Why hasnt the government figured it out yet?

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

ivan salis said:
our leaders (if they were honest) would place tarriffs to level the feild so that exploitive countries can not just gut our markets in this manner.
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Yup.

mrs.oroblanco said:
It is a result of what we pride ourselves to be - capitalists. Where an individual or company can expect to make the best profit they can.
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You are right on all counts.

But I think that capitalism is a euphemism. Capital refers to wealth which is used to make more wealth, with no product or service in between. Things like trading silver on paper to the extent that there is more owned on paper than there exists in metallic form! Things like banks loaning out money which doesn't exist (fractional lending)!---then foreclosing as much as they can! It's money manipulation, to the end that they have it all and everyone else has none.

Most people do pride themselves on producing a good product or service, and on making a business successful based on that (treasure hunting and prospecting included).

But I think that capitalism might better be called wealthism, because just a few people get wealthy while not producing anything good for anyone else.

It seems like the idea is being pushed at us that there are only two possible systems, either capitalism or communism. But I think that's another multiple-choice limitation to get people to accept Wealthism.

Don
 

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Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

I have been advocating tariffs for not only imports, but when an American company exports their jobs and imports the products back to us here.

I just think it is real "fair trade".

B
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

B;

mrs.oroblanco said:
I have been advocating tariffs for not only imports, but when an American company exports their jobs and imports the products back to us here.
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That makes sense, of course.

The problem is that the people who are making our laws are certainly aware of that too. If they weren't aware of that, then they wouldn't be the experts that they all claim to be when running for office, would they? So either way, they are lying. And if they are lying, then it's pretty obvious that they all know that they are lying. And if they all know that they are lying, then they are all keeping those lies a secret amongst themselves. That is not a good thing. That needs to be handled before any corrective measures can be put in place. It is handled simply by exposing it.

So my reply to the topic title is, "Oh, they have figured it out. They have it all figured out!"

The Prediction---
http://circleof13.blogspot.com/2008/11/bankers-manifesto-of-1892.html

The Proof---
http://www.cnn.com/2009/OPINION/10/24/greene.wall.street/index.html

:coffee2:
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

I've seen that 'manifesto' before.

Part of the problem is that a good majority of people think that these huge companies are paying most of their profits to their shareholders, which is so far from the truth that it isn't funny.

They keep shareholders happy by having a dividend, certainly, but they 'hide' - legally, profits and they decide what percentage they will pay to shareholders. Dividends are set by the company, regardless of profits, on a percentage of-------no, not profits, but profits AFTER adjustments.

Now, of course, not every single company does it, but, the large majority does. Shareholders get 3 or 4 percent on their money (more than putting their money in a savings account) and they are happy.

And, by the way, if you own stocks, (of the voting variety), when you get a prospectus, read it and vote. These companies count on you not to vote against what they want to do - every non-vote, is a vote FOR whatever the company wants to do - that's also legal - for them to cast a vote on your behalf.

B
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

I've never owned stocks, and I've never studied or run across the dividends thing. It fits right in with the rest of the big picture, though (what I've seen of it, that is).

It seems that many people have experienced portions of what's really going on, but it's not until they all communicate that the whole thing starts to make sense (or nonsense, actually).

I think that the people who are secretly "pulling the strings" are in a race to get into absolute control before everyone sees what they are doing and why. I also think that they have had some setbacks, and so needed to speed up their plans. But in their rush, they have made some blunders which are so obvious that they are exposing their activities to everyone.
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

Monty, I believe the government has figured it out. Gov't heads rarely do anything that is not in their own best interests. Hence, their own med program and unlimited retirement, not to mention having set up "automatic" raises each year without a finger stroke. Oh, they know very well what they're doing.

As far as world trade goes, they have their fingers in that, too. And lobbyists; don't get me started. I used to wonder (briefly) why a person would spend millions to secure a position that only paid $200,000 or less a year. Going into the office, if they won, they were broke, with nothing more to show than a few hundred thousand in net worth. Four years later, they're all millionaires. Ever wonder why? Lots and lots of perks. And once they "retire," or lose an election, they remain millionaires, maybe reaching billionaire status.

The lack of industrialization in the US now will be detrimental to the nation, just as it was for the South in the Civil War. The North had all the industry, yet today's politicians have forgotten this. A country without a means of supporting itself is at the mercy of the world, and our "leaders" don't care. They basically SHOVED businesses to other countries over the last two decades.

China’s products are all over the U.S., in every store and in mass quantities. And they’re cheap replicas of U.S. goods, in general. Those few U.S. companies still in business are struggling, and in my viewpoint should be catered to at every opportunity. I ordered a wood stove last week from a factory in Iowa. Saw one that looked just like it at a local hardware store yesterday, but on the back it was emblazoned with “CHINA.” Cheaper, you bet. Thinner cast iron, wobbly legs, no sealing thread. $125 cheaper. You can have it; I stuck with my USA model.

And consider that Chinese companies bought the Corning product legal rights a few years back, including the name. Today, though, those “Corning”-labeled products sold from China to WalMart and other companies are NOT the old Corning products. They break (shatter!) in ovens and on stovetops. Read the tiny print on the paperwork before you buy your next Corning product.

We’ve got to get back to supporting our own companies here in this country. AND we’ve got to get rid of the career politicians who have already overly-invested themselves of our country and our dollars.

Noodle
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

You know the old saying:

The Golden Rule

He who has the gold, makes the rules.


B
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

We don't have to import all this stuff! It's that simple! Our country is one of few in the world that has been in the past and can be in the future if necessary, completely self sufficient. We have the biggest natural gas reserve and unexplored natural gas in the ground to provide this countrie's energy needs for 300 years according to Boone Pickens. Natural gas is the cleanest fuel ever discovered by man but the government is dead set against using it for some reason. My daughter lives in S. Texas and they have fresh fruit and veggies year around from the southern part of Texas. We import things because we want to, not because we have to. And let's talk about our national debt. How many trillions of dollars do you think was owed to us after WWII? And after Korean conflict also, and all the other developing countries we financed around the world? We have always forgiven the debts instead of collecting unlike our lenders now. What if we just refuse to pay? Would that be a bad thing? China owed us trillions of dollars but never paid, ditto everyone else. Look how this country was in the 1950s. Everyone remembers them fondly. A 3 bedroom house and a two car garage was the American Dream. What is it now? Beats me. I just know more is never enough and the line between the lower income and middle income classes is infinately thinner than it was. The trend is to rely on the government to provide a nanny state, birth to grave and ever one poor. Oh hell I'm getting carried away! It all goes back to what I said in my original post, destroy the country by destroying it's financial base. When the USSR collapsed how many fat cats do you think were created and took control of everything? Where are they now? Somewhere between socialism and limited free enterprise. While the fat cats are trying to retain the old communist ways to remain in power such as Putin. Enough said for now. Monty
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

Was it Putin that said yesterday not to "threaten" Russia with capitalism? Correct me, please, if I'm wrong.

Monty, you say "We don't have to import all this stuff! It's that simple! Our country is one of few in the world that has been in the past and can be in the future if necessary, completely self sufficient."

You left out "the present." What's in the past isn't true anymore. The factories are closed on American soil; they've moved to India, China, Thailand, etc. They are no longer here. The owners/stockholders realize more $$ that way. The government drove a number of them out by taxing the heck out of them. Plus the advantage of the owners of having less operating costs (salaries) by farming the factories out to third world countries with no minimum wage/age.

Frankly, I'd like to say we don't NEED all that stuff. Not just the importing of. I've decided to try and find USA-made products to purchase, even at a slightly higher price, and ignore China/India,Thailand/etc. products. Not easy. But I'm trying. I figure if I can NOT buy non-USA products, maybe that might make a weak difference. But, like I said, it's not easy.
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

Noodle...I'm trying to read between the lines and I agree with your ideas, but who's going to bring back the factories to America. I would come out of retirement to work one of these factiries if our companies had the -alls to build them on American soil.
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

Grrrr
I agree with you Monty. It is because we are losing our constitutional rights as a people and we can not come together as one and curb out of control government. Yes I think that the Greatest generation was of world war 11. Every generation after that has been more lax willing to work less and wanting more.The government knows that and its why they are slowly taking over and controlling every aspect of our lives. Geez I could go on forever. But we do work for the government. Everyone.
I will say I am very proud of our troops and I think in them lies our hopes. It will take gonads, What will we do when China calls its debts in.We the people will do nothing its what the gov will do that scares me.
I need to hurry up and find my treasure :icon_sunny:
TnMtns
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

Seamuss, I don't know who's going to bring the factories back to America. They left for a reason. A new factory is trying to open in our small area. They moved into a former GM factory that went out of business several years ago. Supposedly they're building a new fantastic car. The government put up several million on top of the several millions of private investors, then the community had to pass a tax to put up another $15 million. So far the car is under wraps. The community had to put up a lot of trust in order to pass that tax, which they did last week in the hopes it would benefit the community. Small businesses are the backbone of this country, but Uncle Sam is taxing them out of business.

TnMtns, the loss of our constitutional rights is right. And from the looks of the present administration, it's going to get worse before it gets better. Yes, China has already hinted that it doesn't like how much we're spending, considering they're loaning the US the money to spend. And every day you see where the WH is spending more and more and more. The kids are in charge of the candy store.
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

this is all a result of one thing. IZ CALLED THE GLOBAL ECONOMY.

computers and modern manufacturing methods have combined

so the american worker is now competeing for jobs on the worldwide

basis.we make at least several thousands per year. check how many countries

have a yearly avg annual income under 1000 bux.
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

True, but you have to remember that in some countries, those "under 1000 bux" will buy you a mansion and 10 servants. (In other words, rich)

B
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

I could take my modest retirement income and move to Mexico and live quite well, much better than I do here. But even with our crime stats I stand a better chance of being robbed and murdered in Mexico. And besides there's too many foreigners down there! :wink: ;D Monty
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

try coasta rica --very stable -- dollar goes a long way ---still ;D --- if something were to happen to my missus ( only reason I stay in the usa is her -- I'd be going south of the border --costa rica -- on $2,000 a month * 24,000 a year --live quite nice --- since their normal per capita income is about $12,000 * )
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

I got too many kids and grandkids to do that, but it is tempting. I think I could support the entire family on our combined retirement income based on the $12,000 per annum figure. But then, how many of those folks live near or below the poverty level? How about access to medical care? (Important to old farts like me), education for the grandkids, etc.? I'm sure there are a lot of other considerations I haven't thought of. Monty
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

lots of old cia spook types ( old freinds of mine) live down there --- decent standard of living on say $12,000 --- good at $18,000--- very nice at $24,000 --- couple grand a month you live very nice indeed .
( full time maid / cook $200 month or so -- garderner / house tender about the same )

great place for a old goat gringo to hang out with a $2,000 a month pension --nice warm weather , good cheap rum & cigars --freindly girls - great off shore fishing -- low crime rate , decent and affordible medical care , freindly folks --very politically stable --their banks pay high interest too!! however being able to or learning to speak spanish would be a huge plus.

if not for the missus -- asta la vista baby
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

ivan salis said:
try coasta rica --very stable -- dollar goes a long way ---still ;D --- if something were to happen to my missus ( only reason I stay in the usa is her -- I'd be going south of the border --costa rica -- on $2,000 a month * 24,000 a year --live quite nice --- since their normal per capita income is about $12,000 * )
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Sounds like a fun place when I get older. Could just sell off everything here and live like the king I was supposed to be :icon_king:
 

Re: Why hasn't the government figured it out yet?

;D ;D ;D Ivan,

If "the old lady" were to go, you'd probably have to forget about the friendly girls! ;D ;D

B
 

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