DOC NOSS-Victorio Peak OR The Caballo Mountains

[Not Peralta]

You guys are great at getting into a story, theres more, look at the story when it first come to light,who made contradicting statements to the story that was being put out,and then never being heard of again,remember, the ranch helpers? there were several ranches.np

 

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[gollum]

And what do you make of this from the Las Cruces Sun News, October 10, 1940? (Note place of discovery)

View attachment 1072919View attachment 1072920

Its well known (in the ONFP crowd) that at the time, in order to avoid a million people stampeding around VP, Doc and Benny agreed to tell anybody that asked, that Benny had found the armor in the Caballos. Its even in The Gold House Books. If anybody is interested in the VP Story, it would serve them well to get those books. Even though I got the books to read pre-release, I bought a set as soon as they became available. Between John Clarence (pen name) and Tom Whittle, they are the MOST documented and researched works EVER done on the story.

Mike

 

[johnmark29020]

Its well known (in the ONFP crowd) that at the time, in order to avoid a million people stampeding around VP, Doc and Benny agreed to tell anybody that asked, that Benny had found the armor in the Caballos. Its even in The Gold House Books. If anybody is interested in the VP Story, it would serve them well to get those books. Even though I got the books to read pre-release, I bought a set as soon as they became available. Between John Clarence (pen name) and Tom Whittle, they are the MOST documented and researched works EVER done on the story.

Mike

Where at the books being sold. Can you post a link. I haven't been able to find them.

 

[sdcfia]

Its well known (in the ONFP crowd) that at the time, in order to avoid a million people stampeding around VP, Doc and Benny agreed to tell anybody that asked, that Benny had found the armor in the Caballos. Its even in The Gold House Books. If anybody is interested in the VP Story, it would serve them well to get those books. Even though I got the books to read pre-release, I bought a set as soon as they became available. Between John Clarence (pen name) and Tom Whittle, they are the MOST documented and researched works EVER done on the story.

Mike

Who in the "ONFP crowd" was on the scene in 1940 (or earlier), and how can they verify that allegation? Was it something Doc told Ova? Also, when and why did Benny change his tune about the armor?

I am curious about book one of the trilogy and have ordered it. I have the James, Chandler and Koury books, all of which I have mixed opinions of. The James book may be the most useful of the three.

By the way, what do you make of that 1950s GI's statements back on post #644?

 

[UncleMatt]

Thanks for clearing that up Mike! I guess I need to buy the books and read them before conjecturing further.

 

[gollum]

Thanks for clearing that up Mike! I guess I need to buy the books and read them before conjecturing further.

You should be able to buy the books through the website at:

VICTORIO PEAK

If you have any problems, let me know. I should be able to get them directly from John if we have to.

SDCFIA,

Part of the deal with Doc giving Benny the gold bar and the Armor was that Benny had to agree not to give details at the time and say he found the armor in the Caballos. Maybe after Doc was murdered, there was no need to keep up the story. I get information from several sources. One of which is one of the authors of The Gold House Books. He spent six or more years living in the area. He interviewed everybody involved and their family members. He interviewed state police, local police, CIA, and various government agencies. While I don't want this to look like an ad for the books, they are far more than just about Willie, Doc, and Ova, and the finding of VP. Here is John explaining the three books:



I guess if you are only looking at this story in the timeline until Doc was murdered, then you might think that there is a possibility that there was no treasure at VP. If you read all the books and see what happened long after Doc died, then there is a WHOLE lot more to this story.

One of the most amazing things, that happened a lot by accident were the revelations that came from a dumpster. When John tracked down the widow of a CIA Agent that had been involved with VP under several names at different times, he found that the agent had left a bunch of files. He found that the widow asked her caregiver to throw some in the dumpster behind the home. He spoke to the caregiver, and asker her to get those files and save them for him. In those files were everything from truck bills of lading to refinery receipts and all kinds of other evidence showing how much was actually retrieved from VP.

See Roger Snow kept using the name Joe Batson, but that wasn't the guy. I will have to check the first name, but I think his last name was Church.

Mike

 

[UncleMatt]

Can I borrow those files? I promise to get them right back to you!

 

[sdcfia]

<cut>
SDCFIA,

Part of the deal with Doc giving Benny the gold bar and the Armor was that Benny had to agree not to give details at the time and say he found the armor in the Caballos. Maybe after Doc was murdered, there was no need to keep up the story. <cut>

Mike

Well, I guess that makes Benny a liar too, either sooner or later.

Again, what about that GI's statement concerning the Fiege cave, where the GI, Swanner and apparently many others left grafitti before the 100 bars of gold allegedly appeared in 1958?

 

[johnmark29020]

There was either a in search of or unsolved mystery that told the story.
Ill see if I can find it on line and post a link.
Heres a question. Is there supposed to be more than one entrance.

 

[gollum]

There was either a in search of or unsolved mystery that told the story.
Ill see if I can find it on line and post a link.
Heres a question. Is there supposed to be more than one entrance.

It was Unsolved Mysteries

The Fiege cave and the cave that Swanner Sooted his name in were two different caves. That was how Capt Fiege said that his find did not belong to the Noss', because Noss never mentioned the second cave in all the years he worked VP.


Mike

 

[johnmark29020]

The story I read about noss. He was hideing his treasure in the desert. It also said he went to Arizona to sell gold on the black market. Are there any rumors of him hiding gold im AZ.
The reason I ask. One of the maps np posted. Is identical to a location I found near globe. Im wondering if the source of the map was noss,or if my location is tied in to the documents noss was said to have found. I have been trying to get a archeological search put together,but so far no success.

 

[txtea]

I think that map led to the Apache Gold casino near Globe. See if your archy team can locate all the money I lost there.....

 

[johnmark29020]

I think that map led to the Apache Gold casino near Globe. See if your archy team can locate all the money I lost there.....

Sorry no team,but Id like to get back the money I lost too.

 

[vor]

That isn't going to happen. Those fooled by the con will never recognize the truth.
You have to be objective and consider that all points of view carry equal weight.
And your "facts" are only your opinion until you can cite proof positive.
Haven't seen that though....just loud mouth conjecture.
No "proof" exist of gold bars or jewels. But we can hawk books about it I guess.
HH
V

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

G'd morning Vor, Coffee? join me. You posted -- And your "facts" are only your opinion until you can cite proof positive.

And just what would be proof positive ?

 

[gollum]

That isn't going to happen. Those fooled by the con will never recognize the truth.
You have to be objective and consider that all points of view carry equal weight.
And your "facts" are only your opinion until you can cite proof positive.
Haven't seen that though....just loud mouth conjecture.
No "proof" exist of gold bars or jewels. But we can hawk books about it I guess.
HH
V

If you are so certain of YOUR truths, then why are you posting in a thread that is centered on whether Noss found his treasure in the San Andres or the Caballo Mountains?

Mike

 

[vor]

If you are so certain of YOUR truths, then why are you posting in a thread that is centered on whether Noss found his treasure in the San Andres or the Caballo Mountains? Other than maybe you just being a troll?

Mike

Better a troll than a gullible wannabe I guess.

I like the story. Would love to see the "evidence".

A lot of folks take one person's story to be true but there are a lot of reasons people say what they say. Doesn't mean a mountain of gold though.

HH to you and the flock.

G'd morning Vor, Coffee? join me. You posted -- And your "facts" are only your opinion until you can cite proof positive.

And just what would be proof positive ?

Thanks Real, but will take a raincheck at this time. Decaf doesn't suit me.

That's hard to say as it depends on the source and the circumstance. Maybe something verified by two independent sources. Maybe photos and testimony by someone without an interest.

But it will stand out if it surfaces. Just too many folks with an interest in the outcome being quoted. Sure, we all want it to be true but reality is sometimes cruel.

Best to you...will be taking you up on that cup in the future.

V

 

[gollum]

Better a troll than a gullible wannabe I guess.

I like the story. Would love to see the "evidence".

A lot of folks take one person's story to be true but there are a lot of reasons people say what they say. Doesn't mean a mountain of gold though.

HH to you and the flock.



Thanks Real, but will take a raincheck at this time. Decaf doesn't suit me.

That's hard to say as it depends on the source and the circumstance. Maybe something verified by two independent sources. Maybe photos and testimony by someone without an interest.

But it will stand out if it surfaces. Just too many folks with an interest in the outcome being quoted. Sure, we all want it to be true but reality is sometimes cruel.

Best to you...will be taking you up on that cup in the future.

V

Proof Positive To You = Two independent sources? Okay, how about the five cowboys on the Holden Ranch that Willie Doughit walked up to and dropped a dore bar at their feet after they teased him about finding his cave?

Maybe the ten gold bars that Tony Jolley found (after helping Doc rebury 110) and sold to buy the ranch (he paid cash for) and willed to his son?

Maybe the $3.5 million dollar estate left buy Lawrence Foreman/Willie Doughit when he died? And the million cash his girlfriend stole from his house?

............. and its a lot more than one person's story. Everybody that worked with the Noss' during the late 1930s and early 1940s saw treasure come out of the top of VP. Benny Samaniego and Jose Serafin Sedillo saw the gold and treasures, while Benny was the only one Doc let go all the way in. Benny admitted seeing the treasure and the skeletons staked to the cave floor. Benny paid cash for his house from the proceeds of selling a gold bar Doc gave him for his help at VP. Fiege and Berlette both passed polygraph tests regarding the cave on VP that contained piles of gold bricks. Fiege stated in the 60 Minutes Interview that he knew they were gold because he personally handled the bars. And on, and on, and on.

Take Care - Mike

 

[vor]

Proof Positive To You = Two independent sources? Okay, how about the five cowboys on the Holden ranch that Willie Doughit walked up to and dropped a dore bar at their feet after they teased him about finding his cave?

ES to you!

Mike

Hello Mike
Thanks for the civil reply.
Sure.....Have the five cowboys independently quoted? Of just an account of it by one person?
V

 

[gollum]

Hello Mike
Thanks for the civil reply.
Sure.....Have the five cowboys independently quoted? Of just an account of it by one person?
V

Okay, I'll tell you what. You stop trolling comments, and I will be civil. I will even go back and erase my negative comments to you. How about that?

Before posting statements, please learn a thing or two about the subject. While there may be cause to question where Doc's Gold originated, there is really no question that he had access to large amounts of it. Sa,e can be said for Willie Doughit/Lawrence Foreman. It is entirely possible that he murdered a young guy that had the maps that led to his cave, and it is just as possible that he found them himself. Newspaper articles of the day recounted the story of his dropping the bar in front of the cowboys. Mr Holden (ranch owner) recounted the story himself to one paper.

Mike