Platinum Treasure!!! One Troy Once!!! Unique!!!

UnderMiner

Silver Member
Jul 27, 2014
3,818
9,726
New York City
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2
Detector(s) used
Minelab Excalibur II, Ace 250
Primary Interest:
All Treasure Hunting
Final Edit 1/30/2015 : The test results are in: http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/general-discussion/448872-platinum-fork-test-results.html

I found this fork a few days ago along with some other less expensive treasures (mostly various grades of silver). Completed my research today and have come to the stunning conclusion that this is in fact... a 95% pure Platinum fork - solid Platinum with a gold plating - made by Cartier. This very well may be one of the most expensive pieces of cutlery in existence. Considering it weights 30.9 grams (1/5th of a gram shy of 1 Troy Ounce) I think it may very well be the single largest piece of platinum ever posted to this website. It's certainly the biggest piece of platinum I've ever found! I'm still shaking from the rush!! :headbang:

DSC08636.JPGDSC08638.JPG

Here's the story. Over the past week I've been pounding that old site by the shore again and again but this time using the new ExCal-II. It was a bit of a learning curve as I'd only used my new ExCal-II once before this. What a difference. The sandy/salty soil was no problem for the ExCal-II and the deep signals were coming in loud and clear. Ended up finding a ton more artifacts (silver, copper, iron, more globs of lead) - all much deeper finds than my other detector was able to handle. No more 18th century pepper pots unfortunately (I was hoping for a trifecta). I did however find, among other things, a sterling silver mechanical pencil (Victorian-age from the looks of it), an 80% silver olive fork, three hand-carved sterling spoons, a pewter dish, some broken pieces of porcelain, glass, and even what looks like to be a piece of an old shoe. I will post all these finds and more later in one massive post once I'm sure I've unearthed everything.

Anyway, this post is about the crowning jewel of the finds so far - the Platinum fork. I dug it up shortly after finding the sterling mechanical pencil. When I first saw the platinum fork it was all black just like all the silver in that area. I rubbed the dirt off (I know, I'm still kicking myself for doing such a stupid thing) and it revealed a golden luster - I assumed it to be a gold plated fork of either silver or some other cheaper metal. Into the bag it went and the hunt continued. At the end of each day I would clean and photograph my finds. I noticed the "950" hallmark during this time a few days ago.

The "950" is stamped in an "upside-down shield". I first saw this mark when I examined the fork the day I found it. I assumed it to be a sterling mark for 95% silver. I checked online a few times but really I had pretty much concluded it just had to be a type of silver. Today I did some in depth research and discovered that there is absolutely no sterling mark that resembles this hallmark. I did further research of other precious metal hallmarks besides silver and was stunned - the mark was listed as one of 4 types of platinum hallmarks. According to my research this platinum hallmark represents the second highest purity of platinum - 95%!! There is a crown above the "950", a little symbol that looks like an "R" directly above the "950", and a little "M" to the right of the "950". On the right side of the fork it says "Made in France" and on the left side it says "Cartier". There is also what appears to be some kind of etched serial number, possibly "1040". The piece weights 30.9 grams - almost exactly one troy ounce making it worth just about $1,200 in melt value.

The unknown: How old is this piece? I've had trouble dating this piece as hallmark charts by Cartier don't appear online in detail.

One thing is for certain Cartier is not known for cranking out platinum cutlery. I have a feeling this may have been a custom made piece. If so it may be unimaginably rare and expensive. My feeling is that it is worth way over its melt value of $1.2K - perhaps its worth $5k+ who knows? I will have to get it professionally appraised. Until then the hunt continues!!! :D Arg! Now with all this new swag I feel like a true pirate! :skullflag: :blackbeard: :laughing7:

Edit: Okay, it's officially confirmed. What I initially thought was an "R" stamp is in fact a "PT" stamp, "PT" means Platinum! "PT 950 M" is a high-strength Platinum alloy. The M stands for the 5% other metal added with the Platinum most likely Ruthenium! I'm on cloud 9 right now! :D

Platinum stamp along with hallmark chart:
Fork Hallmark.jpgappendix2_1.jpg

Cartier markings along the sides:
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Fork on my scale, note 30.9 gram weight:
DSC08647.JPG
 

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Upvote 53
I think the issue here is a lack of photos of the uncleaned relics. If I found a spot with multiple silver relics and other treasure, I would definitely record it for posterity. I would take before and after photos (and videos) of everything I found, especially if I was thinking about posting it here. Just my take on it.

Underminer, you seem fairly certain that you will find more stuff at this site. We would all appreciate some pictures of future finds from this site in situ.

Of course you are under no obligation to do this but I know I would be very excited to see pictures from ground zero as you dig these amazing finds.
 

I've seen fake large cents and colonial coppers posted here. If someone was inclined to fake a PENNY back in the day, why not a Cartier fork?

Actually you are correct...
I too have seen some unreal fakes...
I actually collect certain fake coins...
BUT ... this a fork... not a coin...
The people that can afford this piece they never just buy "a" fork... they are bought in a set of many...
The expense of producing an entire set of fake forks would far outweigh the "profit" seen and possibly risk loss in doing so.
It was stated that it was extremely heavy etc...
Which tends to bend the scale to non forgery.
No one would use platinum in any amount on a fake fork.
They may plate it with plat... but then weight would not be noticeably heavier.
To fake in that metal would always be bottom valued at only a scrap weight to the end buyer if "con" was not achieved...
Just to produce a fake Cartier mark that would pass... would require immense time and expense.
 

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I think the issue here is a lack of photos of the uncleaned relics. If I found a spot with multiple silver relics and other treasure, I would definitely record it for posterity. I would take before and after photos (and videos) of everything I found, especially if I was thinking about posting it here. Just my take on it.

"I would take before and after photos (and videos) of everything I found, especially if I was thinking about posting it here."

This is not our rules nor our policy here...... Just my take on it......


Posted From My $50 Tablet....
 

Underminer, you seem fairly certain that you will find more stuff at this site. We would all appreciate some pictures of future finds from this site in situ.

Of course you are under no obligation to do this but I know I would be very excited to see pictures from ground zero as you dig these amazing finds.

I'm certain I will find more treasures in that site, I am certain. And when I do I will share the finds with you all. Forgive my novice nature at this, up until recently I've really not taken treasure hunting too seriously.
 

Nice find Underminer, I have no doubt that Cartier would make a Platinum Fork like that, after all they make Pens and sun Glasses out of Platinum. I detected a Tiffany Olive Fork a few years ago and was excited, although it is not as cool as yours. Here is a picture, the Tiffany is on the bottom, there is a etched baby spoon only marked sterling in the middle which has been a mystery to me. http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=356155&d=1332361315
 

One way to avoid all of this in the future is to take in situ pics or at minimum dirty pics of the finds. It's pretty obvious if somebody tries to fake dirty pics. This just helps to eliminate any and all questions. As I said earlier I also really enjoy seeing the pre and post cleaned pics. I'm amazed sometimes at how well a nasty old item can shine up.

Yes, I will do that from now on. But even when I posted the before and after cleaning of my silver quarter and locket from that same site people were still arguing over it for some reason. I don't know why.
 

...seeing all your stuff together like that made me start to thinking. I have a nice chest of silver that is in the attic somewhere FULL of miss-matched pieces, all sterling, some from very early, hallmarked and individual, some later and very identifiable as to maker, age and style. My point is, I keep them all together, don't really know the history of them, been in the family a long time (and most likely added to by others over time)...have value...and I don't care about them at all and if the house got sold and the barn was torn down and no one really cared or even knew about this chest...it could easily end up in the ground and get scattered over time.
 

Nice find Underminer, I have no doubt that Cartier would make a Platinum Fork like that, after all they make Pens and sun Glasses out of Platinum. I detected a Tiffany Olive Fork a few years ago and was excited, although it is not as cool as yours. Here is a picture, the Tiffany is on the bottom, there is a etched baby spoon only marked sterling in the middle which has been a mystery to me. http://www.treasurenet.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=356155&d=1332361315

That Tiffany is very beautiful! If you ever serve olives you should use that! As for the baby spoon its as big a mystery as any other un-hallmarked piece. But we have remember back 100 years ago it wasn't uncommon for everyday people to own solid silver cutlery. Perhaps this was the "cheap" brand of silver and the maker just didn't care about putting his name on it.
 

Nope... Not this one...
These are my first "holds" ...
Mel draped the "money chain" over me and handed me the bars... and said...
"So when you gonna come work for me "?
I replied "how about right now" lol... anyway...
These items are "fresh from the ocean"
Was private celebration at Mel Fishers shop
They are from The Santa Margarita.
I was not old enough to work for him yet.
 

...seeing all your stuff together like that made me start to thinking. I have a nice chest of silver that is in the attic somewhere FULL of miss-matched pieces, all sterling, some from very early, hallmarked and individual, some later and very identifiable as to maker, age and style. My point is, I keep them all together, don't really know the history of them, been in the family a long time (and most likely added to by others over time)...have value...and I don't care about them at all and if the house got sold and the barn was torn down and no one really cared or even knew about this chest...it could easily end up in the ground and get scattered over time.

The three main theories so far in order of popularity are: An interrupted high-society picnic, a burnt down something - house, barn, shed (there is evidence of fire), or simply someone stole all this stuff long ago and hid it. We may never know. But maybe when/if I find out who this fork belonged to we may discover the truth.
 

The issue here is members are violating our rules!

masterjedi do not attack a member like this again.

Posted From My $50 Tablet....

I apologize for breaking the rules.... I did not know of this rule (my fault)... I was just using my 20+ years of experience... It will be nice when he verifies this with Cartier and lets us know the outcome... I hope him the best :) Good for him!
I have seen many other posts here that question the authenticity of an item, and did not see the problem with questioning this one? Why is this different than all of the others on this site? ...
I am truly sorry...
Gary from Oregon...
 

I hope you find the rest of that Cartier platinum set, congrats on your epic hunts and you bet theres more, keep swinging and posting!
 

Nope... Not this one...
These are my first "holds" ...
Mel draped the "money chain" over me and handed me the bars... and said...
"So when you gonna come work for me "?
I replied "how about right now" lol... anyway...
These items are "fresh from the ocean"
Was private celebration at Mel Fishers shop
They are from The Santa Margarita.
I was not old enough to work for him yet.

Wow... just to meet the MAN himself is amazing. When I first heard about Mel Fisher I wanted to join his crew also. But then I found out I was 20 years too late.
What I wouldn't give to be detecting the waters off the Florida coast. Even the most remote chance of finding a single piece of Spanish treasure is enough for me.
Maybe one day I'll stop by for a visit. Honestly it's the history I'm more interested in, the treasure itself is amazing, but if you think about it it's value is only half its "amazingness" the other half is the history the treasure reveals - like a doorway to another time. Perhaps the closest thing we get to time travel is holding a piece of history like a timeless never changing gold bar or coin. With that said I'd be content with just holding a ballast stone from the Santa Margarita or the Atocha, it must have been amazing to hold the actual gold plundered by those early Spanish conquistadors! For god, gold and glory! :D
 

I apologize for breaking the rules.... I did not know of this rule (my fault)... I was just using my 20+ years of experience... It will be nice when he verifies this with Cartier and lets us know the outcome... I hope him the best :) Good for him!
I have seen many other posts here that question the authenticity of an item, and did not see the problem with questioning this one? Why is this different than all of the others on this site? ...
I am truly sorry...
Gary from Oregon...

allot depends on if the member says they are unsure,
and the rest is if the member seems defensive.
in that case if they get defensive, apologize and back off is the best strategy :thumbsup:
 

First of all, Cartier tableware is a great find, no matter what it's made of.

Just to help you with the content determination, Underminer, check out the link for this sold ebay listing. Unfortunately,the pics are down, but the text is revealing. Here is the description, if you don't like to click links:

UP FOR AUCTION
VINTAGE
CARTIER
STERLING SILVER
950
GRAPEFRUIT SPOON
MARKED IN THE BOWL 950
MARKED ON THE SIDES OF THE HANDLE
MADE IN FRANCE
CARTIER
SPOON IS APPROX. 5.5"
TOTAL WEIGHT
32.6 GRAMS
1.1 TROY OUNCES


To me, it sounds very similar to your fork, in the assay number (950), size of the utensil, the weight, the hallmarks and the placement of the hallmarks.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-CAR...D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557


If the fork is 950 silver, that would tend to reinforce the authenticity of your find, imho, as we know Cartier made 950 silverware, it's common enough to show up on ebay, and it makes perfect sense for it to be dug up in your locale. That would also account for the black tarnish, which looks to me just like silver tarnish.

A gold-pated platinum Cartier fork would be incredibly rare, even unheard of, and that is in itself a very good reason to be a little bit conservative on the question, until the metal content is confirmed by testing, or by Cartier.

I think we've all been there, thinking something is a much more wonderful item than maybe it turns out to be. I just did that myself with a small Persian rug. I thought it was a silk Heredi. I found out from two salesmen at 2 different oriental rug stores, that it's machine made, and man-made fiber. And the evidence that it was machine made is so obvious, a child should have noted it. I blush to think about it.

If it is platinum, then hallelujah, I would agree, perhaps the rarest, if not also the most valuable find to appear on this forum.





 

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