CODEBREAKER COMMENTS ABOUT BEALE CIPHERS

[bigscoop]

There are 26 letters in the alphabet, to each of these the ciphers, let's say C1, provides over 100 matching code possibilities per letter. Now multiply this by the number of possible correct spelling orders. You would be better off trying to predict the next Powerball drawing.

The notion that anyone can, without some means of a known/accurate starting point, use any form of decoding principle to determine the correct assignment of each code is a fantasy. Period!

However, if we had some insight into what the cipher actually contains that might offer a little help, but we don't. As far as we know it might contain absolutely nothing, or it could simply be a confession from the author, or a clear text that was simply designed to lead yet another goose chase, etc. A second example would be that the codes are all just random entries with no intended value attached to them at all other then the author's own personal preference in their arrangement, which in itself could lead to existing "patterns" that in reality are totally meaningless.

Could be that only a few codes in the entire cipher contain any real value, or that several meaningless codes have been inserted, etc., etc., etc. Will patterns still exist? Yes, they will, but are they meaningful? Not very likely.

This is why ciphers are used, and this is also why, historically speaking, that ciphers of completely unknown meaning and/or origin with no known starting point still remain undecided today. The possibilities are unlimited in this type of complete unknowns.

To date, we still don't know anything of value about the narration, the people and details it portrays, the author, or in general, the source or the true nature of the tale. And last, if those ciphers actually "did" contain a clear text then we have absolutely no way to know what type of cipher they might have actually been. So all of these complete unknowns allow for us to make them whatever we want or believe them to be. Sad but all-too true.

 

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[Rebel - KGC]

Think I'll do POWERBALL! Heh!

 

[bigscoop]

Think I'll do POWERBALL! Heh!

Good luck with that!

 

[ECS]

Carl would be wrong but you'll have to wait for my book. No spoilers.

It is amazing that those who claim to have solved the ciphers or have a book coming out, ALL say that the professional codebreakers that have studied and dismissed the Beale ciphers as false, are wrong.
Edgar Allen Poe, who was an influence of codes and ciphers to the "unknown author" of the Beale Papers wrote in 1841:
"Few persons can be made to believe that it is not quite an easy thing to invent a method of secret writing which shall baffle investigation. Yet it may be roundly asserted that human ingenuity cannot concoct a cipher which human ingenuity cannot resolve".
Now consider that for 130 years C1 & C3 have "baffled investigation" by the best professional codebreakers of the military and alphabet orgs who all reached the same conclusions- these are not legitimate ciphers.
Influenced by Poe's description, the "unknown author" designed C1 & C3 to be unsolvable by human ingenuity.

 

[bigscoop]

It is amazing that those who claim to have solved the ciphers or have a book coming out, ALL say that the professional codebreakers that have studied and dismissed the Beale ciphers as false, are wrong.
Edgar Allen Poe, who was an influence of codes and ciphers to the "unknown author" of the Beale Papers wrote in 1841:
"Few persons can be made to believe that it is not quite an easy thing to invent a method of secret writing which shall baffle investigation. Yet it may be roundly asserted that human ingenuity cannot concoct a cipher which human ingenuity cannot resolve".
Now consider that for 130 years C1 & C3 have "baffled investigation" by the best professional codebreakers of the military and alphabet orgs who all reached the same conclusions- these are not legitimate ciphers.
Influenced by Poe's description, the "unknown author" designed C1 & C3 to be unsolvable by human ingenuity.

And even if the "presented" ciphers, prior to presentation, did maintain some type of clear text, those original ciphers then were seriously altered before before public presentation. And who can say just exactly how, or how much, of the originals remain?

 

[bigscoop]

Tad, respectfully, the real issue in this debate is the following;

A man arrives home on Saturday afternoon to find an unmarked envelope stuck in his door jam, he has absolutely no idea where it came from or what it contains. Inside this unmarked envelope he discovers a single piece of paper covered with random numbers that are completely unknown to him. Are you suggesting that through process, this man could identify who penned that completely unknown piece of paper and why he did it? This, in reality, since we are facing a complete unknown with the remaining Beale ciphers, is what you are suggesting in this ongoing debate.

 

[tad10]

It is amazing that those who claim to have solved the ciphers or have a book coming out, ALL say that the professional codebreakers that have studied and dismissed the Beale ciphers as false, are wrong.

The likelihood of one individual being right increases in direct proportion to the intensity with which others are trying to prove him wrong. - Mr. Jordan, "Heaven Can Wait."

 

[ECS]

The likelihood of one individual being right increases in direct proportion to the intensity with which others are trying to prove him wrong. - Mr. Jordan, "Heaven Can Wait."

...and how does movie quote establish C1 & C3 as containing real plaintext messages as the supplied DOI "solved" C2?

 

[tad10]

...and how does movie quote establish C1 & C3 as containing real plaintext messages as the supplied DOI "solved" C2?

How does an appeal to an authority (a well-known logical fallacy) that didn't solve the Beale Ciphers establish that C1 & C3 do not contain a plaintext message?

You know buddy, it's really far more fun on my side of the river. Negative-town is a dim, dismal place.

 

[ECS]

...but that doesn't prove that C1 & C3 are actually solvable.
Positive town can create false hopes, buddy, but I think you are already aware of that fact.

 

[bigscoop]

The likelihood of one individual being right increases in direct proportion to the intensity with which others are trying to prove him wrong. - Mr. Jordan, "Heaven Can Wait."

That's not even a credible dodge. Right off the top of my head I could quote the many-many "I told so" comments in all of those contrary intensities that were spot on in the end.

Who wrote them? Don't know.
What do they contain? Don't know.
Are they real? Don't know.
How were they constructed? Don't know.
What language is the alleged clear text in? Don't know.
And I could go on and on.......


We say that we started our investigations without any expectations at all, but this can't possibly be true. Why? Because even the processes we utilize are looking for something by their very nature and design, they can't exist if they have no design/intent/purpose. We have to start somewhere because we can't start nowhere. In investigations of this type, or any type for that matter, the first question we ask ourselves is, “Where do we start?” And with that, “we set an intended/designed course.” And if we find nothing of interest/use in this initial course we change our course, or design/intent, and we keep doing this until, and here it comes, “we find something of interest/use.” But is that discovery accurate/relevant to our complete unknown? How could we possibly know? How could it possibly be?

And you've got it wrong, nobody is trying to prove you wrong, we're just asking that show us something that even hints that you could be accurate?

 

[tad10]

...but that doesn't prove that C1 & C3 are actually solvable.
Positive town can create false hopes, buddy, but I think you are already aware of that fact.

I'm going to repeat the below for one last time in reply to you, if you followup with a reply that repeats the same thing you've said for the past 500 posts I'm going to put you on ignore like I did with scoop.

The Beale Ciphers are not only solvable, they've been solved at least once, and possibly more than once.

But you'll have to wait for my book if you want the proof of that. No spoilers on this site.

 

[ECS]

That's not a good way to garner buyers for the book you are hawking here, being a tad bit petulant.
I don't believe Bigscoop or I will be holding our breath.

 

[TN_Guest1523]

Think I'll do POWERBALL! Heh!

Don't hurt yourself !

 

[bigscoop]

That's not a good way to garner buyers for the book you are hawking here, being a tad bit petulant.
I don't believe Bigscoop or I will be holding our breath.

I guess you just ignore credible contrary viewpoint?

 

[bigscoop]

The Beale Ciphers are not only solvable, they've been solved at least once, and possibly more than once.

Now that I will concur as being very likely, but to likely great disappointment to all but the original the decoder, and possibly even to him.

 

[tad10]

That's not a good way to garner buyers for the book you are hawking here, being a tad bit petulant.
I don't believe Bigscoop or I will be holding our breath.

Lol. Chao buddy.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Any D & R (Discovery & Recovery) indicated...? IF NOT... who CARES!

 

[tad10]

Any D & R (Discovery & Recovery) indicated...? IF NOT... who CARES!

I don't know what you mean by this. Can you elaborate?

 

[TN_Guest1523]

I don't know what you mean by this. Can you elaborate?

Reb has always said if people can not show proof by dinging up the treasure they did not do anything .

I have found the key to each cipher and according to them, I need to show them my decoded cipher to prove I did it . LOL they will probably never see it, but one day it will be verified just not by some poster on a forum .