The Solution Rest Here.....

[ECS]

"Once a again, is there any evidence outside of the pamphlet that can show the chain of custody of the ciphers and then the story from Beale to Morriss, then from Morriss to "unknown" author, and then from the "unknown" author to Ward and Sherman?"

Obviously, the only place that lengthy string exist is in the pamphlet story. We could only hope that we could eventually arrive at all of that outside of the pamphlet...

Suggesting that the author simply grabbed prior information in the writing of his story is easy to do.... it's a strong theory, and even one that I've not discounted... Maybe you should try to find that evidence outside of the pamphlet. A simple communication between Ward and Sherman, or even Hutter, in regards to their conspiring to write the story would do it...

When you look at the 1885 Beale Papers on its merits-when and where it was published, who was the printer, who holds the copyright ownership, the "borrowed" tales from other outside sources, ciphers similar to those employed by the Confederacy, the Risqué bloodline connection, it demonstrates that nothing is more deceptive than obvious fact.

 

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[bigscoop]

When you look at the 1885 Beale Papers on its merits-when and where it was published, who was the printer, who holds the copyright ownership, the "borrowed" tales from other outside sources, ciphers similar to those employed by the Confederacy, the Risqué bloodline connection, it demonstrates that nothing is more deceptive than obvious fact.

What it demonstrates is that some people can make themselves believe that their personal speculations are the only, "obvious facts". So glad you posted such a great example in such a deceptive, but obvious way.

 

[ConceptualizedNetherlandr]

Offering differing opinions is one thing, but my definition of a skeptic is not something anyone needs.

Do you resemble your definition ?

You have a right to you're thought, and they have a right to theirs.

And in this country you had the right to a decent public education, why did you choose to not claim it?

If we had spent the time on this that the skeptics have spent, we would probably have found the treasure by now.

So then, why didn't you?

I understand, and use to feel the same way. But when skeptics fail to produce evidence to the contrary, especially when asked to do so, then it only serves to add additional strength to what's been presented. I've posted many uncertainties with just this purpose in mind, to see what gets tossed back. There's really a lot to be learned sometimes in what gets thrown back, even from those pestering skeptics. So more often then not they actually help you build your case, or evidence when they toss something constructive back. And it's very frustrating to them when they can't.

Scoop this: fallacious argument. Challenge the other guy to prove a negative. Good night.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

What it demonstrates is that some people can make themselves believe that their personal speculations are the only, "obvious facts". So glad you posted such a great example in such a deceptive, but obvious way.

Well, it's a "Truth" in R & I, TH'ing, etc.; when you have NOTHING more to add/say... start "attacking" OTHERS.

 

[ECS]

What it demonstrates is that some people can make themselves believe that their personal speculations are the only, "obvious facts". So glad you posted such a great example in such a deceptive, but obvious way.

I only posted what is "known" concerning the publication of the 1885 Beale pamphlet- Its not my fault that no French/Bonaparte/Girard/Lafitte "connexion" in the basic facts of the 1885 publication.

 

[bigscoop]

I only posted what is "known" concerning the publication of the 1885 Beale pamphlet- Its not my fault that no French/Bonaparte/Girard/Lafitte "connexion" in the basic facts of the 1885 publication.

I noticed you abandoned "obvious facts" this time around. I think that was prudent.

So did you have a good Christmas? Was Santa good to you?

 

[ECS]

So did you have a good Christmas? Was Santa good to you?

Santa brought me an iron strongbox that contained 3 ciphers, a copy of the DOI, Vattel's LAW OF NATIONS in French, a bottle of absinthe with a slotted spoon shaped like a key, some sugar cubes, and a handwritten story about a buffalo hunt.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Santa brought me an iron strongbox that contained 3 ciphers, a copy of the DOI, Vattel's LAW OF NATIONS in French, a bottle of absinthe with a slotted spoon shaped like a key, some sugar cubes, and a handwritten story about a buffalo hunt.

Golly GEE!

 

[bigscoop]

Santa brought me an iron strongbox that contained 3 ciphers, a copy of the DOI, Vattel's LAW OF NATIONS in French, a bottle of absinthe with a slotted spoon shaped like a key, some sugar cubes, and a handwritten story about a buffalo hunt.

Hmmm....you don't say. Now is that a matter of fact?

 

[ECS]

SOLUTION TO CIPHER # 1

... So in essence, the author has just used the original story to create his own fictional novel. He's pretty clear about that.

"This is a work of fiction. All of the characters, locations, and events portrayed in this pamphlet are either the product of he author's imagination, or the names, events, and locations are used fictitiously."

 

[Rebel - KGC]

"This is a work of fiction. All of the characters, locations, and events portrayed in this pamphlet are either the product of he author's imagination, or the names, events, and locations are used fictitiously."

Golly GEE!

 

[bigscoop]

"This is a work of fiction. All of the characters, locations, and events portrayed in this pamphlet are either the product of he author's imagination, or the names, events, and locations are used fictitiously."

Well, that's the first time I ever saw you post that theory/opinion. Oh wait a minute, no it isn't.

 

[ECS]

Well, that's the first time I ever saw you post that theory/opinion. Oh wait a minute, no it isn't.

Not that different from your basic premise-a literary allegory to an Adams_Onis, French, Bonapartist, Girard, Lafitte connexion that has nothing to do with the actual story contained in Beale 1885.
Either the entire events in the 1885 Beale Papers are true, as written, or, per your theory, they relate to some other event entirely, therefore the characters, locations, and events in Beale 1885 are used fictitiously.

 

[bigscoop]

Not that different from your basic premise-a literary allegory to an Adams_Onis, French, Bonapartist, Girard, Lafitte connexion that has nothing to do with the actual story contained in Beale 1885.
Either the entire events in the 1885 Beale Papers are true, as written, or, per your theory, they relate to some other event entirely, therefore the characters, locations, and events in Beale 1885 are used fictitiously.

Hmmmm.....when I read what you just posted it seems to say, "I have no idea as to what the truth might really be and I'm open to the possibilities."

 

[ECS]

It never ceases to amaze me how your deductive acumen leads to erroneous conclusions.

 

[bigscoop]

It never ceases to amaze me how your deductive acumen leads to erroneous conclusions.

No.....it's just that you've pretty much succeeded in raising reasonable argument with yourself.
But I'm glad to see that at least half of you is finally considering that there might be other possibilities behind the tale.

 

[ECS]

The entire story has to do with two things, the events in Texas surrounding the Adams Onis Treaty and the plotting of a New France under Napoleon Bonaparte.

No connexion has been made to tie these events to Beale 1885, and I seriously doubt that any connection will ever be made between these events and the Beale pamphlet.
But at least you do concur that the characters, events, and locations are either products of the authors imagination, or are used fictitiously.

 

[ECS]

“Connexions” is used with good reason, French Creole, "connection" is used in the pamphlet again but it is only in the beginning of the story that the author ask you to make the “connexions”. The author was an intelligent man...

... French Connection . The entire region was full of it. Beale, Buford, Sherman, etc., during the era they were all Bonapartist.

This is why those two timely shipments of wealth that I already outlined were secretly shipped to Bedford County for distribution, as promised...

The author/authors of Beale 1885 are still unknown, are we to believe that they also held French/Bonpartist sympathies, or for that matter, why was 1821 Bedford county such a French/ Bonapartist hotbed?
As for this to be the reason that "those two timely shipments" were secretly shipped to Bedford county, that is just pure conjecture.
Saying it is so, does not make it so, it is just forcing real events into Beale 1885 to prove a pet theory.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

The author/authors of Beale 1885 are still unknown, are we to believe that they also held French/Bonpartist sympathies, or for that matter, why was 1821 Bedford county such a French/ Bonapartist hotbed?
As for this to be the reason that "those two timely shipments" were secretly shipped to Bedford county, that is just pure conjecture.
Saying it is so, does not make it so, it is just forcing real events into Beale 1885 to prove a pet theory.

Called "shoe-horning"...

 

[bigscoop]

I think the difference, which undoubtedly will always be the difference, resides within the depth of the research undertaken in exploring the long debated and very real possibility put before you.

So real was the threat and cause that Jefferson himself would later write of his opinion that if the French were allowed to colonize in the Louisiana territory that it would leave the Americans no choice but to bed with the British. This illustrates just how strong the French/Bonaparte support in this country really was. Pretty amazing bit of history once you're aware of its existence and its looming threat and what brought that threat to an end, many of the how's & whys, etc.

From 1817 to 1821 a war of supremacy was being quietly waged in the borderlands and men from Bedford County were there, big money being there as well, money that was sent back east with a plan for distribution, these dates of shipment being in "exact" correlation with the dates of the two Beale deposits. In years afterwords we discover two documented accounts complaining of failed distributions, the source of both accounts originating from individuals who were directly involved in the affairs and wealth in the borderlands, at least one of these shipments very likely involving Mexico Sherman of Bedford County, Virginia.

The physical activities in the Beale story took place between 1817-1821 and it involved two shipments of secret wealth coming from west to east, these dates of deposits correlating "exactly" with the dates of two very important events concerning the borderlands, also two secret shipments of wealth that were to be distributed as promised. These two deposits, as we are told in the pamphlet, were never distributed as intended. John Sherman was the editor of press that produced the Beale Pamphlet, his uncle was Mexico Sherman, a man who was in and out of the borderlands from 1817-1821. Beale and his party supposedly got their wealth from an area in Colorado that was part of the borderland battle for supremacy.

But you guys are right, there is no possible connection at all in any of the above.