Is the Pit Mine really the Lost Dutchman mine?

PotBelly Jim said:
Those are some wicked tall snake chaps by the way...you don't play around...
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It's the mountains that don't play around. They're beautiful, but make no mistakes- they're utterly remorseless. Unforgiving, especially when you go off trail. Can't remember the last time I went off-trail without the desert drawing blood from me.
 

deducer said:
It's the mountains that don't play around. They're beautiful, but make no mistakes- they're utterly remorseless. Unforgiving, especially when you go off trail. Can't remember the last time I went off-trail without the desert drawing blood from me.
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everything out there bites..sticks or stings:BangHead:
 

OldManOfTheRiver said:
Boring in here tonight. Everyone having fun at the rendezvous and I am stuck in Tennessee. On another note. Does anyone have good pictures of Kochera Ore?
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Is the only pic i have ( not mine )

Kochera ore.jpg
 

deducer said:
It's the mountains that don't play around. They're beautiful, but make no mistakes- they're utterly remorseless. Unforgiving, especially when you go off trail. Can't remember the last time I went off-trail without the desert drawing blood from me.
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You're welcome to it...when I was younger, I enjoyed bushwacking...now, I tend to hike in shorts, boots and T-shirt...I can't take the heat anymore, even in the winter...I can tolerate gaiters, but that's about it...so I avoid areas that will shred me...

I've never been afraid of snakes...I have an old coontail that hunts under our cabin in AZ we call "Old Grumpy"...he's been around there for a number of years...they get used to you and will put up with a lot, and I'd rather have snakes than mice and other vermin...while I think the aggressiveness of the green mohave tends to be over-done, they can be aggressive and I will kill one on sight if it's on my property...an unfortunate task, but it's too risky to have them around...
 

PotBelly Jim said:
I think all those old gin-soaked crooks and con men have pretty much died off...liars, fakers, etc...I knew a few many decades ago, was always glad to be clear of them. I always thought LDM hunters were nuts and crooks until I ran across Feldmans forum and then this one...some pretty decent folks around nowadays...
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You're totally wrong on that.

One day I'll elaborate on that statement right now is not the time... you'll probably will hear about it first publicly before I say anything because it's not really my place to talk until the fat lady sings treasure.

Even the group loosely associated with that last treasure hunt fiasco had it's share of back stabbings! All Treasure Hunters go through the "Eureka I found it!" stage of life.

Nothing's ever as it seems on the surface.

I was accosted by a different TH group early on (2002ish?) that only wanted to silence what I was posting on this forum with a "Confidentiality Agreement". I guess I had better copy of a map than they had... you know the Molina Grocery Bag Map? When I discovered the true nature of the groups intentions by my own investigating I promptly disassociated myself from that group. After exposing the group's true intentions I was amazed at how many came to the defense of this groups dirty dealings even to this very day. You would be surprised by the people still backing what I call the the Misfit Treasure Hunter sore losers club! Typical with that sort of thing they turned the whole thing around and said I was the one dealing from the bottom of the deck! Sorry thing is that groups leader had already soaked his friends and relatives for way over 50 grand! They had nothing to show for it but an bunch of empty "Blakes" (holes).

Even some of the most prominent Treasure Hunting groups have their skeleton's lurking in a closet. Faked treasures comes to mind...Tesoro Del Alma...Victorio Peak...Stone Maps ...Blake Gordon...i have groups contact me all the time and tell me stories about this or that person's betrayal... that's why I only work alone!

I still have referrals from some of the most prominent old school Treasure Hunters / Authors of signs and symbol books out there...only because they have talked with me or met me and realize what I know...when you've been doing this as long as I have you get a lot of exposure..

It doesn't mean I don't look at offers....I just had a contract sent to me last week to sign...I haven't had time to send it to my Attorney yet so I haven't signed it... I'm considering it though... bad thing is it gets all it's best information from a set of faked maps...(You know the ones I'm talking about)...but on the other hand it has good electronic science backing up the find...the good thing is that most if not all eventually get over their
"Gold Fever" with proper medication and rest thus becoming normal again!

Some don't.

Best advise is stay away from people demanding money up front!
Always sign a contract, of course, after your attorney looks it over...and...
do not let anyone have total control of any finds!
Stay alert and stay alive people have been killed over Pyrite chunks!
 

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coazon de oro said:
Howdy Jim,

Yes, Ted was referring to the Pit Mine, in fact he reclaimed the Silver Chief as the Ridge Pit Mine. Matthew Roberts started a thread here titled "Ted Cox and the Ridge Pit Mine", which tells you all about it. The caches he was talking about however, were in caves, not mines. One was a cave with a concentrate cache, while the other was a cave with a gold bullion cache. None of those would be gold in quartz like it is assumed to have come from an empty hole in the ground.

In my opinion the cave with a gold bullion cache has to be Walter Perrine's cave of gold bars on Black Top Mesa. Walter's Grandmother who was a full blooded Chiricahua Apache, related this story to him when she was on her deathbed.

Homar
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I spoke to a couple members of Walter Perrine's family a number of years ago. Nobody in Walter's family had any Chiricahua or any other Apache blood as far as they knew including his grandmother. Walter was a highly intelligent man who has/had a number of patents and inventions to his name, but the family knew his as an eccentric storyteller and nothing more as far as his "treasure" stories go.
 

Cubfan64 said:
I spoke to a couple members of Walter Perrine's family a number of years ago. Nobody in Walter's family had any Chiricahua or any other Apache blood as far as they knew including his grandmother. Walter was a highly intelligent man who has/had a number of patents and inventions to his name, but the family knew his as an eccentric storyteller and nothing more as far as his "treasure" stories go.
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As far as my research is concerned. That cave is right past Anti-Gravity Canyon. Gotta be careful in there not to walk into one of these!

magic.jpg
 

Cubfan64 said:
I spoke to a couple members of Walter Perrine's family a number of years ago. Nobody in Walter's family had any Chiricahua or any other Apache blood as far as they knew including his grandmother. Walter was a highly intelligent man who has/had a number of patents and inventions to his name, but the family knew his as an eccentric storyteller and nothing more as far as his "treasure" stories go.
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Howdy Paul,

Gotta give it to Walter, that's one hell of a story, even the dates fit in. I would still not dismiss it until a geneology search confirmed it, for some reason there are some who will not admit to having indian blood. :dontknow:

Homar
 

coazon de oro said:
Didn't see any float gold, did ya?
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Between the snakes and the cougar and the wading and all that? Lol. I just about died up there. It was hella fun though. The Spanish is what gets me. It's utterly messed up. I'd like to clean the writing up or at least get a better picture at some point. I really fell in love out there. It was amazing. You guys have something amazing.
 

coazon de oro said:
Howdy Paul,

Gotta give it to Walter, that's one hell of a story, even the dates fit in. I would still not dismiss it until a geneology search confirmed it, for some reason there are some who will not admit to having indian blood. :dontknow:

Homar
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Can't argue with that. I did some digging into it his geneology at one point and kept hitting roadblocks. After talking to one of his relatives I never went back to it, but you're right there's always the chance it was true - just not enough for me to go back to digging.
 

Hey All,

Can someone post the GPS coordinates to the pit mine if they have it?
Would like to hike in and check it out while the weather is nice.

Thanks,
Matt
 

This is what you need for locating the back filled tunnel at the Pit Mine. It works absolutely fantastic! You can practice on any old mine that you know is there. It spits out results that are solid for finding voids or Treasures. This is my second survey of a known area. In the last video I'm "X" ing the mine void. It shows I'm right over the mine. Although I'm not at liberty to give the location or status of this search, it is an "Ah Ha" moment! Next I'm doing a video on locating the hidden entrance to the mine tunnel. I'm going to square my search to find the direction of the audit and pin point the opening! Thanks for viewing.





I have a rooster due in this one!

 

Personally, I feel the title to this thread is a little deceiving. I am aware the thread is directed at the one that feeds Rogers Spring. I know of five pit mines all on the same mountain and there may be more that are undiscovered. Could it be that there are actually eighteen pit mines as the stone maps refer to? Ward called the area the Spanish Through on his maps. One is just off the road toward the top of the mountain, one in Fraser Canyon, one high up in Randolph Canyon, one at Rogers Spring, and one up by the saddle over the grave of Reavis. This last one makes me wonder if it was not Waltz that killed his friend Reavis by accident and why he never went back after the three shipments of ore from Hewitt Station to California.

I still have the BLM forms 3830-3, 3860-2 and 3860-5 where I attempted to file a claim on Sections: 2,3,10,11, Township: 01N, Range: 10E, Meridian: Gila and Salt River, but the LDM may be in section 14 and would need Government survey to see where it actually lays.

Dutchman in Rogers Canyon 1.JPGDutchman in Rogers Canyon 2.JPG
 

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cactusjumper said:
Jim,

The man who showed Feldman that Pit Mine did not work it, or even go into it. When he found it, it was covered over. The finder told me the story personally. His word was as good as "gold" for me. I believe it was a worked out silver mine that was used to cache a horde of gold.

Three men rode up to that mine and observed two dug out caches as they approached it. One of the men was the finder, the other was the man who eventually opened it up over a three year period, working only in the summer months. Two of those men told me the same story sitting in my front room. The third man, who shall remain nameless, was the same man who took the pictures of the Kochera Ore. I asked him if he thought that ore came out of the Pit Man, and he said he was sure it did. He would be in a position to know.

Many of you folks can connect the dots here, except for who that third man was. If any of you know who worked that mine, and I know plenty of you do, you can ask him how close my story fits the facts of that ride up to the mine. I would bet a lot of money on the truth of the story. Eventually I will probably name the finder of that mine, or at least the man who showed it to those who worked it. It was an old, old mine.

Take care,

Joe
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I think it's past time to name the finder of the Pit Mine, at least he was the one who showed it to the folks who opened it up. I was first told the story by one of the three men who rode up to the mine in my story. The finder later corroborated that story while the three of us were sitting in my front room. I have already named Ron Feldman as one of the three men. I will not be naming the man who took the pictures of the Kochera ore.

The man who showed the Pit Mine to Ron was Tom Kollenborn. He reluctantly admitted he was the one who led Ron to the mine. In later years he gave me more details. I suppose someone who knows Ron well, can ask him how accurate my story is. Because of the circumstances of how I received it, I believe the story 100%

Tom would never tell me what they found in the mine. I always assumed it was a cache location for gold out of the LDM or other mines in the area.

You will all have to draw your own conclusions.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo
 

Thanks, Joe. One thing I always wondered, was how hard they had to work to get to any cache that was hidden in that old mine. I believe Ted Cox missed it. I always believed that Herman was looking for a covered mine that contained a cache.
 

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