Metal Detectiing TN. cave / Anybody done this?

[nuggy]

I have a couple of led lanterns that I use camping or during power outages. They give off a good amount of light, are not heavy and four aaa batteries last up to 30 hours! These are available in different sizes and lumen capacities - low cost too, around $10 to $30 for good ones. Nuggy

 

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[Limitool]

I am totally taking back what I said below on June 15th, 2013 @ 8:30 am Post #25

"Good morning guys.... Thanks for the comments yesterday and last night. Maybeeee I gave a "wrong" impression of this cave. When I said it was obviously used by native Americans that part is RIGHT ON. But there are no Indian drawing and/or etching from them that I've seen in all my trips back there. The symbol(s) I've mentioned were scratched into the vast amount of mud pilings on either side of the streambed within and VERY faded due to the high humidity."

I am probably wrong after a "total review". This does not include memtioning one's I know of further back. Some of you were very RIGHT from the start. I thought due to the high humidity NOTHING would/could survive. I now know better due to research if the mud mounds Frank, Chelsea and I photographed are glyphs. I truly hope they are... Later, Brad

 

[gleaner1]

I tected a cave complex that was part of an old abandoned amusement park from the late 18's I only found a few antique flash bulb sockets. That was twenty years ago and I am thinking about another round.

 

[JeromeAz]

I detected a cave once. I was in the desert, turned around, sure enough! There was a cave! Lol!

That 1800's doodling, not possible! Doodling wasn't invented till 1987. Lol!

I know, I know. I'm full of it tonight!

Anyways I hope these pictures show up. The two pictures that show paintings on the rock wall are pictographs. The picture with the carving on the rocks are petroglyphs. That's what I'm looking for on the pictures taken in the cave. I'll be working on them tomorrow to see if I can pull anything out. Right now looking at them all I can see is a dried mound of mud with initials and other miscellaneous markings, two scary cavemen and some writing on the wall to your right when you walk in that says Buried Treasure with an arrow pointing down. Nothing real exciting so hopefully I find something tomorrow.

Until then, Nite All!

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[JeromeAz]

Well I guess the pictures didn't show. I seem to have a problem trying to get them on here. Not sure what I'm doing wrong. Probably because I'm using my phone. My laptop is about dead. Anyways I told you what the pictures are so you have an idea of what I'll be looking for. See what I can find tomorrow.

Clay

 

[Kookiemonsta]

FYI FOLKS: I've done a little research and found that some of the ancients went deep into caves and left etching in the mud. While I realize finding a cache of hidden gold/silver won't happen from ancient mud etchings probably from ancient folks I really hope this mound is just that. I'd still be "happy". I attached a link explaining somewhat what "dark zone" means concerning the etching. I was blown away "they" could go this deep into caves... HOW. In the attached photo (which I posted before) there is some more etching in mud. But this point is WAY BACK in cave. If you were in the "tunnel" pictured on the right side exiting it (coming toward camera) there are more etching straight ahead on the wall. Just left of the "crack" are the etchings. The tunnel is on the right wall, crack opening is centered and etching are on the left cave wall. Now I want to go those pictures also but this will really be a job. 20 years makes a BIG difference on this endeavor. And who knows what I may have missed on the way back....

I contacted 3 folks who have knowledge of cave etching (glyphs) at 2 universities and hopefully they'll tell me if this is ancient etching or somebody from the 1800's doodling in the mud.

Prehistoric Cave Art | Entries | Tennessee Encyclopedia

That picture on the right looks like you are standing in some old Indians living room! The room/tunell have such defined walls/shape and it seems like those ledges were carved in. Cant wait for any pictures of the drawings!

 

[Limitool]

Mr. Kookiemonsta... "Cant wait for any pictures of the drawings!" On page 8 of this thread there's some posted of the block of mud and its etching. Now if your meaning when I go back... light up area... and try again... Me too. Dr. Jan Simek of the University of Tennessee did get right back with me yesterday and said that where he was at now he couldn't view photographs until next week but would then. This guy is an authority on these mud glyphs. I'd just like to know before something happens to it and its "lost" or if its just someone doodling years ago. If he believes its glyphs I'll do a deep dive way back and get the other one I know of photographed (if it is a glyph). After learning that ancient man could and did enter "dark zones" my thinking has really changed. I never dreamed someone using cane torches would dare to go as deep as we did. After reading about some of the area's they entered... I'm just amazed.

 

[huntsman53]

Well folks, I did a little experimenting on two if the pictures yesterday to see if more details would emerge from the mud walls! As everyone knows by inverting the colors on a photograph, many hidden items come to light. I did just that and although more etchings or just marks and scratches or whatever came to light but in my burnt out state from peering at the photos too much, I haven't been able to tell what is and what isn't etchings as well as what they are and what they mean. In any case, they are attached below, so please have a look-see and see if you can tell anymore about them.


Frank



END

 

[nova treasure]

It is very Kool exploring Caves and thinking of who may have been there before you. I have been in quite a few caves in Kentucky and have found writing of some kind in almost everyone of them. I have found artifacts/relics that range from Native Americans to moonshiners to slave owners to looters and just 18th to 20th century explorers and probably people just using it for random shelter, but really who knows. I wish I had the knowledge of how to determine the difference in various writings and drawings. One thing I do know is that a lot of the drawings and writing that I have found in Kentucky is that their a good distance from the entrance of the caves and in some of the most random places. I would think that most of the time they were getting farther back into the cave to get away from the cold outside and be more comfortable with the caves 50 degree temps. I have also found names or initiails in small chambers of caves that sometime included dates to show a turn around point or to show what direction they had been if it had chambers that split into different directions. most of the artifacts that I had found were under cliff hangs outside the cave or in rock sediment bars in the shallow parts of the water stream that exits out into a creek or river.
I hope you the best on your endeavor and get plenty of pics and write down everything that you find. you might even want to do some research at the local library and see if their is any info,stories or folklore of the cave and maybe the roadbed in the area and so forth.

 

[GarretDiggingAz]

Brad

What a read and adventure. Couldn't stop reading the whole thread.
For these pics, are you or frank able to use an amber colored pic. I'm thinking of trying to duplicate the light without using actual fire.
Put yourself into their moccasins. Using what light they had.
When I look at what seems like rivers, ridges, or streams is more like a tree (2 of them) and the object to the right could've been a bush that had stems coming up. Depends on the season. The crack is used as a canyon of some sort. Maybe the actual river of some sort.
If they were Indians. I couldn't think of why they'd use letters H, L, R. So that could mean educated man (for a broad term). So English, French, Spaniards or some other group.
Sure seems like you've got something. Just what, who knows. Could point you to a cache of some sort. I'd suggest looking at old maps of area. Thing is the land changes. So study the surroundings. There MIGHT be some of these references in sight from cave.
We've been following a trail that might lead to a cache as well. Unfortunately not much lately. Like you we've been sitting on it for 20 years.
I think the person who may have been there could've been the ones you talked to early on from that group you asked about the cave. Just my two cents on that.
Here's to you and your adventure. No matter what you end up with. This will be something passed on to the family memory box. I've gone into several caves/mines. That feeling of going through time and into the mind of who has been there is quite the feeling. Aside from, hoping no animal is waiting on a shelf (or under).
Thanks for this thread. Keep up the work and remember to step away to clear your mind and be able to approach it with a clean slate each time. I think if you keep thinking of the same stuff all the time. You miss what's obviously right in front of you.
If possible go deeper. It's amazing how far back others had gone with little to nothing for light.
For instance, a light in the entrance could be reflected back.
If I can help you I will. Since I've got more time than I know what to do with. Lol

 

[twiasp]

Very enjoyable read and wish you all the best luck in figuring out the mystery. I am going to put down some of the general thoughts i had throughout this read if i can remember them all. They are not meant to be an insult just some thoughts that ran across my mind during this quest.

1. This cavern was obviously created by tons of water flowing through it of a long time. Anything ancient would more than likely be washed out of the cave into the low areas outside i would think. The area after your "artisian well" that curves around and you said there seems to be a man made looking tunnel but the side near the well is blocked off, this could be somebody blocking it off on purpose for some reason and reminds me of the natural flow of a river eroding land and creating Oxbow Lakes.
2. The "mud stone" reminds me of a wall at Meramac Caverns when i was a kid, it was a rock wall but i forget why it was tacky, mud-like, and people used to toss coins at it just to make them stick. Is the "mud stone" just pure mud stacked up in that shape without being ever washed out after big rains? or possibly stone that has a layer of softness to its outside. Also with the stone my initial thought of a stone with markings on it would be to signify a grave marker AND was it meant to stand upright like a headstone and fell maybe causing the top to crack off. With the "Mud stone" you could possible try some digital scans or something or take a mold and take to a university to do a digital scan and may get all of the missing pieces, or do oldschool kid stuff and put paper on it and rub with charcoal or something to get an impression. Is the stone also partially buried in other mud and maybe missing out on some of the symbols?
3. Lighting... Well i had several thoughts on this, I used to be an insurance adjuster and noticed that a digital camera with the flash on in complete darkness can highlight or capture water spots and other things that i couldn't see with my naked eyes, not sure if that would help in the cave or not. Also Blacklights and UV lights with a video camera can be utilized and some minerals/rocks will glow/flouresce.
4. I would think NEVER fire off a gun in a cave if you were thinking of taking one. It could cause a cave in from the shot echoing throughout the cave, much like the difference between a blackcat firework on your palm vs. one in a closed fist.
5. Be careful not only of the animals but their droppings, i have heard bat droppings and others can make a person VERY sick and cause death, unsure though. Even the Ammonia content can't be good if there is an area of a lot of it from bats.

GL in your adventures and hope you find what you are looking for

 

[Limitool]

Brad

What a read and adventure. Couldn't stop reading the whole thread.
For these pics, are you or frank able to use an amber colored pic. I'm thinking of trying to duplicate the light without using actual fire.
Put yourself into their moccasins. Using what light they had.
When I look at what seems like rivers, ridges, or streams is more like a tree (2 of them) and the object to the right could've been a bush that had stems coming up. Depends on the season. The crack is used as a canyon of some sort. Maybe the actual river of some sort.
If they were Indians. I couldn't think of why they'd use letters H, L, R. So that could mean educated man (for a broad term). So English, French, Spaniards or some other group.
Sure seems like you've got something. Just what, who knows. Could point you to a cache of some sort. I'd suggest looking at old maps of area. Thing is the land changes. So study the surroundings. There MIGHT be some of these references in sight from cave.
We've been following a trail that might lead to a cache as well. Unfortunately not much lately. Like you we've been sitting on it for 20 years.
I think the person who may have been there could've been the ones you talked to early on from that group you asked about the cave. Just my two cents on that.
Here's to you and your adventure. No matter what you end up with. This will be something passed on to the family memory box. I've gone into several caves/mines. That feeling of going through time and into the mind of who has been there is quite the feeling. Aside from, hoping no animal is waiting on a shelf (or under).
Thanks for this thread. Keep up the work and remember to step away to clear your mind and be able to approach it with a clean slate each time. I think if you keep thinking of the same stuff all the time. You miss what's obviously right in front of you.
If possible go deeper. It's amazing how far back others had gone with little to nothing for light.
For instance, a light in the entrance could be reflected back.
If I can help you I will. Since I've got more time than I know what to do with. Lol

Thanks... I don't know about the amber light but I am going back soon and approach this a little differently. Hey... we've thought about what the "tree branchy" thing is also and maybe its reference to outside landscape. And Frank and I really are getting tired "staring" at this block of mud... we need help. I'm hoping a professor from UT... Dr. Jan Simek can review the photos I sent when he returns from . He got right back with me but can't receive/review photos where he's at. Maybe upon seeing them maybe he can then say yea/naw on them being ancient artwork (faded) or more recent Indian marking or just someone doodling in the mud or maybe some combination. Thank you very much for your interest... later, Brad

 

[Limitool]

Very enjoyable read and wish you all the best luck in figuring out the mystery. I am going to put down some of the general thoughts i had throughout this read if i can remember them all. They are not meant to be an insult just some thoughts that ran across my mind during this quest.

1. This cavern was obviously created by tons of water flowing through it of a long time. Anything ancient would more than likely be washed out of the cave into the low areas outside i would think. The area after your "artisian well" that curves around and you said there seems to be a man made looking tunnel but the side near the well is blocked off, this could be somebody blocking it off on purpose for some reason and reminds me of the natural flow of a river eroding land and creating Oxbow Lakes.
2. The "mud stone" reminds me of a wall at Meramac Caverns when i was a kid, it was a rock wall but i forget why it was tacky, mud-like, and people used to toss coins at it just to make them stick. Is the "mud stone" just pure mud stacked up in that shape without being ever washed out after big rains? or possibly stone that has a layer of softness to its outside. Also with the stone my initial thought of a stone with markings on it would be to signify a grave marker AND was it meant to stand upright like a headstone and fell maybe causing the top to crack off. With the "Mud stone" you could possible try some digital scans or something or take a mold and take to a university to do a digital scan and may get all of the missing pieces, or do oldschool kid stuff and put paper on it and rub with charcoal or something to get an impression. Is the stone also partially buried in other mud and maybe missing out on some of the symbols?
3. Lighting... Well i had several thoughts on this, I used to be an insurance adjuster and noticed that a digital camera with the flash on in complete darkness can highlight or capture water spots and other things that i couldn't see with my naked eyes, not sure if that would help in the cave or not. Also Blacklights and UV lights with a video camera can be utilized and some minerals/rocks will glow/flouresce.
4. I would think NEVER fire off a gun in a cave if you were thinking of taking one. It could cause a cave in from the shot echoing throughout the cave, much like the difference between a blackcat firework on your palm vs. one in a closed fist.
5. Be careful not only of the animals but their droppings, i have heard bat droppings and others can make a person VERY sick and cause death, unsure though. Even the Ammonia content can't be good if there is an area of a lot of it from bats.

GL in your adventures and hope you find what you are looking for

Thanks for your thoughts.... The "mud stone" you reference is totally a mud/clay like substance. No stone. And it was apparently carved out from the surrounding mud deposits or shaped by hand into its present shape. I thought at one time maybe "made" by hand and since it wasn't naturally packed the crack developed due to settling later. Now, I don't know what to believe or think. Your right about the water flow... but I think/believe this occurred long before even ancients entered the cave. After researching a lot the last 3 days I've learned some of the ancient etching discovered here in TN have survived 6000 years in very cold, high humidity caves such as this. And water flow naturally deposited the mud/clay substance "they" wrote in also and it survived... though a toll has taken place slowly. There's NO WAY to touch this mound without doing damage to capture its shapes or transfer them. The tunnel deep in the cave is really a head scratcher... This is the area there are some more marking on the wall... its been a long time since I went that far into cave and can't remember exactly how many or much etching were there. But we didn't touch them or disturb anything. But it's not easy to get too. Taking a gun will not be considered. I've considered this mound to maybe be a grave marker also. So, until I hear back from anthropology professor Jan Simek I'm not going to advance this cause. I'd just like to possibly "rule out" any ancient work that needs to be preserved before I take another avenue outside of more pictures soon. We still have NOT searched this cave past the mound like we did the first 50 yards. I just know somebody at sometime went to a lot of work to access this point and either construct this mound or carve it out and then mark it up. And this doesn't even touch the hows and whys much further back in. I attached a couple photos from the Maryville, TN area of some mud etchings. Notice the modern "letter, number" symbols they utilized. Thanks for your interest... Brad

 

[bigblockjohn454]

Brad,
That first picture above looks like a bird. Do you see it? Or, well, maybe you do. Sorry!

You didn't say anything about this pic.

John!

 

[Limitool]

Brad,
That first picture above looks like a bird. Do you see it? Or, well, maybe you do. Sorry!

You didn't say anything about this pic.

John!

"I attached a couple photos from the Maryville, TN area of some mud etchings. Notice the modern "letter, number" symbols they utilized." (from above post) Hey John, those two photos I attached were NOT from my cave but from one not to far away from me. I got them researching the last few days and shared because of some of the symbols resemble "modern" letters, numbers. There were many better examples but I was unable to "cut & paste" to share. Sorry if you were misled.... that was not my intention. I was just surprised at some of the symbols they utilized and what we take for granted today as normal. Later, Brad

 

[GarretDiggingAz]

Brad
I know about those pics. Actually not entirely different from our hieroglyphics out here. I've found several walls of them in a canyon. Plus some mutates plus other artifacts. Just cool to look at. But also looking for a lost treasure as well. Thought I had it one day. What I thought was leather (aged) was a thin piece of oxidized granite. Ughhhhh.
Keep it up and let us know whit the prof says.

 

[Limitool]

Brad
I know about those pics. Actually not entirely different from our hieroglyphics out here. I've found several walls of them in a canyon. Plus some mutates plus other artifacts. Just cool to look at. But also looking for a lost treasure as well. Thought I had it one day. What I thought was leather (aged) was a thin piece of oxidized granite. Ughhhhh.
Keep it up and let us know whit the prof says.

Mr. GDA....I absolutely promise to tell all of you interested in this thread what I find out from the professor (Dr. Jan Simek of UT.) about this mud/clay mound ASAP. And if it's good (ancient art/Indian art) or bad (doodling) I'll pass on his opinion upon at that time when I receive it to ALL OF YOU. We personally would like to know so other options can possibly be explored. Thank you very much of everyone's interest. My daughter and I are going to get better photos soon (stay tuned) it's just not easy.

And I'd just like to share with all of you that I am so intrigued with all your finds with your MD's and I CAN"T WAIT TO FIND something worthy to post with my MD also. I realize "mud drawing" don't count as MD treasures but this is the hand I've been dealt thus far. My thanks to my daughter, FRANK and all that have PM'd me and encouraged this effort. Later, ... Brad

 

[Limitool]

Looks like my daughter, Chelsea and I are going to go back again this coming Saturday morning to light up the mound area and re-photo. I don't own a video camera but she has a much better camera than I and it does video also. So if everything works out I'll try and video the area this etched mound is within also with hopefully better photos also. We're both (Chelsea & I) hoping a 12 volt battery and a couple headlamps with work. I'm getting a new 12 volt tractor battery tomorrow. My lawn tractor is due for one anyway (wife bought this story anyway). And, after I pulled the plugs on the tractor headlights... she mentioned I needed a couple of headlamps also. She's so observant (I really love her). So now we'll have a new 12 volt battery and 2 new headlamps to "light it up". Can anyone tell me if I can upload a short video from a camera directly to this site? I really hope this makes a difference on the quality of re-photographing this etched mound.

 

[gilgar]

I kinda see a slightly squiggly horizontal line between the H and the L that also looks to have a faint vertical line starting up from the left side of it which makes me wonder if someone scratched in H E L P at one time If so, maybe the other parts of the E got rubbed off and they accidentally added a line to the P or someone added it later. Someone could have written that in jest sometime in the past. I've been in a cave similar to this in that that it had very low ceilings, tunnels, etc. It also had an offshoot room full of clay in which people over the years had made numerous clay objects, written things in the clay, and basically just clay graffitied up the little room--maybe this was some clay graffiti as well

 

[Limitool]

I kinda see a slightly squiggly horizontal line between the H and the L that also looks to have a faint vertical line starting up from the left side of it which makes me wonder if someone scratched in H E L P at one time If so, maybe the other parts of the E got rubbed off and they accidentally added a line to the P or someone added it later. Someone could have written that in jest sometime in the past. I've been in a cave similar to this in that that it had very low ceilings, tunnels, etc. It also had an offshoot room full of clay in which people over the years had made numerous clay objects, written things in the clay, and basically just clay graffitied up the little room--maybe this was some clay graffiti as well

You are not the 1st person to mention the "HELP" scenario. But you are the first to mention it openly on this thread. The "squiggly horizontal line between the H and L" is clearly seen but if you could be right at the mound you'd see an "E" has not been "rubbed off". And if you could see the "R" in person you could clearly see the entire symbol has worn as one symbol. How do I know this.... I don't for sure, I admit. But seeing it ("R") in person these observations are easily seen. This is why I have contacted Dr. Jan Simek an authority on this subject and I await his answer based upon the photo's sent thus far. This is why I posted some other mud/clay drawings from 6000 years ago (very near me) that they used then that appears to mimic "modern symbols" used today. Are these symbols graffiti....? They most possibly could be and I'll post as soon as I hear something from the expert.