Next Assault on 2nd Amendment: Mandatory Liability Insurance

[Treasure_Hunter]

And this is all part of the great AMERICAN political process that our founding fathers created in their infinite god given wisdom. No extremism, armed uprising, FEMA camps, etc, etc. needed. No fear needed.

Anyone who believes those in power want try to continue to attack our rights behind closed doors slipping riders and short paragraphs in 5000 page bills attacking our rights and freedoms when no one is looking is either, blind or a fool...


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[0121stockpicker]

Anyone who believes those in power want try to continue to attack our rights behind closed doors slipping riders and short paragraphs in 5000 page bills attacking our rights and freedoms when no one is looking is either, blind or a fool...

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I would say that it is someone who is familiar with our political system and the ways that it has successfully operated for over 200 years - not someone who is blind or a fool. This is why we have a house, a senate, an executive branch, a judicial branch, etc, etc, etc. do you not understand how our system works?

I often find the ones that are quickest to call others blind or fools ... Making these kinds of statements does not strengthen ones point - correct?

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

I would say that it is someone who is familiar with our political system and the ways that it has successfully operated for over 200 years - not someone who is blind or a fool. This is why we have a house, a senate, an executive branch, a judicial branch, etc, etc, etc. do you not understand how our system works?

I often find the ones that are quickest to call others blind or fools ... Making these kinds of statements does not strengthen ones point - correct?

I am well aware of all our branches of government, unfortunately our current white house illegal resident doesn't , and is constantly trying to bypass the other branches.

Perfect example is his refusal to allow the deportation of illegal aliens under current law using his "dream act" he violated US law , ignored constitution and went around congressman by doing so.

It is his job to administer the law, not pick and choose which ones to ignore.

If obama can ignore the law so can the people...

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[DigginThePast]

Good well thought out post digging.

1 Would folks consider the licensing etc for fully auto weapons to be similar to your point number one. Basically driving up the cost of fully autos so much you basically greatly restrict ownership. Frankly probably doing it in a way that has been far more successful than any outright "ban" could have been.

2 insurance for willful acts or insurance for accidents? Would courts uphold this just as they uphold states rights to require liability insurance got cars? Frankly I would think gun owners would carry an umbrella policy rider anyways to cover themselves?

Just a thought.

Here are some of my “Cliff Notes” that I gave when in meetings with my State Legislative Body.
For the most part they were very ignorant of firearms history, form and function as well as current regulations.



1) I'd like to see a repeal of '34 NFA but it's not likely to happen; I think we saw a preview to that when Justice Scalia in summary of D.C. v. Heller made the now famous “dangerous and unusual” statement. '34 NFA was likely to be held Constitutional during the time as there was substantive evidence to find the proposed law to not be viewed as being arbitrary. That being said there is no correlation between '34 NFA being enacted and the proposed AWB's nor does it set precedent. The current proposed AWB's (State or Federal) are simply not based on substantive evidence but purely on emotionally driven opinion. The FBI UCR (which by the way shows a continual annual decrease in incidents) tells us that there are somewhat less than 400 deaths annually due to rifles; this is to include all deaths and all types of rifles including hunting related accidental deaths with hunting rifles.


Less than 400 rifle deaths does not warrant enacting an AWB. To this point my Legislators suggested the Assault Weapon list could be expanded to such a point so as to include all semi-automatic firearms including handguns. While they may try to do this it simply is unconstitutional to do so. Semi-autos are highly prevalent in society and have been for over one-hundred years. Further, these are the firearms that most turn to for self-defense (especially woman in my experience as they like the manual safety of an auto which is not available on a revolver). At the very least reclassifying semi-autos and highly regulating them such as NFA items places undue burden on law abiding citizens and due to overwhelming ownership and use of semi-autos is nearly a de facto repeal of the Second Amendment. D.C. v. Heller upholding the Individual Right to self defense and the prevalence of semi-autos should draw the line in the sand in so far as this reclassification.



2) “insurance for willful acts or insurance for accidents?” Liability insurance would already cover one in the case of an accident however the proposal mandates insurance just for owning a firearm. Without further tweaking of the proposal it must be assumed that it is supposed to cover anytime a bullet exits the muzzle and being that this could be a willful act, perhaps even a legitimate case of self-defense, it is asking the insurance companies to cover willful acts. Not likely to happen. Further, the firearms versus automotive argument is disingenuous at best. One is a Right and one is a privilege and no one should be forced to pay any fees to exercise their Right. That being said I maintain a 2M umbrella over my max liability policy as I feel it prudent to do so however not everyone is able to do the same nor should they be mandated to do so in order to exercise their Right.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

For the most part they were very ignorant of firearms history, form and function as well as current regulations.

That is major part of the problem, you have people who know nothing at all about firearms trying to write laws governing them, and willing to violate the constitution in the process...You have uneducated voters doing the same thing.....

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[Native Floridian]

I look at this Bill the same way as i look at motorcycle helmet laws. Ask any motorcyclist and they will tell you it's their body and their right to ride without a helmet. Except when that biker falls off his bike hits his head and runs up a million dollar hospital tab that he can't pay. That is my problem! Because i am among those picking up that tab.

It's called writing a check you can't cash. And the pro gun lobby is in the same position. Guns hurt and kill people every day. Not illegal guns, legal guns. Who picks up that tab? I do! The same way I pick up the motorcyclist's tab. So, I agree that gun owners should have to carry insurance that covers their weapons.

That said, the Bill has little chance of getting anywhere. When compared to the requirement of liability insurance for car owners, driving is an entitlement, not a right. Gun ownership is a right, not an entitlement. The bill would create ownership classes. Those who can afford the cost and those who can't. So, i think this propsoal is DOA.

 

[Native Floridian]

Anyone who believes those in power want try to continue to attack our rights behind closed doors slipping riders and short paragraphs in 5000 page bills attacking our rights and freedoms when no one is looking is either, blind or a fool...


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This is nothing new. This has been going on since the beginning of our country.

Government uses events that stoke emotions or create fear to create new policy or consolidate power. This always involves relinquishing rights.

We are seeing this now with the gun control push. And, no pun intended, you are up in arms over it! Don't take my rights way!

Yet the gun control push, is small pototoes compared to the rights our government took away from us in the advent of 911. That policy change was Called Real ID. it is the most invasive legislation written since the constitution was created. And, it is law. Where were you ( the right)then, while the government was stealing your American Freedom from you? Trading it for protection against the bogie men who might do you harm?

The extreme right laid down like sheep to be shorn on Real ID. They led the battle cry for it's passage into law. Please MR. Big Government, protect me and my family. Here are my rights as an american citizen. You can have them.

I don't think the right's arguement on the 2nd amendment has anything to do with rights. After-all, considering their position on Real ID, why would they care? The 2nd amendment fight is really about don't take my guns away. The pro gun lobby cloaks themselves with the 2nd amendment. They say their fight is about Freedom and protection. But i'm with Thomas Jefferson on this - He said "Those who would trade Freedom for protection deserve neither Freedom or protection." Clearly on Real ID the right, which includes most of the pro gun lobby, traded freedom for protection.

So maybe change the battle cry - take away my freedom, but let me keep my guns. That's much closer to the truth.

And, the amazing thing to me is, that the right is now screaming about the government taking thier guns. Well, you let them take your freedom, what did you expect?

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

We did not let them, they just took them. Patriot act is the biggest attack on our Constitution ever. I don't care if it was passed or supported by Rep or Dem it is an attack on multiple amendments of our BOR... Once a right is surrendered you will rarely if ever get it back with out bloodshed which is why the 2nd is so important...

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[Native Floridian]

Do you have any of those rewards cards that retailers hand out? You know, like a CVS card or a Barnes and Noble Member card? Did you know that many of those cards contain a RFID chip? That's a chip that allows the retailer to track you once in their store and at other areas in your neighborhood. I'll bet, if you have one, you didn't sign up to be tracked! It's all data collection so the retailer can target market to you. Spend a lot of time in the non fiction section at the local B&N and low and behold all of a sudden you start getting emails about non fiction best sellers from B&N. Wow, how did they know? Pretty neat huh? Not really!!!

Then Real Id comes down the pike. it looks like an innocent ID verification program designed to protect us from 911 type attacks. Basically, it is a prove who you are program. OK, seems innocent enough, so much so, the right really pushed for it's passage. And, it is passed. over the objections of those, in the know, who saw it for it for what it was - a government cataloguing and tracking system. The modern day equivilent to the Gestopo's "Paper Pleze!" Instead of something to enhance our freedom, something that will ultimately be used to limit it or take it away completely. And all driven by fear.

The fact is, once fully implemented, and that's only a matter of time, you won't be able to travel anywhere in this country without it. There is a list as long as my arm where you will not be allowed to go. And, that list will only grow. After all you should be able to do something as innocent as walk into a public library without having to show ID, right? Not once this law is fully implemented.

The program is run by HMS and implemented through your state's DMV via your driver's license. The tracking portion of the program took a bit of a hit on the way through congress who voted no to RFID chips and opted for bar codes. But, the RFID chip is in the on deck circle. And, when it comes, the government will be able to track your every move. Just as simple as they can track traffic using EAsy pass type systems. They will tell you where you can and can't go.

And, for this huge give up in rights, in actual freedom, the very same people who are screaming today over guns, layed down and said do me!!! So, excuse me for not quite buying into the pro gun folks "This is about our rights arguement" The gun control debate isn't about rights, it isn't about the second amendment. it is about guns. The rights arguement left the station with Real ID in 2005.

You want to fight about your rights? Fight Real ID!

 

[XLTer]

In a nutshell what we have in Govt. is a Do as I Say , Not as I Do , mentality . (IF ) we citizens could some how make Govt . take the same medicine they try to feed us on a daily basis , many of the BS Bills would never pass . I'm talking health care , pay raises , pentions , fringe benifits , retirement packages ( Social Security that politicians DO NOT pay into ? ) and best of all infringement on our Rights to protecting ourselves and our privacy . The one item that really chaps my behind is the BLATANT perjury ( Oath to Office ) that happens all the time with elected officials ! Can you imagine how our court system would work if once you took your Oath on the stand in court , you would then lie and spew all kinds of fabrications as a witness ? This one violation commited daily by most politicians , if corrected , would fix many of the problems our country faces today . Lets take a VOTE . How many of you would like to work at your profession for 10 - 20 years and retire with FULL healthcare & pension ? Depending on you prior position , you may also retain a security detail to protect you and your family through said retirement . Oh , and lets not forget about all of those BIG corporations that you passed LAWS to maximise thier profits ( Banks , Oil Co. ) , they'll be sending you gifts for quite some time !

It goes on and on ..... OK , I'm done with my rant for the day . Thanks ......

 

[bevo]

There seems so few who care beyond their own personal lives. We live in an age of selfishness, pushing forward with blind emotion
brought to a fury of tears and cheers as exemplified at many of obamy's speeches.
Pure emotion inspired by fear and hatred cultivated from childhood, twisting truth into a distorted slobbering mess.
Though history is surely repeating before our very eye's we are told that these atrocious laws are for our own good. Our national
ego refuses to admit that what happened in the past can happen to us.
To drive it home for me, Im listening to a montage of chris mathews quotes on Sean Hannity. Talk about a blustering liberal racist, filling his listeners with lies lies lies. Fanning the flames of hatred with putrid a spew flowing from his mouth.

I listen to many right wing radio guys, and there is no comparison, they do not preach hatred or malcontent for one another
whatsoever. They talk about less taxes and more freedom. What the left claims about them is pure and simple bs.

WE need to stand for truth, not emotion. We need to fight all attacks on every right we possess before we have no rights to defend.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Because we believe in the constitution and the BOR, because we believe in our freedoms and the right to enjoy them, because we believe in less government and less government intrusion in our lives and businesses, because we believe in less taxes and a free economy to help spur growth, because we do not believe in subsiding the lazy or building entire generations of people who believe they are entitled to be supported by the government, because we are tired and fed up because of all of these we are called radical right wing.

We are called racist because we do not trust nor do we support the social policies, give a ways, foreign policy or any of the lies from the current resident in the white house..

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[bevo]

yes, when in fact it is the left who encourages racist hatred. But that is pc racism.

 

[Native Floridian]

I listen to many right wing radio guys, and there is no comparison, they do not preach hatred or malcontent for one another
whatsoever.

WE need to stand for truth, not emotion.

The scary part is you are dead serious when you say this.

Here is some behind the curtain magic revealed regarding your right wing guys who "tell it like it is" and 'never preach hatred or malcontent toward one another"

My across the street neighbor is an on air commentator for FOX News. Not the local Fox affiliate, the nationally broadcast Fox News. Here's the scoop. Hours are spent on how to present the news to you their viewer. Facts are sliced. diced and ignored. The story is twisted into an anti left POV. Anything Obama is twisted to make the Prez look bad. IOW, it's complete BS. Not just the talk shows, but the actual news. My neighbor, who has the unique job within Fox of presenting on air legal counter points says it is quite sickening to watch professional journalist throw their ethics on the floor and pee all over them. It's called pandering to their base for ratings. In the end it its about money, not truth.

So, your right wing guys may never preach hatred, but what they do is lie. Hours are spent preparing and crafting the lie and presenting to you in a believable way. Obviously, it works!

All news is slanted one way or another. That anyone thinks they are getting truth just floors me.

 

[bevo]

I'm not saying it's not slanted. But I ask you to compare what Rush or Hannity are saying, in comparison to mathews or the short haired lady (cant remember her name) or piers. And I dare you to find racism, and declare from where it comes.

Really sit down and listen.

 

[Chadeaux]

I look at this Bill the same way as i look at motorcycle helmet laws. Ask any motorcyclist and they will tell you it's their body and their right to ride without a helmet. Except when that biker falls off his bike hits his head and runs up a million dollar hospital tab that he can't pay. That is my problem! Because i am among those picking up that tab.

It's called writing a check you can't cash. And the pro gun lobby is in the same position. Guns hurt and kill people every day. Not illegal guns, legal guns. Who picks up that tab? I do! The same way I pick up the motorcyclist's tab. So, I agree that gun owners should have to carry insurance that covers their weapons.

Once again, this is comparing apples to hockey sticks. No semblance of similarity.

Riding a motorcycle IS NOT A RIGHT, IT IS A PRIVILEGE (kinda like spandex, but I digress).

Owning a firearm IS A RIGHT, not a privilege. There is no comparison.

Accidents would be covered under insurance, but something like Columbine or Sandy Hood would not. If an insurance company cannot measure their risk, they will not insure against it. Willful action is not something that they will cover.

 

[Native Floridian]

Bevo, i'm not trying to insult you or challange you. it is all crap! There is nothing to listen to. it is entertainment meant to drive ratings thus increasing bottom line revenues to FOX or whoever is presenting what you are listening to. It is nothing more. Everyone has a roll. Everyone has a job. Matthews is there to incite you. Hannity to preach the truth. But it's not about the truth, it is about ratings. it is about money. These people are not there to lead you, to lead some cause. They are their to collect a paycheck. A large paycheck. A paycheck that increases with ratings.

The best way to protect yourself is to listen and read news, real news, not entertainment talk shows like Rush or hannity or matthews, from as many sources as possible. Fact check those emails you are getting from the right wing or left wing blogosphere. You will be shocked at how much BS is in them. Stuff, you will beleive because you wanna beleive because it agrees with your POV. But don't beleive it, don't accept it.

You want to try this right now? Here is how. You are telling us that the racism rant originates from the left, not the right. The truth is i don't know. But i don't accept at face value your claim it comes from the left. Prove to me, with unbiased web references that it comes from the left. That means you need to find a factual source, not some blogger with an agenda. Give me a web address and lets see. lets start there since we both want truth.

 

[Crispin]

Native Floridian: We would be honored to have you as a Crispin's Critter if you will have us.

Treasure Hunter, Bevo, and XLTer: I would like to re-extend the invitation to you as well. We need good men of character who are not worried about a government takeover.

Sincerely,

Crispin

 

[bevo]

It is hard to not feel overwhelmed these days. There is only one true answer.

 

[CoilyGirl]

I am well aware of all our branches of government, unfortunately our current white house illegal resident doesn't , and is constantly trying to bypass the other branches.

Perfect example is his refusal to allow the deportation of illegal aliens under current law using his "dream act" he violated US law , ignored constitution and went around congressman by doing so.

It is his job to administer the law, not pick and choose which ones to ignore.

If obama can ignore the law so can the people...

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Well said Treasure Hunter but unfortunately WE are required to follow the law,not be above it like He Who Shalt Not Be Named.