the old man but when I started researching I found out the old gentleman had a lot of truth in what he was saying. Just across the road from where he told us the story was a property that belonged to one of the younger members of the Jesse James Gang. I know where the 58 maps are located to these treasures but I can not legally obtain them. I have tried to find them on my own by research but nothing comes the easy way. Maybe some day. The coins would weigh over ten tons and the gold bars would weigh about thirty tons. Where would a treasure this large be kept today. I know it was still there in 1883.
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Great Post franklin! Thats Just Another Example of What Can Be Learned From Listening To Someone Tell A Story..The man might of been wrong on some details but through your due diligence, listening to him and researching, he told you something he had NO IDEA he told you and you found some truth to it that could turn out to be a proven fact! Great Job to Both You And Your Partner!!

That's a lot of gold to hide. I posted the pic of the cemetery in Franklin County, VA for just this reason.

Have you checked old family or small conclave (clan or kin) cemeteries? There is No Better Place to hide Anything than a grave site or Sites....Most people would never think of searching a graveyard. Or Be To Afraid To. Are there Any Mausoleums Around? Do you have a UV Light? Is Sandstone Prevalent in your area?

The Indian Burial Mounds are the same way...It's difficult for the average person to tell that it isn't a Real Burial Mound. I always steer clear of them out of respect but then someone knowledgeable showed me that what I had stayed away from was not a burial mound. Now I know what to look for. And I Still Steer Clear Of All of It! lol.

Whoever originally had the maps you are talking about would of probably kept them close.. if it were me, I'd also have at least one copy somewhere. Too many fires...Do you have a way of researching where they lived After the Gold? Is the home original or not gutted at least?
 

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I was talking to a Tnet member the other day regarding this topic and I really think these

Three Men have To Be DNA BLIND TESTED AT THE SAME TIME...BY TWO-THREE Nationally Recognized DNA Testing Facilities or Even TWO-THREE Medical Universities. A Grant could be obtained for this if ALL PARTIES AGREE.

The reasons being are that, yes I saw the MO exhumation in '78, but how could I know who was in the grave in 1882 or 1902? I CANT..

It could of been HIM or a maternal relative...No one will ever know that. By All Accounts JWJ and AFJ had the same mother. I'm NOT Questioning His Mothers Character but there is a reason that it's mtDNA/Maternal that is universally tested.

Next Reason For BLIND Testing is that if the James Curators do DNA testing like in '95 and 'prove' it's JWJ of Kearney, then the door is again open for someone like Caruso to throw another wrench in that...Plus even though we can't know who was in the 1882-1902 graves...The 1978 exhumation was Not Re-Interred until 1982...which was 100 years from the year of the shooting. We Still Can't know for sure WHO was buried Then! Same with 1995...Different year same problems.

The Duke descendants would have the same issues if only one place was chosen for their mtDNA or Any DNA testing. I don't doubt at all Courtney was BDD's GGrandfather, but that doesn't prove him the original JWJ that everyone talks about. She, her son or other family WOULD test positive to JLC. Still doesn't Prove Courtney was JWJ. Only that they were related to Courtney and His Wife. Having BDD's son is very helpful for testing...I think BDD's DNA is on file or available even though she has passed away. But with a male and female for testing that's full spectrum.

The Dalton descendants would be the same as BDD and the James Family of MO..

There is known living and dead descendants of ALL the men in Question.

DNA testing is an expensive and somewhat lengthy process but Jesse James is SO HIGH PROFILE that a Grant would be easy to obtain and I seriously doubt that ANY Reputable Testing Facilities Wouldn't Jump At The Opportunity To Participate in BLIND TESTING to determine once and for all the true and factual identity of JWJ. Two would be Good but 3 Would Be Great!

I Don't Know, But I Don't Think Any of The Claiming Descendants Would Object and if they did, well there's an answer.

You know the History Channel and all similar History Broadcasting Companies and Publications Would Want To Be Involved and Help Cover any extra costs incurred. They have done documentaries in the recent past on JJ. Heck, WE could start a GO FUND ME PAGE on FACEBOOK! Get All JW James, JL Courtney, JF Dalton Genealogy Members and All the Many JJames Forum Members and Sponsors... That Alone would probably generate more than enough money to cover ALL COSTS! lol! I would chip in on something like that...Would You Guys? Jesse James Life and Death is the Granddaddy of All Conspiracy Theories!

It would sure be nice in our lifetimes to get that answered.

Kace
 

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For those of who you are going to research the facts of Jesse W James exhumation and the mtDNA sample and testing that I referred to in my post #547 on this page.

I should of included that even though it doesn't matter for that test, is that the mtDNA comparison sample was taken from the gGrandson and Nephew of Susan James Parmer who was the undisputed Full Blooded Sister of Jesse W James and Alexander Franklin James.....Match....to JWJ. 1995.

In my post I also said that I was Not Questioning the character of Zerelda James Samuels, meaning who the biological father of JWJ, AFJ and Susan James is. It doesnt matter for mtDNA testing.

Susan James' had a daughter named Feta who in turn had a daughter named Dorothy.

The character of Feta has been brought up as far as Dorothy being Feta's Biological Daughter. It's been alleged that Dorothy had a different biological mother. I personally am not going to question their character or morals, I didn't know them.

This allegation was viewed as a Below the Belt Insult by the direct descendants of Feta. It got ugly...and was big news here.

Anyway, I just wanted to add that part in case in came up later.

Kace
 

Frank Triplett's 1882 Jesse James book written 7 weeks after James was killed by Ford is considered the definitive James biography including signed letters by Jesse James" wife and mother attesting to the truth of the content, and is well worth the read.
Skyhorse Publishing currently has republished this book with the original plate illustrations.
Jesse James
 

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ECS said:
Frank Triplett's 1882 Jesse James book written 7 weeks after James was killed by Ford is considered the definitive James biography including signed letters by Jesse James" wife and mother attesting to the truth of the content, and is well worth the read.
Skyhorse Publishing currently has republished this book with the original plate illustrations.
Jesse James
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Thanks E! I'll check that out!
 

THE COMPLETE AND AUTHENTIC LIFE OF JESS JAMES by Carl W. Breihan (1953) has nice "pics" of JJ & family; INTERESTING "death pic" showing exist hole between rt. eye/rt. top of nose, that I never notice before; if entrance point was behind left ear, trajectory of the Wesson Model # 3, .44 caliber (serial number 3766) & property of a family in Baltimore, Md, is INDICATED.
 

MORE on that pistol, owned by Mr. Henry G. Lingenfelder of Baltimore, Maryland (1953); "pic" of pistol shown... "single action, with a 6 1/2" barrel.... nickle-plated". WHEW!
 

The best source for the autopsy and coroner's inquest into the killing of "Jesse James" in St. Joseph, Missouri can be found in the book by Frank Triplett, The Life, Times, and Treacherous Death of Jesse James. It was the only biography of Jesse James that was authorized by both Jesse's mother Zerelda Samuel and his alleged widow Zerelda "Zee" Mimms James. The book gives excellent coverage of the testimony of the two doctors who examined the body and determined the cause of death and the fact that the bullet that killed the man was still inside his skull and did not exit his head as traditionalist historians have claimed for decades. Therefore, the famous bullet hole in the wall of the St. Joseph house was not caused by the bullet that killed the man. The doctors also testified that the wound above the head was not an exit wound but was caused when he was struck by a pistol. Both Jesse's brother Frank James and Gov. Crittenden teamed up to try to destroy copies of this book because they knew that if many read it, Jesse's death hoax would be exposed for the world to see. detail_182_bk1091-LifeTimesandTreacherousDeathofJesseJames-300.jpg
 

Is Anyone Close To Georgetown, Kentucky?
 

My post above, #557 asking about Members in Georgetown, Kentucky is referring to the Annual James-Younger conference that will be in KY this year. Different locations every year. It's September 28-October 1, 2017. People show up from all over, descendants and history buffs of both families. Lots of info, memorabilia and speakers. It would be cool if a Tnet member here was going. I would love to go to that. But, Turkey Season is Gobbling!! And....I'm not that close to Kentucky!

Anyone Can Go To It!

Check out the past reunions online.
 

Hi Kace. The late Betty Duke, great granddaughter of James Courtney was my friend and was a longtime member of our Bloody Bill Anderson Mystery group. I believe she wrote 3 books about Courtney. I wrote an account about William C. "Bloody Bill" Anderson for her second book - The Truth About Jesse James (pages 358-360). While Betty and I disagreed about who the real Jesse Woodson James was, we never let that interfere with our friendship. My long investigation into Jesse W. James has convinced me that the man known as J. Frank Dalton was the real Jesse. Betty was a wonderful lady and a very good researcher. In my opinion, she wrote the best analysis of James Starrs' exhumation and fraudulent DNA analysis of the body alleged to have belonged to Jesse Woodson James. I'm attaching a photo of Betty Duke to this message. You can read a portion of it here:

The James Gang: So?Who?s Telling The Truth about Jesse James? DNA Results?

~Texas Jay

BettyDuke1.jpg
 

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