Real of Tayopa
Bronze Member
Whisky rat, So first I had to find Tayopa. Which I did (hey RDT3 its not that hard to find, just a simple google search) ha ha Of course not after I had found it, however it stumped the best for overr6400 years
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Per the Google Earth Pro path measuring tool, the land route/river routes to the mouth of the Rio Grande from the alleged general location of the Tayopa mine (I chose Yecora MX as a starting point). I inflated all distances by 25% to account for all the twists and turns encountered on land. I used the published length of the Rio Grande border measurement.
Option 1, easterly route. Yecora to La Junta MX (rough mountains 150 miles), then to Chihuahua MX (moderate hilly 125 miles), then to Ojinaga MX (mild desert terrain 150 miles), then by barge to the Gulf of Mexico (950 miles). 425 land miles, 950 river miles.
Option 2, northerly route. Yecora to Moctezuma MX (rough mountains 150 miles), then to Agua Prieta MX (moderate hilly 150 miles), then to El Paso TX or Mesilla NM (mild desert terrain 250 miles), then by barge to the Gulf of Mexico (1,250 miles). 550 land miles, 1,250 river miles.
Option 3, westerly route. Yecora to Tecoripa MX (rough mountains 100 miles), then to the Sea of Cortez (mild desert terrain 175 miles), then by ship to Panama (2,500 miles), then across Panama (60 miles to Gulf of Mexico). 325 land miles, 2,500 sea miles.
Option 1: Why cross Chihuahua and the Camino Real, controlled by Franciscans and Spanish? Unlikely.
Option 2: Why journey into New Mexico in the first place - no supplies available, a Franciscan stronghold, the Rio Grande controlled by the Spanish, and all of it teeming with Apaches, who were at war with all of them? In addition, why add 100 miles of land and 100 miles of river travel by continuing north to the Caballo Range? Unlikely.
Option 3: Less land travel. Sea travel is quicker and easier than river barging. More likely.
It's not impossible, but it's hard to accept that the Jesuits would move precious metal to the Caballos from Mexico. There well may be caches in the Caballos, but it seems unlikely they came from Mexico. As always, I could be wrong, but all I see that supports the idea is that suspicious map and some wishful thinking.
sdc/ whiskey rat "Gentlemen you have thr right idea but Goole earth is absolutely useless for estimating animal travel. In the sierras I have seldom encountered an animal trail that goes straight for even 100 ft, In the remote Sierras I have spent a hard day with my mule yet that night camped within a 1/4 mile o my previous camp, The trails do not go straight up and down, they zigzag. up and sown. Incidentaly here are a few pitures that may give you an idea of that country. he flat lands occur from Chihuahua on.
Incidentally why do you say alegded Sdc.?
Whisky rat, So first I had to find Tayopa. Which I did (hey RDT3 its not that hard to find, just a simple google search) ha ha Of course not after I had found it, however it stumped the best for overr6400 years
I absolutely agree with the difficulty traversing mountain trails, especially driving livestock. That's why, to me, the fewer land miles to haul stuff, the better. Also important in this debate would be the Jesuits' potential for encountering difficulties with the Spanish Crown, the Franciscan Order, the Apache and the separation from their secure bases if they were attempting the long trip to New Mexico. That's why it seems to me that Option 3 would have been a more likely choice ... if they were trying to ship precious metals, that is.
I say alleged because I haven't seen any convincing evidence that confirms recovery of the riches described in the Tayopa tales. I don't doubt you have located evidence of old silver mines in the area. Perhaps the description of the Tayopa mine output was exaggerated.
Nothing concrete as usual just the same legends and "old maps and weigh bill from Mexico".
But what caught my mind was the claim by the group "codebreakers" that Mel Fisher found 22 carat plus purity gold bars on the Atocha.
And that he had reason to believe they came from SW New Mexico. He, to me, is a very credible person.
It is for sure that the almost pure gold bars were found in the wreck. That is not some fairy tale.
That ship sank in 1622. Again, in my mind they did not smelt gold in 1622 to a purity approaching 24 carat.
So, im concluding that they found very pure gold in native form sometime before 1622 to make those particular gold bars.
No proof offered but some compelling real evidence at least.
I think we have seen convincing evidence of massive amounts of gold and silver that was mined in the Americas and attempted shipping back to Spain. There are over 2000 shipwrecks in the ocean bottoms of the ships that did not make it.
Many, many, many massive recoveries have been made of these ships and most still have not been recovered.
And more ships did not sink than did sink. So where did all this gold in the americas come from??
But the point is, all these tons and tons and tons of gold and silver came out of the ground in mines like Tayopa etc in the Americas.
There had to be mines so much more rich than we know about today. Today we have to mines tons of dirt to get a few ounces of gold.
In the beginning, there must have been mines that were beyond what we can imagine to produce the tons of gold that were gathered.
And it all still exists somewhere on this planet. Moved around by whom ever could conquer it at the time. Its the same gold, just going round and round.
I dont know, maybe Im just hoping it came from somewhere in the southwest, so my quest is justified?
Maybe Ive just had to much whiskey.
good day.
I might add the Peraltas carved maps on boulders, put ax heads on the tops of cactus as directional signs, inscribed leather with directions to the X-marks the spot,pirates,outlaws,solders,Mormans,prospectors,etc. drew real maps.
Their are plenty of authenic maps out their , as their are fake maps and fake waybills...Treasure hunting ain"t easy but it can be done with success like anything else, with a real map.