Ancient coin ? (Updated! more pics)

[history hunter]

I found this coin while metal detecting when I was a kid. I thought it was fake until I brought it to a coin show and a dealer said it was not necessarily fake. I was wondering if anyone knew anything about it?

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

I am not experienced

obviously.

 

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[CRUSADER]

I am not experienced

obviously.

guys..... thats enough already,,,

 

[Silver Searcher]

I am not experienced

obviously.

We can turn this into a slanging match if you want, I personely don't want to fall out with you.

I am not the judge and jury, read the first 2 pages of the thread.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I did a terrible job at explaining it to you SS but I sincerely tried.

 

[Silver Searcher]

I may not be good at explaining it to you SS but I sincerely tried.

Lets not get bitter :P you have put far to much effort into this post which I respect enormously

lets just say we agree to disagree

SS

 

[CRUSADER]

I am not experienced

obviously.

We can turn this into a slanging match if you want, I personely don't want to fall out with you.

I am not the judge and jury, read the first 2 pages of the thread.

I don't ever like to take sides, I only state my own case.

I understand the point you are making, & my point is similar. You can tell from photo's with experience, because of the points you have just quoted. ie. I have handled many thousands of coins & have brought many fakes to compare them to, so I can tell the diffference, from a photo. You must be able to hedge your bets that it not real. (if not handle a few fakes & take pictures, it will become clearer). The coins the experts are talking abouts are very difficult to tell apart but this one is not. Please take this from someone willing to lose $1000

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I may not be good at explaining it to you SS but I sincerely tried.

Lets not get bitter :P you have put far to much effort into this post which I respect enormously

lets just say we agree to disagree

SS

OK fair enough. You may have proven that bronze can still look good after 2000 years. But this coin still has shiny plating visible on the low spots. It also has many other issues, including the fake-looking denticals.

I am still looking for proof positive. I am sitting at 99 percent.

 

[Silver Searcher]

I am not experienced

obviously.

We can turn this into a slanging match if you want, I personely don't want to fall out with you.

I am not the judge and jury, read the first 2 pages of the thread.

I don't ever like to take sides, I only state my own case.

I understand the point you are making, & my point is similar. You can tell from photo's with experience, because of the points you have just quoted. ie. I have handled many thousands of coins & have brought many fakes to compare them to, so I can tell the diffference, from a photo. You must be able to hedge your bets that it not real. (if not handle a few fakes & take pictures, it will become clearer). The coins the experts are talking abouts are very difficult to tell apart but this one is not. Please take this from someone willing to lose $1000

You never read the link also buying coins doesn't make you an expert, good judge maybe, there are plently of experienced dealers that have been fooled.

 

[Silver Searcher]

I may not be good at explaining it to you SS but I sincerely tried.

Lets not get bitter :P you have put far to much effort into this post which I respect enormously

lets just say we agree to disagree

SS

OK fair enough. You may have proven that bronze can still look good after 200 years. But this coin still has shiny plating visible on the low spots. It also has many other issues, including the fake-looking denticals.

I am still looking for proof positive. I am sitting at 99 percent.

You missed a 0 of the years

 

[Silver Searcher]

You missed a 0 of the years

I just went back and edited. My typewriters keys are worn off and also I make many mistakes. Thats why Im always going back and editting.

Looking at your posts, it's a wonder they haven't exploded

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Its a wonder I havent been kicked off all these years.

 

[CRUSADER]

I am not experienced

obviously.

We can turn this into a slanging match if you want, I personely don't want to fall out with you.

I am not the judge and jury, read the first 2 pages of the thread.

I don't ever like to take sides, I only state my own case.

I understand the point you are making, & my point is similar. You can tell from photo's with experience, because of the points you have just quoted. ie. I have handled many thousands of coins & have brought many fakes to compare them to, so I can tell the diffference, from a photo. You must be able to hedge your bets that it not real. (if not handle a few fakes & take pictures, it will become clearer). The coins the experts are talking abouts are very difficult to tell apart but this one is not. Please take this from someone willing to lose $1000

You never read the link also buying coins doesn't make you an expert, good judge maybe, there are plently of experienced dealers that have been fooled.

In the same way many experts have been fooled as well. So whats does all this prove!

 

[IronSpike]

Well the only known matches to HH's coin were found in the US and the pics of same are useless for comparison of whether they are showing expected patina/corrosion for a 2000 year old coin. The fact these 'useless' pics still being used on that site is IMO rather strange

Fake or real? Well it's real in sense there's no known ancient match to compare it to. Whether ancient or modern everything brought forward weighs in favor of modern. Eventhough a coin would have to be examined by trained expert the pics posted by HH leans toward modern knowing HH only cleaned with soup and water. Then take a closer look at identical denticals on HH's and the Alabama coin. How would that be explained

The last coin you posted Silver Searcher is not a typical dug condition and we don't know if any special circumstances on that dig that preserved it so well. Of course you know that as you've dug many old copper and bronze coins. Here's a pic of what ancient uncleaned dug bronze coins would look like:

Hope some of the contacted sources will respond.

http://www.commonbronze.com/catalog...d=167&osCsid=517e41d14720d25950747ae06b99a172

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

The last coin you posted Silver Searcher is not a typical dug condition and we don't know if any special circumstances on that dig that preserved it so well.

We dont even know if it was cleaned because the link wasnt posted.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Then take a closer look at identical denticals on HH's and the Alabama coin. How would that be explained

This is very critical our discussion. I do not think this aspect has been given enough weight.

I was getting to that. It was going to be my next discussion but I couldnt get past the lack of discoloration with SS.


You are good at writing emails, SWR. Maybe you can help with the invitations to join us.

 

[history hunter]

I don't have to read up about patina on Ancient coins I dig them up every week just because there are no visible signs of Silver plating doesn't mean to say it never was and as for the Brass loop, that could have been added to HH coin recently.

Yes I saw your great finds in the banner. I have never dug an ancient coin but I asked you a while back to please post a pic of a dug ancient coin that has no patina, corrosion or discoloration. I believe you stated that they (a single bronze coin) can come out of the ground looking like the day they were lost. I find this hard to believe so please post a pic of these dug coins so I can learn. 8)

Pictures can be deceiving but you admit that the brass ring is new but you cant see the coin? It looks like a shiny zincoln with the surface shine wearing off. The plating is wearing off on the high spots and Im not talking about silver. It seems to me that a thousand year old buried coin would have no plating left, like your Anthony, or at the least it would be discolored.


HistoryHunter has posted some great pics and there are a couple of tiny spots that appear to be corroded and may be exposing the base metal.

No, if you are talking about the darker spots in the hair, it is some green corrosion and a little darker color corrosion kind of built up,or filling in some crevices in the hair.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I don't have to read up about patina on Ancient coins I dig them up every week just because there are no visible signs of Silver plating doesn't mean to say it never was and as for the Brass loop, that could have been added to HH coin recently.

Yes I saw your great finds in the banner. I have never dug an ancient coin but I asked you a while back to please post a pic of a dug ancient coin that has no patina, corrosion or discoloration. I believe you stated that they (a single bronze coin) can come out of the ground looking like the day they were lost. I find this hard to believe so please post a pic of these dug coins so I can learn. 8)

Pictures can be deceiving but you admit that the brass ring is new but you cant see the coin? It looks like a shiny zincoln with the surface shine wearing off. The plating is wearing off on the high spots and Im not talking about silver. It seems to me that a thousand year old buried coin would have no plating left, like your Anthony, or at the least it would be discolored.


HistoryHunter has posted some great pics and there are a couple of tiny spots that appear to be corroded and may be exposing the base metal.

No, if you are talking about the darker spots in the hair, it is some green corrosion and a little darker color corrosion kind of built up,or filling in some crevices in the hair.

It looks like the plating or guilding has worn off from wear on the high spots only. The small spot in the hair looked like it might reveal a different corroded base metal but is hard to say for sure.

Have you heard from Mr. Mark McMenamin?

 

[history hunter]

I don't have to read up about patina on Ancient coins I dig them up every week just because there are no visible signs of Silver plating doesn't mean to say it never was and as for the Brass loop, that could have been added to HH coin recently.

Yes I saw your great finds in the banner. I have never dug an ancient coin but I asked you a while back to please post a pic of a dug ancient coin that has no patina, corrosion or discoloration. I believe you stated that they (a single bronze coin) can come out of the ground looking like the day they were lost. I find this hard to believe so please post a pic of these dug coins so I can learn. 8)

Pictures can be deceiving but you admit that the brass ring is new but you cant see the coin? It looks like a shiny zincoln with the surface shine wearing off. The plating is wearing off on the high spots and Im not talking about silver. It seems to me that a thousand year old buried coin would have no plating left, like your Anthony, or at the least it would be discolored.


HistoryHunter has posted some great pics and there are a couple of tiny spots that appear to be corroded and may be exposing the base metal.

No, if you are talking about the darker spots in the hair, it is some green corrosion and a little darker color corrosion kind of built up,or filling in some crevices in the hair.

It looks like the plating or guilding has worn off from wear on the high spots only. The small spot in the hair looked like it might reveal a different base metal but is hard to say for sure.

Have you heard from Mr. Mark McMenamin?

No I have not heard from him yet. Also in a a lot of the crevices, there is either a green build up, or a darker build up.

 

[history hunter]

Perhaps, it was found long ago and cleaned before being made into a pendant? Then lost again, I don't know.

 

[history hunter]

I also went back to take a look at the close ups of the hair and saw that having taken the pictures in the direct brightness of the sun, has caused the high spots of the hair area to shine a little, sorry.