Solomons Gold and Historys Great Treasures

[kanabite]

here we go again, Filmmakers search for Montezuma's treasure in Kanab pond | KSL.com

 

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[zionstroy]

Have known this man for several years and seen what he discusses. There is much to be learned here!

 

[RWLJ]

Kanabite, you posted that they are looking for the Aztec treasure in Kanab pond. You also have previous asked me if I had been involved with my son’s in that pond or lake.

Let me give you a little true history. Around nineteen fifty-seven my step father moved into a little canyon half a mile south of what we called the Three Lakes at that time. They are calling the bigger one on the south a pond. I was fourteen at the time we move to that little canyon with the caves of the colored sand in them. It is about half a mile below the pond they are looking for the Aztec treasure in.

I swam in that lake many times and I saw a number of times where people dived or jumped off about half way up the cliff into the water. I once took a chain and tied it to a tube and used the rest as a weight to carry me to the bottom fast. I hooked it to an old boat that was down on the bottom and pulled it out and I stuck it back on top of the water but it sunk really fast do to the holes that where in it.

While living there a man came up to us that want by the name Apache Jim. He questioned my dad on a number of things. He was not the only one that visited my step dad at that time. There was another treasure hunter that said the Aztec treasure was divided into seven parts and he said one of the seven parts was buried in a rock slide behind our cabin. He also said that there would be dead bodies buried in the entrance of the cave guarding the treasure. At the time I had no way of knowing if the man was right or wrong.

I went up there and started digging around and uncovered the top of a small tunnel like cave which encouraged me. The cave was full of sand and was easy digging. As I dug back in two or three feet the fill sand in the cave caved in and out of the bank rolled a human skull. By that time I started to get a little exited. The tunnel soon ended and I found nothing more than the skeleton and I recognized it as a fairly young person. My brother started digging right below that spot and found a sizeable pocket carved in the soft sand stone rock with a rock lid over it making a sarcophagus. In this they found several skeletons and hundreds of little, round, flat black and white beads. I remembered one skull had a hole in it which I considered that it had been made be an arrow or a bullet. But what really caught my attention was that one big skull had a double set of teeth on the top and the bottom. One row was directly in front of the other row. We talked about what we found to a few people in Kanab and we were soon visited by some one that claimed to be an archeologist from St George. He asked for the skull, so we gave it to him. I never heard anything since. I know what I saw was real.

Years later my brother DL called me from up north and told me how he had been in communication with Apache Jim. He said that Apache Jim had told him. I believe he has this on tape. He told me that he had taped many of their conversations. He said that the Navajo fathers had told him (Apache Jim) that they had watched the Aztec bury their treasures. They said the Aztecs went up this canyon to the north and had branched to the left and they came to three small lakes.

So a couple of my sons and I went over to the lake in the middle of the winter time. We took a battery and a long cord with a powerful light at the end of it and my two sons with their warm suits went in and went along the back of the cave exploring it. They saw some big carp. Other divers sensing them and it being harder to see (during other months of the year) might have thought they were Aztec ghosts. The other divers likely became disoriented because the cave circles around. There was not anything spooky about anything in the lake unless you thought the big carp where ghosts or you lost your direction. What you have is a big round arch shaped cave and as it caved off over the years the pile in the middle matched the top somewhat and so if you go along the side you might think you are in a tunnel but it just curves around the back and goes back out the other side. It gives you a U shaped low place around the pile in the middle of the cave.

Latter when we heard that Brent Childs was looking for the Aztec treasure there I thought someone had bugged my phone and tipped him off. Later I bummed into Brent Childs and told him the story. I did not question him about what got him thinking that the Aztec treasure was there. I do not think it was the little marker above the cave or his study on water trap. To me it is more likely that someone tipped him off having bugged our phone. Utah is notaries for being involved in major spying. Return missionaries and others play a big part in intelligent gathering. Being I had a relative that was notorious and being there were those that wanted to believe that I was involved with him. Even thou I had nothing to do with his craziness, I believe my phones have been tapped for a long time. Who gave Brent Childs the information? That I do not know. Probable the same ones that was behind him getting stopped.

At the time I checked Three Lakes out I did not think that there was any treasure there. Now I absolutely do not believe that they ever put any treasure there. To me the whole story is Indian red herring. The Aztec treasures where hidden in the Superstitious Mountains. I do not think I need to say more. This is for those that believe in secondary named places.

R. W.

 

[kanabite]

interesting , if it makes you feel better i believe you about the skull with the double rows of teeth . funny how any of that kind of stuff seems to be missing from those archeological survey notes . i grew up there too , i never found a tunnel under the water either . it was like an urban legend almost . the story went something like this , back in the forties or fifties before they built the dance floor just south of the big lake , three lakes use to flow down the canyon , there was suppose to be trout in it back then because it was more fresh water when it had an outlet . during one of those dances the story goes that some drunk kid jumped off the half or maybe off the top depending on who was telling the story and went missing under the water . the rest of the teens that were swimming recovered the almost drowned kid and discovered this tunnel with a room back under the ledge . i even had those who claimed to have been in the room years after , almost like a right of passage . we were not treasure hunting when we were kids , but tried to find this mysterious tunnel and room . it has been a long time ago , but we gave up, and decided the story of a room was bogus or we were in the wrong lake .

i knew two kids that claimed they dug up a seven foot Anasazi a few miles south of where you are saying you lived. and i have always kind of been a little suspicious of the cave Dupont excavation that took place in cave lakes canyon , just a stones throw from your cabin .
i know there is a lot of crazy stuff in that country , seen a couple things myself that might cause a person to really wonder about what has gone on . i have seen the three crosses on the hill painted in the cave in helldive and some other stuff that depending on ones background might lead to some kind of biblical history explanation , but IMO there are just as many other theories that fit . IMHO theories are a far cry from proof . don't take this the wrong way , i am not bashing on you at all . i am not above adjusting the working model , i have just seen some things that lead me to believe it would be premature to hang my own hat on your conclusions.

 

[H-2 CHARLIE]

What's the total of Aztec pieces ever found ? Where were they really found at. ? My friend is hopi and he is going to ask his dad this question he goes to the reservation a few times a year . He said his dad worked on the res. back in the 40s . and if he dont know he can ask around the hopi res.

 

[markmar]

R.W.

You wrote : " The Aztec treasures where hidden in the Superstitious Mountains. "

I agree . I have write about and I have given explanations at http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/aztec-gold/133325-location-aztec-gold-7.html page 7 .

 

[RWLJ]

Hello Marius,

I am sorry I did not make myself clearer. I said that the Aztec treasures were in the Superstitious Mountains. I was being a little bit sarcastic. I did not make it clear which Superstitious Mountains I was talking about. When you read history about the sacred mines (Solomon’s Mines) and where the Aztecs took their treasures and buried them in one of the sacred mines. You will find several hundred years where the Spanish worked some of the mines off and on. The last ones were the Peraltas and Gonzalez family and their help.

Once the Spanish took control of some of the mines the Indians went along like everything was ok. Until they could gather enough forces to overwhelm the Spanish and drive them out or kill them. This happened several times. New people coming or past workers not wanting to create problems with those that could present claims on the mines, called them by new names. Most of the Spanish did not know what was hidden in the other mines that were close by that were cleverly concealed because of what was in them. When the Spanish tortured the Indians to learn where the mines where the Indians took them to the weaker mines that did not have any sacred artifacts in them. Indians would kill other Indians if they betrayed the whereabouts of the sacred mines. Do to all the killings and that which would threaten their lives and all the loved ones or friend that they had lost they became well-conditioned to be real superstitious about messing around or staying in the area. So the sacred Mines of Solomon became the number one Superstitious Mountains in the west, if not the world.

The Indians that showed a couple of Mormons some of the mines did not want other Indians or anyone else to see them with the Mormons in that area. You might want to read the writings of Aaron Daniels. Where he talks about how paranoid and superstitious the Indians were, who had blindfolded him and taken him to one of the sacred mines. There were other things about the area that added to their superstitions. There may be other places where the Indians were superstitious, which are not the first Superstitious Mountains. At some of these other places there was some red herring done.

Now let us look at what identifies the first Superstitious Mountains. It has a salt river. It has a barge canyon. It has boulder canyon with a lot of boulders in it, unlike the barge canyon. It has a bulldog shaped face just before the two canyons separate. Part way up bolder canyon there is a place where there are some deep pot holes, one over twenty feet deep. There is a ruff carved out white horse with one ear higher than the other ear. Within a certain distance there is what is left of a two roomed house under a shelving cliff. It had been completely filled with rocks and covered over. Some distance from there is a sealed shaft. Close by there are Spanish markers according to old Spanish law. On the opposite side of that place there is a rock foundation of a cabin. Just north of it there was a small furnace or shelter. South of the rock foundation there is a small rocked up corral.

Before I give too much detail. I find it ironic that the, so called Dutchman story fits much better at the right place than in the New Superstitious Mountains in central Arizona. But then so does the best Peraltas Map and so does the Molina Document map and descriptions. The Peralta Stones lead you to the place and nail it down better then people’s wild imaginations of where they are trying to make it fit today. Then you have the Spider Rock maps fitting like a hand in a glove. Then you have all the descriptions of Caleb Rhoads and his maps with a line of trees going back to his time, with his six inch high initials carved in them. Right where history says they would be. Then you have a black rock that the Molina Document describes. The exact distance from the rock as the map describes there is a shaft full of boulders with powder between them. There are many other things that fit the different stories.

I just looked at two guns and an old Spanish saddle. One of the guns goes back to the 1800’s and the other one goes back to the 1600 along with the saddle. The guns and saddle by themselves is no real evidence but other type of artifacts that I have seen, are. I would have to be insane to not believe where certain histories and mines fit.

From the beginning of time people have been smarter than some animals or birds in creating red herring to protect their values.

Greed for wealth in connection with this place will only get us in trouble. That is why the place is not known about. People are superstitious about getting in trouble. Smart people will not want to get in trouble. The faster we can build a fair and balanced government that protects everybody and all their rights the quicker we can have a fruitful closing on these discoveries. Otherwise we would just be opening up a can of worm and we would all be losers. I would like to see twenty five men that could be properly trusted. It is too big and uncovers too much. We would be giving it to corruption if we were to mess with it. Most will never know what is true and what is false on these matters, until there are enough people that can stand on the greater truth.

There are many treasures that could be found that would be much safer to look for.

R. W.

 

[markmar]

R.W.

From my investigation , the stone trail map and the Apache ( Dutchman ) mine are in the Superstitions Mountains , east from Phoenix .
The main Apache mine has a clue which says " There is an interesting footnote to this mysterious legend: the Apaches decided to hide their mine in 1882. They decided that the only way to protect their secret was to conceal it in such a manner that only the Apaches would ever be able to find it. Apache Jack was a boy of twelve when the tribe set about concealing the entrance. He reported many years later, when he was an old man, that in true Indian fashion, a band of thirty squaws and two youths labored for one full moon, throwing ore and hastily abandoned tools back into the shaft. They then covered everything with stout logs, which were in turn covered with the natural caliche cement that hardens into rock. Over all, they placed another covering of dirt and surface stones to match the surrounding area. Finally, rocks were shifted around to disguise everything. Soon afterward, Providence lent a hand. In 1887, an earthquake further rearranged the topography.Whose funnel-shaped mine did the soldiers find, if Jacob Waltz’s mine and the Apaches’ mine are one and the same mine?
Apache Jack further said that the Apache left a marker. In a steep-climbing arroyo high upon a mountainside where no white prospector would normally think of looking for gold,was a bright yellow ribbon of it in a narrow vein of rose quartz. It lay under towering cliffs, which overhung the whole arroyo, within plain sight of nearby Weaver’s Needle, and thinking no white man would ever venture there, the Apaches did not conceal this place. Below was the secret marker, an eight-foot high boulder hoisted upon the skyline of a ridge which, because it formed an abrupt bend in the north-south trending Needle Canyon, formed also for a few hundreds yards the only south slope. This boulder had been chiseled to look like a rampant horse’s head with mouth open, one ear laid back and with the other ear standing straight up. However, it was only so recognized against the sky when viewed from down canyon a short ways to the north . "
This clue is written at Dutchman's Lost Mine
Now look at this pictures from GE . The first shows the bright yellow ribbon and the second the rampant horse .



Around of these clues , not very far , is the stone heart location and the Aztec Painted Rock .
The place of the Molina document is near Tumacacori Carmen .
The stone mark ( in Molina map ) between San Ramon water and black rock



and the little monument below the black stone

 

[RWLJ]

2-19-14​

​

This is information that you need to understand if you want to find the treasures of Paradise or the treasures of Ophir.​

​

The Magic of Jericho​

​

Is Jericho the city that gives us true faith or is it the city that adds to our blind faith? Did Joshua conquer the city of Jericho? The Middle East scholars and biblical archaeologists are pretty unanimous that the city was burnt and destroyed around a hundred and fifty years before Joshua’s time. There are a few hopefuls that say that the pottery shows that it was destroyed at the time of Joshua. Are they grabbing at straws or are they for real?

Let us look at and analyze some of the pros and cons. While it would be hard for people to believe that the story of Exodus with all of its good fruits and miraculous things happens to be just a made up history and that many great people that supported it through history and down through time where fooled and duked by a few writings. On the other hand scholars that were looking for the truth found forty cities with the names that Joshua was supposed to have conquered. The problem scientist are having is that not one of them cities existed at the time of Joshua. The hopefuls think that they have pot fragments that line up with Joshua’s time frame. If so what proof or real evidence is there that it was the Jericho or the city that Joshua conquered? There have been many cities throughout the history of the world that have been burnt and had the walls brought down. When they were burnt their goods were destroyed with them. Who would go after the burned grains that were left behind and contaminated?

According to the Bible the city of Jericho was the first to fall. Has this Jericho in the Middle East fallen from credibility? Or is it the last thread of evidence of Joshua’s conquest that took place in that land? I would hate to hang my hat on the fact that that city was conquered under Joshua. Many scholars and biblical archaeologists want to be rewarded and have the glory of nailing down Joshua’s conquest. They have bumped into a blank wall and had to realize just the opposite. There was no conquest of that land during the time of Joshua’s time. Grabbing on to a few straws of similarities, as many have done, shows that they are not squaring themselves with the full facts.

The Ur of Chaldea over there did not even exist in Abraham’s day. It is unlikely that Abraham came from that Ur of Chaldea in the Middle East. The Israelites traveled for forty years in the wilderness with all their flocks and herds. The deserts in the Middle East would not have sustained a fraction of that many. Would they have been there for forty years and not left a trace of any camp site or a trace of any of their journeys, not even any of their history carved in stone. Two hundred years after Joshua you have a sea people over-running the Mediterranean world and with them were a circumcised people and Philistines. That is when you have the first Philistines being in that part of the world in history.

How could Abraham, Isaac and Jacob have dealt with the Philistines if none existed in that part of the world before the sea people? This is according to everything I have heard from any scholars? The decoration and designs of the first Philistine pots in that part of the world reflect the pots from the southwestern United States. This identifies where the sea people came from. It is more than ironic that at the time that the first Philistines showed up there you have the first small communities where a few people lived where there were no pig bones. This makes it clear who the circumcised people were that came in with the sea people in the aftermath of the Trojan War. First Troy was the central city of the first Jerusalem in the part of the world where the sea people came from.

Moses and Joshua came out of the land of the Mizraims and wandered in the wilderness for forty years before they took the original land of Canaan in Utah. In the wilderness around that area you have their written stories. You have a land that would feed them and their flocks. This land is between Colorado, Arizona, Utah and Nevada. That is where you have the original Mount Sinai. The place was still called by its name when the pioneers got there. Throughout this area you have the whole stories of Exodus recorded in stone.

In Los Lunas, New Mexico you have the Ten Commandments written on stone. You have the tokens that represented the Ten Commandments in many places in the west. You have the stories of Adam and Eve to Joshua that predate any Israelites in the Middle East. You literally have that land of Genesis in the western part of the United States and the four rivers that run out of Paradise north of the Grand Canyon in southern Utah. In the center of Paradise you have the Tree of Life that contains an ancient library and other things. When you cross examine new discoveries with old ones, there is some shocking new revelation that will destroy all the corrupted beliefs that make up all the nations of Babylon and the religious whore that supports the corrupted history.

The Israelites were taken from the original land that had the Tower of Babel by the Assyrians and later the Babylonians and carried captive to the new capital of Babylon in the Middle East for the second and third time.

Tiberius emperor of Rome exiled them there for the fourth time and said he would make the original place so insignificant that it would no longer be recognized. We have no record of anyone getting in his face on the subject that lived to tell the tale. Rome was the last ancient part of Babylon until newer powers of today.

R. W.

 

[Oroblanco]

RWLJ wrote

Is Jericho the city that gives us true faith or is it the city that adds to our blind faith? Did Joshua conquer the city of Jericho? The Middle East scholars and biblical archaeologists are pretty unanimous that the city was burnt and destroyed around a hundred and fifty years before Joshua’s time. There are a few hopefuls that say that the pottery shows that it was destroyed at the time of Joshua. Are they grabbing at straws or are they for real?

I don't wish to derail your whole topic here amigo, but recent archaeological work has turned up very strong evidence that Jericho was indeed destroyed by Joshua as recorded in the OT, and that the Exodus of the Hebrews from Egypt actually occurred about 1526 BC, and not the 1200 to 1300 BC date assigned by so many biblical scholars. This date is a key date in time, as it coincides with the eruption of Thera (Santorini) in the Aegean sea, which resulted in massive tsunamis which even reached Egypt, where it was recorded as the great god of the sea, "Yam" came "unexpectedly". Volcanic pumice stone proven to match that of Akrotiri (Thera, Santorini) has been found in Egypt. Even the Egyptian records dovetail perfectly with the Hebrew account found in the Old Testament, once we realize that the date was not 1200 but 1526 BC, for the Egyptians recorded the events as their "driving out" the people whom had been ruling Egypt, which they called "Hyk-sos" which means, translated into English, "Shepherd Kings".

There is much more we could discuss in depth on this topic, but I wished to point out that seeming contradiction about the date of the destruction of the very ancient and famous city of Jericho, destroyed "too soon" to "fit" with the long held belief about when the Exodus and conquest of Canaan occurred, due to a misconception about the book of Judges.

Actually the issue in the book of Judges arose by scholars taking the sequential Judges stories, as closely locked timetable. There are, if memory serves, two "gaps" in the book of Judges, where no known Judge was ruling over the people Israel; these two gaps could very easily account for 150 years.

As you rightfully pointed out in another thread - we ought not close our minds and our eyes to history, as if it were a closed book; when in reality, a turn of the spade tomorrow, can overturn whole centuries of long-believed record.

Good luck and good hunting to you all, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
Oroblanco

 

[badknees]

I have been a close friend to RWLJ for many years .Those who poo poo what they don't understand will soon get a rude awakening,Along with a new look at some very old history.

 

[Corporate Investigations]

Hello badnees

I have no Doubt Your a close Friend a convert. And hopefully it is still a free country and your welcome to buy into this collection of statements if you like. However in a forum one must expect with that freedom there is also the right to question such statements?

Oroblanco has clearly and politely highlighted some serious flaws in RWLJ assumptions and claims presented as undeniable fact. Do you not think it little hypocritical to be claiming those who poo poo do not understand? Or is it because they disagree with your ideological mantra?

I have no wish to comment further as clearly it would be a waste of my precious time... However I can tell you of a rude awaking too....Utah is not the center of the universe there is actually a world out side of planet America... get over it.

Amy

 

[badknees]

Amy, Clearly you have been wasting your time for a very long time trying to make things fit where they do not ..I'll let Isaiah #44- 25 say it.. The lord will frustrateth the TOKENS of the liars, and maketh the diviners MAD; that turneth WISE women OR MEN,and maketh their knowledge foolish.. Good luck to you my dear..

 

[kanabite]

Amy, Clearly you have been wasting your time for a very long time trying to make things fit where they do not ..I'll let Isaiah #44- 25 say it.. The lord will frustrateth the TOKENS of the liars, and maketh the diviners MAD; that turneth WISE women OR MEN,and maketh their knowledge foolish.. Good luck to you my dear..

seriously?
you know its not that i have issue with everything RL has said on this forum . some of his ideas may indeed hold water . however this attempt to place biblical places in the southern portion of Utah does not fit IMO. i kind of figured that it would be a waist of time to convince anyone who already has made their mind up based upon faith.although i would agree that the history of this part of the country is either incomplete or flawed in some way. there does seem to be evidence that certain realms of archeology are forbidden, perhaps because it threatens these very faith based things that seem to me, to be being preached here. now i'm not mad at all, and although it may be impossible to get everything exactlty right while investigating these mysteries of the past . i would use caution before implying anyone here has foolish knowledge .

 

[Oroblanco]

badknees wrote

I have been a close friend to RWLJ for many years .Those who poo poo what they don't understand will soon get a rude awakening,Along with a new look at some very old history.

Just for the record here badknees, but I have met RWLJ in person a couple of years ago and while we may not be close friends, we are very far from enemies. It was a pleasure to meet RWLJ and engage in historical discussion around the campfire. In fact we agree on a number of things, and disagree on others. I have not poo-poohed anything, but respectfully disagree on some things, which I posted a single example of concerning the timetable of the destruction of Jericho. I DO take a new look at old history, all the time. My apologies if anything I posted caused offense, no offense was ever intended, just a respectful disagreement on a point. As RWLJ has written in another post, "let us not throw out the baby with the bathwater".

Muchas Gracias mi amigo Corp for the very kind words, you are correct that it was an attempt to disagree and open the door to a fresh examination of the topic rather than some kind of personal "attack" as it seems to have been interpreted.

Good luck and good hunting to you all, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
Oroblanco

 

[markmar]

R.W.

You wrote : " This is information that you need to understand if you want to find the treasures of Paradise or the treasures of Ophir . The Magic of Jericho "

The last treasure which I want to find , would be the treasure of Paradise . But IMO the Paradise has not any connection with treasures and any precious stuff . Paradise is happiness and is not necesary to be in richness .
All the stories about treasure of Ophir have a relation with the Red Sea . You believe how the first Red Sea was in Utah ? Where ?
Because you found some ancient writings in Utah , you believed how there was the first place ? The Ten Commandments , written in ancient Hebrew , were found in South America too .
I respect your beliefs , but you try to turn the world up side down . To prove your statements , you need more of some ancient writings . Folks which been far from their home , carried with them their beliefs and habits . So simple .

 

[cactusjumper]

Roy,

It never ceases to amaze me how far ranging the conversations at the Dutch Hunter's Rendezvous can go. Some very knowledgeable people attend those events. You, my friend, are up there among the lead dogs.

Take care,

Joe

 

[Oroblanco]

Muchas gracias mi amigo Joe - however un-deserved I do appreciate the kind words.

To try to tie this back in to the topic,

RWLJ - if Atlantis was the islands in the now-defunct inland sea we call Lake Bonneville, then where was the Athens referred to, which was at war with the Atlantians living in lake Bonneville islands? Thank you in advance.
Roy ~ Oroblanco

 

[RWLJ]

2/21/14​

Hello cactusjumper,

In answer to your question as to what writing I can read. Judging by what I can read interpret and then find what it talks about. I believe that I can read a lot of basic symbols fairly good. There is no way that I can understand how all cultures used them basic symbols at different times. When it comes to certain threads of the father of Paleo Hebrew writing that was used from the time of Adam to the time of the Trojan War, some of it is about as clear to me as reading English. Beyond that I would probably be better than most in picture story writings in North America. When it comes to Ogham or Ogam Writing in America most authorities in that field would leave me in the dust. When it comes to cousins of the Paleo Hebrew writings in America there is a large majority of it that I still need to learn.

I find that the Aztec languages that the Aztecs used symbols like many other cultures that had a greater meaning to the priest but a simply common meaning for the less educated massed. Across the Americas many wrote in ways that you could understand the lesser meaning or the greater meaning. Like the Bible that is full of parables and much of it is written so that the lesser would understand the lesser and the greater would understand the greater.

I am sure some of the writers felt that they did not want to cast pearls before swine. Nor did they want to get themselves executed by offending the powers that be, or betray that which is sacred to Israel.

When the Aztec said they came from the rising sun they wanted to miss lead and keep the white man and others dumbed down. Sure enough those that were not educated interpreted it that they came from the east. Their objective was accomplished in the way they spoke. Likewise today those that want to grab on to all kinds of assumptions and hang onto Dark Age traditions might be better off left in the dark. These people are usually to busy protecting their ego, to seek and support the truth.

Thank you for your question.
R. W.

 

[RWLJ]

2/21/14​

Hello oroblanco,

You might want to recognize that Plato had information on Atlantis that he himself did not understand to well. The very fact that he ended his writing on Atlantis where he did, states a lot. He may have himself started to recognize the bigger picture. If he would have written anymore he may have recognized that he would have been putting his foot in his own mouth.

I would suggest that you study some of the maps in the book The Friar’s Map of Ancient America, 1369 AD, by Gunnar Thompson.

Even National Geographic published a map showing different maps of what they thought was the Mediterranean. The last map that they showed, of what they thought was the Mediterranean was the newest of all the maps. It did not fit the Mediterranean as much as the other maps. It showed Jerusalem in the center of it. The book The Friar’s Map shows similar maps. If this was a map of what we call the Mediterranean today and what is called Jerusalem today, it would indicate that map drawers were inferior to their predecessors and that they became less informed or lost the ability to draw what we call the Mediterranean today. That map fits Solomon’s Jerusalem where the first Jericho still exists. The Friar’s Map also shows older maps of first Asia, Africa and Europe. Not the copycat places that are known about today.

When Plato was talking about Atlantis being bigger than Asia and Africa combined, what Asia and what Africa was he talking about? Did he know much more about what he was talking about then the people that think that they have the walls or ruins of Solomon’s Temple in the Middle East? Recently they have dug up coins under that wall and other things that show that the wall did not exist in the days of Christ. The coins were made to represented Caesars or Emperors of a later date. Christ said there would not be one stone left upon another. Scholars and archaeologists have looked for it for year and have yet to find a trace of Solomon’s Temple. If they did it would have had to be carried from here to over there.

You may fool or influence those that want to remain in the dark ages but you have no walls or ruins over there that tie in with Solomon’s Temple. You might have other things that he built when he was over there during his three years of travel.

I have seen many things that will bring about the rewriting of history. I know what I have seen to be real. Homer’s writings are real clear. It matches the Aztecs and the other histories and what I have personally seen for years at the site. He writes that Troy was on the lower part of Mount Olympus and that all of its foundations were dug up.

Just because someone was not smart enough and they thought that they had found Troy with its foundations in tacked in Turkey, does not mean it is there. They are trying to make what Alexander called new Troy a rebuilt first Troy. This is not according to the facts of history. It is very unlikely that someone rebuilt a city and call in New Troy. It would be about as foolish as to look for Old York under New York. It also contradicts Homer and the Dead Sea Scrolls.

It took Odysseus ten years to get back home. Their war was not fought across the channel between the Black Sea and the Mediterranean Sea.

You made a big deal in the past that Atlantis was not a continent. How much do you know that Plato knew? He may have been as mistaken in his interpretations about Atlantis, as you are about your interpretations of the whereabouts of the land of Joshua’s conquest. I can speak boldly with authority because I have seen many things that are for real that the world does not know about.

When can you show me the Troy on Mount Olympus? If you cannot show me first Troy on the first Mount Olympus, then you should be open minded so someone can show you the land of first Mount Olympus and first Troy. On second Troy you would not be able to show me any of the original gods and what they originally were.

I could ask you hundreds of questions that you would not be able to answer in your own right. I have seen many people that can grab onto wild assumptions that hold water like a sieve.

The continent of Atlantis is bigger than Asia and Africa combined and that goes for both new Asia and Africa and old Asia and Africa. Asia means a she ass and Africa means the shadow of God. The continent of Atlantis is not to be confused with the island of Atlantis. The continent of Atlantis is America. The island of Atlantis is in the middle sea of the Ta land (Utah) the first Mediterranean, also known as the Atlantean sea or the sea of the right hand of God. It is called Lake Bonneville today. Maybe Plato was not able to give you history straighter because he did not known any better, like people today do not know much about real history. We have never fully come out of the Dark Ages of the uninformed leading the uninformed.

White men did not understand the greater meaning when the Aztecs said that they came from the land of the rising sun. The white men interpreted it to mean east. His interpretation of that to mean east, is a confession of his own ignorance.

Christ spoke in parables so the lesser would understand the lesser. The Aztecs would not have been excited about the Spanish understanding the original meanings, for obvious reasons.

John D. Lee, the so called Jacob Waltz who had worked and learned about Indian ways, pointed out and gave the people a true reflection of a place and many things that reflected the real place. He left a real parable in a manner that reflected some Indian ways. People colonized what we call the old world today. To these ancient colonizers the old world of today was their new world. They named things there after their Motherland and gave names to places that reflected the original places that they came from in one way or another.

The wise ones that did not want to betray the library and treasures in the Motherland or Underworld would not have identified what was new and what was old. They would have stayed away from casting pearls before swine.


Oroblanco wrote

Jesus said, “Recognize what is in your sight, and that which is hidden from you will become plain to you. For there is nothing hidden which will not become manifest.” (Thomas gospel, 5)

That is a very good quote. I could show you many things that are within our sight today. I have posted some. There are many things within our sight that we could look at that leads to far greater things that are plain and self-evident. These things are for the honest and pure in heart that can come out of Babylon and its churches that have prostituted themselves. Too many are grabbing onto any wild assumption that comes along to support the false base they got from Babylon.

You make some wild assumptions about the Pharaoh at the time that Moses left the land of the Mizraims being Amosis. Neither Moses or the Israelites as a nation where ever in Egypt, over there at that time. Nor is it mentioned in the Old Testament of the Israelites ever seeing the great structures that are in Egypt. Moses led the children out of the land of Mizraim. Mizraim is in the western United States.

I am not going to touch on every little straw that you are holding onto to support your Babylonian premise. I can personally show you the travels of the Israelites and where their exodus came to a stop. There is much of their hand writing still there on the rocks.

You mention Biblical Archaeology Review. You need to read July/August 1996 vol. 22 #4 starting with page thirty. It makes it really clear that Joshua’s conquest did not take place in the Middle East. On page thirty six it shows a picture of a Merneptah Stele. Pharaoh Merneptah stated that Israel was laid waste. The Egyptians thought it was good that Israel had been laid waste by the Greeks. They may have even allied with the Greeks in bringing down Troy, the Israelite capital at the time. They were likely not to happy when the Israelites conquered their Motherland, the land of the Mizraims. There are many things in Biblical Archeology Review that discredits the conquest of Joshua having ever happened in the Middle East.

I would also suggest that you read The Bible Unearthed, by Israel Finkelstein and Neil Asher Silberman.

I do not know of one biblical archaeologist scholars, people of true scientist that supports a Joshua conquest in the Middle East.

In reply to my Jericho post, you talk about some volcano by the name of Thera, Santorini erupting. I examined this story some time ago and recognized that they have come up with a little reality about volcanic activity during the time of Moses. Beyond that I could not give it much creditability it was based on assumptions upon assumptions. True Mount Sinai was a volcano that created a cloud by day and a fire by night. Moses set up boundaries lest the fire break out and kill them. He kept the people away from it until it blew its trumpet really hard. When you get into the real land of Joshua you find that real biblical history fits really well.

You try to identify the Hyk-sos that over ran Egypt as if they were the true Israelites. I have heard this story before and it does not carry any legitimate weight. First place there were seventy Israelites that went down into the land of Mizraim not Egypt. Egypt is an alteration of the Old Testament text. The Ten Commandments in stone in Los Lunas, New Mexico says they were lead out of the land of Mizraim. While Joseph ruled under a Pharaoh the Israelites never dominated the Motherland of Mizraim. However it is highly likely that when the Mizraim army went down in the red sea or the sea of Eden here in Utah that it opened the doors for the Hyk-sos to take that land when the Mizraim army fell in this land.

Oroblanco, I am sorry but I have one advantage over you. I have history that did not come through the nations that made up the image of Babylon. It is untainted by Babylon. We have carved writing that is dated to be five thousand years old. I have seen Exodus stories, one that was black with desert varnish that is older than anything that ties with Hebrew writing in the Middle East. That story is written right where the Exodus story came to an end under Joshua.

How are you going to look and what are you going to say when you have to confront the records in the library that is in the area of the Tree of Life? Even Adam in his day was not allowed to partake of in his day.

On the Molina Map it marks that place of the Temple and say ancient library in Spanish. They are looking for that place in the Grand Canyon. Those that want to believe in what came through Babylon can keep on looking there. Those that want to believe it is in the Superstitious Mountains should keep on looking there. That goes for the Tucson area or West Texas or those that are looking for Solomon’s Mines which were once called the Tayopa Mines in northern Mexico. Likewise they should keep on looking where they think they are at. They have a right to waste their own money and time.

You once tried to correct me when I referred to a place that was called the heart. You corrected me and said it meant white. I told you that I already knew that that was its first meaning. There have already been two men that have posted on this site that I told the first meaning of its name before I ever met you.

There are many people that are a witness to a bigger story of things, then what I have shown on this site. If anyone is really seeking truth then they should search all new things and not make assumption based on Babylonian confusion.

I will not always have time to speedily answer every question out there. People should recognize it is not always wise to judge new things by their old paradigm. In general people are in a channel or chain of believes that appear more logical to them. There are just a few that have the strength to reexamine and give up all their established premises. If we are going to win, we have to examine all of our foundations or premises that we have built on with the new evidence of things and let the cream or the truth rise to the top.

I have noticed in many debates that the ones that have the weaker platform start throwing in any kind of flak to avoid the truth. They also throw flak because they did not want to hear the other side or they do it to throw their opposition off by overwhelming him with a lot of flak.

Even when we have facts on our side it is comforting to see testimonies that support our premise. We need to not feel bad when we lose. The truth is more important than any one person or their ego. I would rather lose and gain the truth then win with falsehoods and destroy my future. So one again look at the greater knowledge of new discoveries, they can prevent us from being wrong or making fools of ourselves. Fools rush in where wise men fear to tread.

I myself at least in times past was more interested in being a live coward then a dead hero. This is my way of showing a smile face.

I invite you all to look before you jump out on a limb. The new discoveries will bring about a marvelous work and a wonder, as it says in Isiah 29. In part the fulfillment of where you quote Jesus.

Let us all take our time and build on a sure foundation. Let us be slow to judge all things without first looking at all things.

Why would people rush to judgments when they know little or nothing about new great discoveries? Only a poor or corrupt judge would judge a situation without looking at both sides of the story. We have a lot more history and facts here then they have in the Middle East and it is much older. The challenge is to investigate. Again condemnation without investigation is ignorance on the war path.

R. W.