Found something interesting.. not by metal detector!

[zerohypert]

Hi Guys.. kinda new to the forum but been browsing a lot lately and you guys are tempting me into buying a metal detector! Anyways! Let me show you guys what I found and tell you the story how i found out.

My fiancee found it by accident.. believe it or not.. she was cleaning out of this big closet and noticed that the carpet was a bit loose at the corner and she decided to see what kind of floor we have underneath the carpet ..just out of curiousity...and she saw something and she pulled it off more and noticed that there was a door that had an access under the floor. She came to me while I was trying to sort things out in the house that i inherited from my great aunt, and she said... you should check this out.. you wont believe what I just found. So I followed her into that room and saw it. I tried to open it and it did and I found 4 swords and one dagger from germany and a possible civil war era baycott (not sure) and one is unknown.. I couldnt ID it.

I was kinda surprised why my great uncle had to go through hard work to make something like that just to hide those swords.... but i'll explain later on why he did that.

This is my findings!

I have two of those.. Art Fab Todelo 1890 and 1906....dont know much about it..

Samauri Swords.. one is from 1945 and other is unknown.. it has japanese symbols on it but other one where you put sword in...is leather and other one is metal... again.. dont know much about it..

Possibily Civil War Era Baycott... it was a nice find though

Unknown.. i couldnt find any markings on it! I wish I could figure out on this one

nearly in mint condition... it looks really nice.. this Hirschfanger dagger from germany


You guys probably would be wondering why my great uncle had to work hard to make a nice hidden floor for those items... and I spoke with my mother about it....my mom was raised by her aunt/uncles.. which means they are my great aunt/uncle. Anyways the point is that he designed those floor to hide the gold bars as part of his investments. When he knew his life would be over soon and he decided to take those bars out and sold it and put it into some kidn of account (that's for me but i prefer to have a gold bar on my hand to feel it ha) Those floor werent the only one place he hidden.. I found other place where he hid those and I found out that he did kept some bars and silver dollars coins....A LOT of them.. he purchased thoses from store.. in bulk and kept it in secret place for like forever until he sold it again and put the money in account. So I believe that he left those swords behind and I just assumed that he knew they didnt have that much of values. You know.. silver dollars and gold bars.. woot.. if I were him.. I'd leave those swords behind but I dont know the value of those items that I just found.. but if its pretty high.. I wouldnt mind to sell those and buy myself a gold bar as an investment starter!


Sorry if this post is too long!

Travis

 

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[MUD(S.W.A.T)]

Thats a real cache, real treasure !!

If they are as real as people say they are you could get a few gold bars with those, but as far as investments go, keep the swords. Banner for sure....

Keep @ it and HH!!

 

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[Yarrum]

You need to buy your fiance a bunch of flowers That's an awesome find.
Keep us updated if you can.

 

[goldencoin]

Very cool finds!

HH
-GC

 

[ModernMiner]

What a fantastic find and story!!! This cache deserves BANNER for sure!!!
Welcome to TN, and thanks for sharing it with us.
-MM-

 

[d2]

The bayonet appears to be Civil War also. Great finds...d2

 

[TheHarleyMan2]

The war loot thing is an interesting question, My great uncle had several japanese swords and rifles that he got during the occupation. He told me a story about how when MacArthur banned all weapons on mainland Japan, the miltary rounded up all the guns and swords they could find, loaded them onto boats and dumped them in Tokyo bay. The ones he had were his "picks" from the pile on the dock before they were dumped. Unfortunately for me, his children didn't appreciate those things as much as I do, and they sold all of it when he passed, and probably for much less than it was worth.

You are not obliged to find out if there is a family that will want the sword, that's completely up to you. It would be a noble thing to do, and I would certainly try to find relatives of the soldier who carried it if there was any hope of doing it.

I feel your pain. My grandfather brought back all kinds of weapons from WWII -- a samurai sword, M-1 carbine, bayonet, etc. -- and my grandmother made him sell them all on account of my mother being just a toddler at the time. That kills me!

Travis, as for your swords, they're both likely officer swords constructed during the WWII era. The second one (with the metal scabbard) most definitely is, as older non-Army swords generally never have metal scabbards, and the pattern of the sword guard (tsuba) is also pretty standard for that period. The first one is a bit trickier -- the leather wrap may be improvised, and it appears the guard is missing, so I'd need to have a closer look. What's really going to be the big factor for both is whether they're machine- or hand-made blades. If they're hand-made, the tang (the part that fits into the grip) will have the maker's name etched into the steel. If it's blank it's probably factory-made. You also want to take a close look at the steel just above the edge. You want to see a wavy tempering line (called a hamon). It's kind of like Damascene, but unique to Samurai swords. It's definitely important that the sword has that.

If these are factory blades, the swords are probably worth $300-$500 a piece on eBay; if they're older they could be worth a LOT more.

Congrats again!!!

Cheers,
Brendan

The samuri swords that people consider the wavy lines make it appear to be damascus looking. The (hamon) is formed when the sword maker heats, hammers, and pounds the sword to submission and in the last final shaping of the sword the maker will take the sword and coat the back of the blade with clay and some streaking lines toward the edges of the blade and not putting any too close to the edge. Then the maker puts the sword back into the fire to temper the blade, immediately when he takes the sword out of the fire he submurges it in water. Then he sharpens and pollishes the blade. With the purpose of the clay is to make the back of the blade soft and flexable so as not to break when striking objects, thus leaving the edge with razor sharp hardness to take a beating. When the sword is polished the clay has left the streaking discoloration on the blade, (hence the wavy patterns). The one sword you have in the leather sheath with what appears to be the (Tsuba) some of the older samuri swords have very small ones put on for the certain "warrior" the sword was made for. I bet the one with the leather scabbord was probably made before the 1900's. But don't be too hasty to sell them as of yet. Get someone who has knowledge on actient Chinese and Japanese art and weaponry, (someone with a masters degree at least) not juust someone who can give you some guessing game numbers. Now the one with the metal scabbord could possibley still net you almost a grand. But the leather scabbord one I am sure you could get a more valued estimation on it.

If they were mine, I would hand them down to my children adn not sell them, but each to his own. My dad also had some valueable guns and needless to say when he passed my younger brother got some of his guns, and did so my other brother, (I was in the Army, (I still am), and I was the last one home) this was in 2000. It took my brother almost getting killed in a motorcycle accident to find most of the guns in his locked room that mom didn't know about. I am still working on my orer brother ex-wife who has the rest of them!

Good find on your treasure and good luck

 

[Michellets]

Wow, congrats on the relics. Just so you know I had an uncle that passed away suddenly. He had no children and lived alone for most of his life. When my father and I went there, I started looking around. Above the doors in closets... stock certificates taped to the wall, under cushions, in cushions, rugs, and in hidden drawers, just about everywhere there were valuables and such stashed. The best relic I found was a hidden Elgin gold 24k watch hidden in a secret drawer. Make sure you Look, look, and then look more......hh

 

[prolab69]

im no expert, and not sure on the spelling, but the small blade looks like a bouie knife from the phillipines.

good score
HH
Pro-

 

[EDDE]

somebody get me a diaper

LOVE the bone/ivory handle Gurkha Khukuri blade

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khukuri

 

[Kas]

My new house has one of those in the closet. Just an access door to the crawl space. Since the flooring is plywood, as you can see by leftover drywall mud dried on the floor this area was obviously remodeled recently if this is an old house. Appears to be new door casings in your picture as well, not consistant with older structures. Someones stash of arms? Curious that they would put them in a cold and damp crawl space.

 

[BlackX]

Wow! Nice war souvenirs!

BANNER!

 

[Bavaria Mike]

Awesome story and picture post! I do not know anything about swords other than they are interesting and I want to find one. The bayonet does look to be mid to later 1800s, could be CW as suggested, it can surely be positively IDed, just need to see any marks on it. I would personally keep everything but have them evaluated and priced, they will only go up in price, much like an investment. Keep us informed and HH, Mike

 

[Ken from Atlanta]

What is the full mark on the back of the blade? The more I look the more I think it may not be a third reich dagger, the hunting association existed before the nazi era, and is still around today.

there are few markings that i only can see... is Solingen, Germany and Hirschfanger and Rosch... um? let me know

Still no luck finding a maker called Rosch. Solingen is the city where it was made. It may be a post war model for export, if it was made for german use I would expect it to not say Germany on it, or if it did to say "Deutschland" instead. You might want to take some detailed photos and send them to the site I posted earlier.

 

[zerohypert]

uh seems like uncle had good taste -- those items are worth a nice bit --- even if machine made the japanese swords are at least $500 each and if the are true hand made older swords of the folded into itself metal type design they could be very very valuible indeed-- the german "boar" hunting blade is very valuible also --- you really stumbled into a nice bit of luck --- look very , very carefully all over the place -- including inside the electrical switch plate boxes -- often a "dummy" electrical box with a face plate was used as a jewelery stash spot to thwart crooks -- there are many other tricks and tips to finding "hidden" spaces ---measure the distances -- if the outside room measurement is 11 ft long and the inside is 10 ft 6 in --theres a 6in dead space "hollow" in the wall ---that can be used as a hiding spot .

well it was upstair in the closet... so it does get cold up there because this house have 2 separate heaters and AC centrals.. one for first floor and second floor.. both of my aunt and uncle couldnt go upstair anymore because they were really old. I dont think it was damp at all but it does get cold and hot during winter and summer. I do know a fact that damp does a lot of damaging I plan to look more.. so far I found two places and i plan to break down the walls during remodel.. that's later on.. dont worry I'll keep it updated

 

[zerohypert]

Still no luck finding a maker called Rosch. Solingen is the city where it was made. It may be a post war model for export, if it was made for german use I would expect it to not say Germany on it, or if it did to say "Deutschland" instead. You might want to take some detailed photos and send them to the site I posted earlier.
[/quote]

Here are large resolution pictures.. 2 MB each to see more details and guys... I am going over to my house and take the pictures again on the japenese swords and check to see if there are many lines!

http://www.zerohyper.com/temp/DSC00796.JPG
http://www.zerohyper.com/temp/DSC00797.JPG
http://www.zerohyper.com/temp/DSC00798.JPG

Hope it shows you more details

 

[zerohypert]

im no expert, and not sure on the spelling, but the small blade looks like a bouie knife from the phillipines.

good score
HH
Pro-

My great uncle told me that he was once stationed at phillipines for a short while... he said there was a lot of boobies there haha

 

[Nana40]

Looks like some awesome finds!! Keep looking! Not telling what's hidden where!

Nana

 

[Ken from Atlanta]

You also might want to post pics on this forum http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/ this is where the experts on these things are lurking. someone there will be able to either tell you exactly what you have, or point you in the direction of someone who can. You may have to register to post but it's free.

 

[Montana Jim]

Be carefull when trusting local dealers...

Don't sell them to the first person who makes an offer!

AWESOME finds!!!!!!!!

 

[alexndad]

Absolutely Incredible........