Why is the CZ3D so expensive?

[Steve Herschbach]

Funny true story there about the Gold Strike. I was new to the prototype/field test game. I knew Fred Brust, and he offered to let me get my hands on a pre-production Gold Strike. No warnings, no non-disclosure, just a "hey, want to give one a spin?" Of course I said sure.

The internet was another new toy then. I put the Gold Strike to the test against the Gold Bug 2 and some other machines. Then I went on a forum I frequented as a moderator and just did what I still do - I told the truth! It was heavy and the interface was backwards. It ran like a nugget detector designed by somebody who only did coin detectors before.

Now honestly I find the 30 kHz thing intriguing and if a Gold Strike crossed my path for under $100 I would probably buy it. It actually had some punch, and I later saw Fred and his son dig a walnut sized nugget elbow deep at Ganes Creek with an early Gold Strike. It had good depth on big gold. But the hot rock handling would drive you nuts with the two tone responses on everything. I had a guy at Moore Creek swear he would have tossed his Gold Strike in the creek were it not that he could sell it used for a few buck.

But I digress. In a nutshell it was not the Gold Bug 3 everyone including myself was waiting for (still waiting!) and I pretty much said just that online. I immediately got a call from Fred "oh my God, oh my God, you were not supposed to say anything. Fisher did not know about this and now I am in hot water." So I pulled the post and replaced it with an apology to Fred for having unwittingly overstepped my bounds.

Unfortunately I do not possess great powers - my wife keeps me informed about that daily. Stuff strikes a chord with the public or it does not, and the Gold Strike struck out. They never even got around to building the accessory coils for it it went down in smoke so fast. But now another little bit of history has been told. I am going to find that old post - I keep everything - and repost it soon. Still the best review ever written on the detector.

 

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[H-2 CHARLIE]

I could only dream of a 15 inch coil for my GB Pro. Lol

 

[mikeraydj]

I'm assuming that the ground balance function works fine, and that you're referring to the push switch.

Yep, there's a reason, but it's a reason that doesn't matter to customers.

Please tell me the reason. As it matters to me, and I have been asked many times as to it's function. I hope it is not a secret.

 

[olstinker]

Please tell me the reason. As it matters to me, and I have been asked many times as to it's function. I hope it is not a secret.

Im in the same boat. Ive been using an F5 for several months and Im still trying to understand everything about it.

 

[Steve Herschbach]

Got bad news for you guys. See number two below. But maybe since it is Christmas.......



Dave Johnson
Chief Designer: Bounty Hunter, Teknetics, and Fisher brand metal detectors.
Located in El Paso, Texas.

Because of my job situation, I read forums a lot but rarely post.

In my situation, there are three kinds of inquiries which I generally won't respond to.

1. Questions relating to products we may have under development. (That information is on a we-need-you-to-know basis only.)

2. "Why" questions. Why did you do this, why don't you do that, etc. (Why we do things is nobody else's business.)

3. Questions relating to what happens "behind the scenes" in metal detector software. (That usually involves trade secrets.)

In general, I am not interested in arguments of the "this brand is better than that brand" sort.

In general, I am not in a position to help someone with their special metal detector project.

In general, I am willing to discuss issues which I have raised in a forum post, including mention of specific makes and models if that's relevant to the issue of the post.

--Dave Johnson

 

[mikeraydj]

Like I said I want to know why my machine has a button that apparently does nothing? Being told it is none of my business is not much of an answer.

 

[woof!]

It's that way for reasons that matter to the factory. Those reasons are irrelevant to the customer.

I don't usually answer "why?" questions that pertain to internal company business matters.

 

[DizzyDigger]

Like I said I want to know why my machine has a button that apparently
does nothing? Being told it is none of my business is not much of an answer.

Your situation sounds like one I used to run into with German
manufactured electronics. Their way was the only way, and
you needed to learn and understand their methods..it was never
the instruments fault.

I can can tell you that companies spend vast amounts of
capital on R&D, and it could well be that button was
installed for a planned feature that never came to fruition.
Rather than a complete re-design, they just left it in the
case design.

Being told it's "none of your business" when you have invested in a
product manufactured by that company is very bad juju. Such an answer
does not increase trust in the company, nor will it bring repeat business.

JMHO

 

[mikeraydj]

It's that way for reasons that matter to the factory. Those reasons are irrelevant to the customer.

I don't usually answer "why?" questions that pertain to internal company business matters.

No disrespect. I didn't realize that I was prying into the companies internal business matters. If it was something so sensitive, why did the company put this so glaringly on the front of my machine rather than internally, so no one would notice, or have access to this secret button? I also at first thought it was for a feature that never came to be. But then I realized that if that were the case why would they continue to put a clicking multi-function knob(that is supposed to only do one thing, adjust Ground balance) on the machine instead of replacing it with a single function knob like those on the rest of the machine?

 

[woof!]

Belly buttons. Some people gots innies and some people gots outties. Mine's an outie. I've been worrying myself half to death wondering why?, why?, why? O LORD have you done this mysterious thing? Even twisted the preach's arm trying to get 'im to find the answer in the Bible, but the cuss said he ain't wastin' his time on that project, it doesn't matter. So I posted on a kinda kinky forum thinking they might have some clues, but they just told me if it's an outie they don't care whether I push it or not, doesn't make no never mind to them. ........ So I push it every now and then just to verify it's still an outie, but nothing else still happens, I guess that's why the folks on the kinky forum who were into G-spots and such weren't interested in this one. .......I finally decided the preacher was right, it doesn't make a damn bit of difference anyhow, so I stopped worrying about it.

 

[mikeraydj]

Belly buttons. Some people gots innies and some people gots outties. Mine's an outie. I've been worrying myself half to death wondering why?, why?, why? O LORD have you done this mysterious thing? Even twisted the preach's arm trying to get 'im to find the answer in the Bible, but the cuss said he ain't wastin' his time on that project, it doesn't matter. So I posted on a kinda kinky forum thinking they might have some clues, but they just told me if it's an outie they don't care whether I push it or not, doesn't make no never mind to them. ........ So I push it every now and then just to verify it's still an outie, but nothing else still happens, I guess that's why the folks on the kinky forum who were into G-spots and such weren't interested in this one. .......I finally decided the preacher was right, it doesn't make a damn bit of difference anyhow, so I stopped worrying about it.

Wow! Your response is kinda disturbing. Rather than address clearly an issue that a customer has, and a legitimate reason to ask. All you are offering is this bizarre response? I could understand if I were a child and a parent said just because. But we are all adults here. This is the Fisher thread. I am a Fisher customer. Being told none of your business, don't ask questions, and we know better than you as to what you should know, is not good customer relations or good business. This is a weird rant coming from a company that depends on the relationship it builds with it's customers. I would expect that kind of a response from a troll, not a company rep.

 

[G.A.P.metal]

I go along with what the Preacher said !
I got 4 buttons on my Dish Remote that do nothing !
Dave designs/makes, the very best machines along with the rest of the engineers At First Texas.
We are lucky to have Dave on here to answer are questions...no other company offers so much insight as FT here with Dave.
Please don't push him off our site by calling names...he will answer some questions and some he won't, and some he can`t.
Gary

 

[mikeraydj]

I am not disrespecting his contribution to our hobby. I applaud it. I am sure he is stellar in his field. I am sure he can think rings around me with his engineering experience. But telling a customer to just don't worry your pretty head and that we know what is acceptable to ask and what is not, is not good customer relations. In my field I am a journalist and I have always found that truth always seeks the light of day. It doesn't say you dare not look here. Just give the straight story and be done with it, rather than be vague, and act like oz behind the curtain, and respond with bizarre answers to straight forward questions. Not unreasonable. Everyone always says learn your machine inside and out so you can be the most effective in your hobby. I invested what was a great deal of money for me in this machine. It is not asking too much to get the straight story as to why it is the way it is. That means every button and knob.

 

[Fletch88]

I'm with Gary, please don't hammer Dave too much. I like when he does divulge info that is useful or just interesting to hear in his long history of developing detectors!

 

[woof!]

Not to worry, Gary, getting complained at doesn't make me go away.

Forums are a great place to do psychological research, and what I posted was test questions. I've been around the block enough times on forums to recognize that when someone is badgering a "why?" that's irrelevant to them or is none of their business, they've been told that, and they still keep it up, you've got two choices: tell them and be attacked, or not tell them and be attacked. Since this is both in the category of "none of your business" and also "irrelevant to the customer", I decided not to tell them. And looks like I caught two with one post. The other guy implies that American companies (apart from ours of course) pay customer service people to research and disclose whatever "why" questions a customer can come up with, no matter how irrelevant... and then to argue with the customer when the customer says we shouldn't have done it this way or that. In fact not only do German companies not play that game, no company on the planet plays that game.

You've been in business for a long time, too, Gary. Betcha you know very well how the "why?" game works and when not to play, eh?

 

[woof!]

Mike, the straight story is that the push switch on the knob is irrelevant to you. You suspected that was the case from the beginning and you've had it reaffirmed several times. That is the straight story.

Now let's suppose hypothetically that if I were to waste a bunch of time tracking down all the information that is irrelevant to the customer but relevant to the factory, and were to provide you with that information, what on earth would you do with that information?

I betcha Gary knows what you'd do with it, but he's probably gonna bite his tongue.

 

[mikeraydj]

First of all I have not badgered you, nor have I called you names. Look back at the thread. My questions are legitimate about the piece of equipment I bought from your company. If you choose to answer my questions that is your choice. If your answers are not satisfactory that is my problem, not yours. That doesn't mean I will stop asking which is my right as a consumer. This is not a personal attack, I understand that there are some things that you can address and can't address as a company man. But please don't get mad at me because I refuse to accept the company line and continue to try to find an answer that addresses my questions to my satisfaction, not yours. I am sad that you have chosen to pull in other members of this forum to prop up your argument. (which are dealers of your product). And by the way I determine what is relevant to me. I can see this will end badly for me. I will be seen as a trouble maker and a complaint will be made to a mod. Who am I? Just a customer asking questions that wants a satisfactory answer. On the other hand you are a sponsor. How long do you think it will be before I get squashed? The thread will probably be deleted and no one will be the wiser. For some reason I don't think this discussion will make it in the Fisher World Treasure news.

 

[Steve Herschbach]

The knob does not do anything when you push it. Seems simple to me.

Enough of this though, I am going detecting. You all have a Merry Christmas!

 

[G.A.P.metal]

Newfiehunter
We have chatted about the Cz Series on the Teknetics forum and in PMs.
I know you love those machines, as do i... over the 18 years i keep a CZ 6-a two coils and on and off Cz 5s a couple of times...and just sold my last Cz 5 4 days ago.
I bought the new T2 Ltd. the enhanced one and that machine is everything the Cz is but Dual Frek.
I have an old foundation cerca 1834, 400 ft. from the house, and i have pounded it for 24 years with every machine i sold was tested there by me and my hunting partner.
That new T2 has brought that site back to life, i have found so much more in one day there...than in the last 4 years.
You owe it to yourself to try the new DST models Tek. T2 and Fisher F75....so many modes to hunt in and all effective at their purpose.
If you hunt in parks you will love 3b the bottle cap mode i,tried it at a house where they have been throwing out caps for 30 years off the porch...it told me where the bottle caps and worked on the very old and the more recent caps.
Along with all the other modes and scary deep,lite weight ... i will not miss the Cz.
Gary

 

[woof!]

Mike, I rather doubt that the thread is going to be deleted. Nor would I expect anything you've posted so far to get deleted from the thread, it's really not that big a deal. No need to lose sleep over that. Even entertaining to some, although you might want to lose sleep over that. In all fairness, I hadn't noticed that you'd called me any names, I'm supposing Gary read a little to hastily or was projecting what he was expecting to happen next.

Badgering of course he got right. If you want to know what the pushbutton does that might or might not be of interest to you, that's a fair question and it's been answered repeatedly. I suppose it can be answered again if you like. The problem is that you keep going back to "why?" after you've already been told that you have no need whatsoever for an explanation and that I'm not going to provide one.