New site?...with different clue versions?

[Al D]

That is a serious Q the four peaks looking like one from the mine has been published dozens of times are you saying that is not attributed to Dutchman, ok this is an honest Q who originally said that?

It does not matter who said it, you stated that you verified it, if you made a mistake, OK, it happens, but do not try to deflect the question, it will not go away

 

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[arcana-exploration]

Thank you if that is the case and you may be right please let me know and I will correct the source on our site. as not the Dutchman, but it would then be a general Dutchman clue, but thanks, that is why I come on this site to get good information before the book comes out I want it to be as accurate as possible. I have 10 Dutchman books here I will try to backtrack also, thanks for your help. Let me know what you find.

 

[Al D]

Thank you if that is the case and you may be right please let me know and I will correct the source on our site. as not the Dutchman, but it would then be a general Dutchman clue, but thanks, that is why I come on this site to get good information before the book comes out I want it to be as accurate as possible. I have 10 Dutchman books here I will try to backtrack also, thanks for your help. Let me know what you find.

I will, and happy Fathers day

 

[arcana-exploration]

I will, and happy Fathers day

Thanks. This might save some time because now I am curious, about the source of the 4peaks clue, I just saw this on 6-14 2013 they had a thread on favorite clues. 393Stroker picked the 4peaks clue. so 393Stroker do you remember that source? Thanks. And with that, I am hitting the hay.

 

[PotBelly Jim]

I work with a few folks who were born in China.
When I asked them if they could get me some spy shots from there, they all said "not on menu...no can order".
Tried the WhiteHouse too, cause "you know", and the nice man who answered the phone said "Hang on, I'll give Vlad a call....see what we can do for you."
While I was waiting on that call, I dialed the CIA. After my phone stopped clicking and humming....and my computer stopped scrolling and downloading every page to somewhere else....the receptionist said she could put me in contact with a Nigerian Prince who would deposit his father's millions in my home bank account. When I told her I only wanted some U2 spy photos, and she wasn't gonna need my bank account number for that....the wench hung up on me.
Still on hold with Washington. One can always hope I guess.

Wayne, just hang up and call GCHQ. They have all the American, Chinese and Russian satellite imagery...and it's even organized so they can find whatever they're looking for.

 

[somehiker]

Wayne, just hang up and call GCHQ. They have all the American, Chinese and Russian satellite imagery...and it's even organized so they can find whatever they're looking for.

I would, but the way they speak English ain't much better than Chinese to me.
Unless you mean the other GCHQ ?
They got an 800- number ?
Otherwise I'm gonna have to pay for a long-distance call to Gold Canyon myself.
That's half the budget for my next trip.

 

[deducer]

Because I've been there, and thus can easily go to the places where all of my photos have been taken, I can say the same.
Those who haven't seem to think every shadow on the ground they see on GE is a mine, and every line of rocks is a ruin etc.

BTW: I'm still having trouble seeing many posts in these threads. The only way I can follow everyone's comments right now is to visit their profiles and click on the posts title. Takes extra time to do all that, and I probably miss a few.

Have you tried emptying your web browser's cache/history? Your authentication cookie might have become corrupted.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Clear your cookies and browsing history then reboot.

 

[somehiker]

Clear your cookies and browsing history then reboot.

Didn't have to. Seems to be working ok now, without me having to do anything more.

 

[Oroblanco]

Hi Roy, good to see you back with us.

I wanted to get back to this- seeing that nobody has answered this yet. Jesuit presence in the Superstitions- as of now, there is no smoking gun. But I am not surprised that there isn't any- from our long discussions in the Jesuit thread, you know their penchant for stealth, their tendency towards concealment over the centuries, so by the time they got to the Pimeria Alta, they were well practiced in this art.

I'd say it's rather a process of elimination.

I have seen with my own eyes, first hand evidence of a large concealment operation, and have more than enough photographic and video evidence to support this premise. My thinking is then: Who else would have the discipline to undertake such a large operation, and in secrecy? Who else would have the motivation to vanish and leave behind no trace, no blatant "X marks the spot"? Who else would cache for the long term, and for beyond their generation?

The Mexicans, and to a much lesser extent, the Spanish, on the other hand, operated on a smaller scale, left minimal signs and simple directions, not riddles or ciphers. They concealed only enough to get through the summer seasons, until they could return in the fall to resume extraction. There were exceptions of course- they did have at least two, probably more, large workings, one of which came to be know as the LDM. They had a central camp in Marsh Valley, another smaller one on Peter's Mesa at the Salt Flat, another on the northern end of Bluff Spring Mountain. There are remnants of arrestras at both locations which were used to reduce ore before hauling them off to the smelters at the bottom of the mountains.

Sorry for being late to the dance!

In favor of looking at the Franciscans again, we can point to the explorations done in the early phase of their arrival (1768-97) father Garces in particular took pains to explore areas to the north of the Gila river. Also, we have it from a Catholic source about the retrieval of a cache of gold from the Franciscans' mission on the Colorado river, done by Mexicans long after the departure of the Franciscans. The Franciscan padres were not happy with the "secularization" of the mission properties which began by order of the Mexican government circa 1821. They had every reason to conceal what ever treasure(s) had been accumulated, rather than allow the government to simply seize it for their coffers. Plus they had a full year to execute the hiding of valuables and mines. Remember, the impressive mission churches and buildings at San Xavier del Bac and Tumacacori were both built by Franciscans, at least the buildings we can see, and these buildings have smelter slag built right into the mission walls. The mission at Bac was the site seen by early American travelers who remarked about the altar service of solid silver, worth an estimated $40,000 in 1840s dollars. The Franciscan padres might not have been quite so aggressive, and really were 'losing ground' insofar as the number of missions they were maintaining, but they were certainly accumulating treasures and especially silver. I would not write them off as the original owners of a treasure secreted in the Superstition mountains by any measure.

An unknown number of priests from other Orders also served in Pimeria Alta, the one credited with the very first "documented" placer gold mining at Baboquiviri for instance was an Augustinian priest, not Franciscan or Jesuit.

In favor of a LATER date for the creation of a cache/depository of treasure in the Superstitions, I know of several items recovered in the wilderness area which were clearly Mexican and dated to the 1820 period. Far too late for the Jesuits.

Arcana - it won't win over anyone to your point of view on things by calling anyone an Alpha Idiot. We don't need to call each other names to get the point across, and can disagree without being disagreeable.

Sorry for the long winded post there, got carried away! Please do continue,
Oroblanco

 

[deducer]

It appears to me that Nentvig is describing that which is told to him by the Pima, I doubt that he was given to flights of fancy and exageration

Right, I am not agreeing that Nentvig was prone to exaggerating- I am just pointing out the passages that has given more than one poster the mistaken impression that Nentvig was making things up when in fact he was just repeating things told him, and not all of the tales were from Natives. The Tarantula/horse tale was told to him by a soldier from the Fronteras Presidio.

I don't know if you remember Lamar, a poster from long ago that argued fiercely against Jesuits being involved in mining, but he used this as an excuse to throw out the baby with the bathwater, i.e., discrediting Nentvig.

 

[deducer]

If this is true, and I have no reason to believe that it is not true, then Joseph Och must be exaggerating, now there is an account which I believe is stretched. However, I do recall that according to Sedylmayer, the revolt of 1751 took the Jesuits by total surprise

All of the Jesuits that wrote for publication were very aware that they were writing for everyone, and took pains to paint a picture of fidelity and poverty.

The Pima revolution of 1751 occurred as a result of the bitter, power struggle between the Jesuits and the governing Spaniards on how the Natives were to be utilized. That the revolting Pimas chose to attack both sides probably came as a surprise to the Jesuits, who saw themselves as being far more lenient on the Natives than the Spaniards. This, of course, was delusional.

I would not be surprised that Governor Ortiz Parrilla promised the Pimas captains (Luis, et al) that he would pardon them if they blamed the Jesuits for the uprising (which they did). Parrilla viewed the Jesuits as a meddling nuisance.

 

[sailaway]

Harmony of the Spheres, The Myth of Precession, Geodesy and the World Grid:
Sacred Geometry
https://www.masonic-lodge-of-education.com/point-within-a-circle.html
https://gist.github.com/mrflip/a973b1c60f4a38fc3277ddd57ce65b28
continuation of the geometric Vesica Pisces results in the geometric matrix named Ad-triangulum.
The line of ancient sites may be viewed as a circle
https://grahamhancock.com/geographic-geometric-relationships-alisonj/
https://monoskop.org/images/5/55/Frutiger_Adrian_Signs_and_Symbols_Their_Design_and_Meaning.pdf

The ancient symbol known as the dot in the circle, circled dot, circle with a point, or a circumpunct, is one of the oldest symbols known to humans.
https://gnosticwarrior.com/circumpunct.html

The Wilderness falls on the 33rd Parallel
https://www.academia.edu/8471236/Along_the_33rd_Parallel_The_Global_Mystery_Circle

 

[arcana-exploration]

Sorry for being late to the dance!

In favor of looking at the Franciscans again, we can point to the explorations done in the early phase of their arrival (1768-97) father Garces in particular took pains to explore areas to the north of the Gila river. Also, we have it from a Catholic source about the retrieval of a cache of gold from the Franciscans' mission on the Colorado river, done by Mexicans long after the departure of the Franciscans. The Franciscan padres were not happy with the "secularization" of the mission properties which began by order of the Mexican government circa 1821. They had every reason to conceal what ever treasure(s) had been accumulated, rather than allow the government to simply seize it for their coffers. Plus they had a full year to execute the hiding of valuables and mines. Remember, the impressive mission churches and buildings at San Xavier del Bac and Tumacacori were both built by Franciscans, at least the buildings we can see, and these buildings have smelter slag built right into the mission walls. The mission at Bac was the site seen by early American travelers who remarked about the altar service of solid silver, worth an estimated $40,000 in 1840s dollars. The Franciscan padres might not have been quite so aggressive, and really were 'losing ground' insofar as the number of missions they were maintaining, but they were certainly accumulating treasures and especially silver. I would not write them off as the original owners of a treasure secreted in the Superstition mountains by any measure.

An unknown number of priests from other Orders also served in Pimeria Alta, the one credited with the very first "documented" placer gold mining at Baboquiviri for instance was an Augustinian priest, not Franciscan or Jesuit.

In favor of a LATER date for the creation of a cache/depository of treasure in the Superstitions, I know of several items recovered in the wilderness area which were clearly Mexican and dated to the 1820 period. Far too late for the Jesuits.

Arcana - it won't win over anyone to your point of view on things by calling anyone an Alpha Idiot. We don't need to call each other names to get the point across, and can disagree without being disagreeable.

Sorry for the long winded post there, got carried away! Please do continue,
Oroblanco

Thank you. You are right.

 

[wrmickel1]

Well all that is fantastic, well versed but the Augustinian Order was a well known associate of piracy, The first order to connect them self’s to the church but live a normal life. They still have the largest complete pirate treasure collection to this day. Augustine FL, I believe they have a museum. They were a group that came from all orders of the Catholic Church that wanted Religious Status But followed no rules of the Church. The first Pay to Play scam, So it makes perfect sense that they were the first to document a placer claim, They were safe safe to do so.

But in the end all all the symbols associated on the Stone Maps are all Jesuit Symbols.

wrmickel1

 

[Real of Tayopa]

deducer, just to clarify, nothing more, I believe that is "Carametraca" , it is a small plant. I commissioned Indians to find it for me, to see if it's propertis could be useful.

 

[Real of Tayopa]

Deducer, Lamar was a Jesuit historian. He was quite firm in his beliefs.

 

[Al D]

But in the end all all the symbols associated on the Stone Maps are all Jesuit Symbols.

wrmickel1

You will need to back that statement up with some evidence, as there are many here who will disagree. I for one know that none of those symbols are Jesuit.

 

[wrmickel1]

You will need to back that statement up with some evidence, as there are many here who will disagree. I for one know that none of those symbols are Jesuit.

You give the Symbol and I’ll give you the meaning straight from College of the Jesuit Order.

shall we Sir,

Babymick 1

 

[Al D]

You give the Symbol and I’ll give you the meaning straight from College of the Jesuit Order.

shall we Sir,

Babymick 1

How about a source where I can research it for myself?, a published book for example
and how about this one for starters