DOC NOSS-Victorio Peak OR The Caballo Mountains

[motel6.5]

I guess I am not done yet, as other clues I would look for on top of the ground are, mounds of dirt that seem frozen in time {excavation from the tunnels} and there must have been a fresh water spring/artisian,which I think was made into a well possibly lined with rocks a few feet down, with a cap rock on top...The tools they used are most likely buried or stashed in one of the caves,maybe where the engraveing are...and 1 more thingy, I may show up there to do my own searches and I am a friendly snake.

 

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[UncleMatt]

yesterdays find:



Your photo looks remarkably similar to a photo taken by Doc Noss of a similar ladder in a shaft. You can see two "rungs" that are just about identical, the second and third from the top. I tried to rotate them to the same orientation, but didn't pull it off.

 

[UncleMatt]

View attachment 1509513

Ah yes, I know this pit.

View attachment 1510831

 

[Ditlihi]

yesterdays find:

View attachment 1510824

Your photo looks remarkably similar to a photo taken by Doc Noss of a similar ladder in a shaft. You can see two "rungs" that are just about identical, the second and third from the top. I tried to rotate them to the same orientation, but didn't pull it off.

View attachment 1510826

It is identical, it's the same shot from slightly different angle.

 

[UncleMatt]

Thanks for rotating the black & white photo, for some reason I wasn't able to get it to stick when I uploaded it. Either WR photographed the same ladder as Doc, or something else is going on.

 

[markmar]

In Noss picture , the ladder is in another place ( the two lines from WR pic )

 

[motel6.5]

If you enlarge WR:s photo you can see where the ropes have been cut loose at the top,and other ropes relashed further down. I think it is the same location.Opinion only.

 

[UncleMatt]

I would LOVE to take some samples from this ladder for tree ring dating...

 

[UncleMatt]

WR, any thoughts or comments on this photo situation?

 

[dog the treasure hunter]

I like the Dragon/ Snake head on the ladder in the noss photo,and the spines on the back = the steps. Aztec /Mayan culture. It would be hard to find a tree with that long of a trunk now. I never see them in the desert mountains where iam at. Great photos, thanks for posting them.View attachment 1511060

 

[whiskeyrat]

WR, any thoughts or comments on this photo situation?

Very interesting observations by all.
It does seem that the "single rung ladder" has been moved slightly in its location.
However, I have no doubt it is the same ladder.

To photograph this ladder is more difficult than one might think.
You are standing astride the crack with your feet ready to slip into the crack.
You need to extend your arms outward just to get the camera to aim back toward the ladder.
If you step forward, you risk falling into the crack.
When you approach the crack, you do not even see the ladder.
You could stand at the start of the crack, look down and not even see the ladder.
Only when you lean out and walk out over the crack does the ladder come into view.
And at that point, you are fighting falling into the crack.
Also, this day there was a very large bat that had hit me in the chest once, flying at my face, very disturbed that i was there.
So my pics where taken as I was dodging this very large bat.


I have no doubt this is the same ladder that Doc photographed.

 

[whiskeyrat]

Some close up observations of the "single rung ladder" that do not show in the pictures.
this ladder is not a single tree trunk with steps carved from or attached to.
It is actually two long tree trunks about 2 to 3 inches in diameter and about 25 feet long.
the steps are made from tree limbs about 4 or 5 inches in diameter cut to 12 inch lengths.
these steps were then wired (as in about .050 inch diameter steel diameter wire) used to lash the steps to the 2 main beams.

So, these steps were not attached with "sinew" from deer legs etc, or carved into a single tree trunk, they were attached with modern? (perhaps 1850 or later), steel wire.

So, this ladder is actually two main beams, with short limbs as steps, wired onto it. Any time after 1850, this could have occurred My opinion only.

Still very cool, but not 1600 or 1700 spanish or indian stuff

 

[whiskeyrat]

Here are some "close up" pics showing the wire attachment of rungs to the 2 main beams.



wr

 

[whiskeyrat]

yesterdays find:

View attachment 1510824

Your photo looks remarkably similar to a photo taken by Doc Noss of a similar ladder in a shaft. You can see two "rungs" that are just about identical, the second and third from the top. I tried to rotate them to the same orientation, but didn't pull it off.

View attachment 1510826

In this photo, i can guarantee, that the person whos feet is showing (susposedly Doc) did not take the pic. his arms are not that long.
To take this pic, someone else had to be straddling the crack looking back toward Doc's feet.
This ladder is very hidden as you walk up to the crack. you need to lean way out forward, over the crack, before you even see the ladder.
then you must straddle the crack and risk walking out to photo the ladder which is hidden back under the ridge of the crack.

 

[whiskeyrat]

I like the Dragon/ Snake head on the ladder in the noss photo,and the spines on the back = the steps. Aztec /Mayan culture. It would be hard to find a tree with that long of a trunk now. I never see them in the desert mountains where iam at. Great photos, thanks for posting them.View attachment 1511060

Its actually two smaller tree trunks about 2 or 3 inches in diameter, with the steps lashed between them. Only one tree truck extends above the edge, giving the illusion that its only 1 tree trunk. The other tree trunk ends in the dirt and does not show.
wr

 

[dog the treasure hunter]

Its actually two smaller tree trunks about 2 or 3 inches in diameter, with the steps lashed between them. Only one tree truck extends above the edge, giving the illusion that its only 1 tree trunk. The other tree trunk ends in the dirt and does not show.
wr

Thanks for that info. Whiskeyrat. Its a very interesting design for sure. Kinda reminds me of the single pole design.View attachment 1511256

 

[motel6.5]

My thoughts only In attachment 1510826 there are 2 different sets of foot ware, 1boot and 1 loafer , so Doc had a helper with him. I do see what looks like old coiled ropes used to lash the steps. The ladder itself could have been re-lashed many years/or times after it was 1st made. I am in agreement with Dog/TH,that Ladder is extremely old and possibly Mayan or Aztec made...The beginning of the ladder does resemble a dragon/or snake , which would coinside with the ridged type steps on the downside.

 

[UncleMatt]

While there may be wire on this ladder now, we have no way of knowing if it was originally made with wire, or reinforced with wire after it was found. We need to acquire samples from it and have them dated. I have experts in dendrochrnology who can do this for us, but I need a sample that shows the growth rings. Like a crosscut of one of the pieces of wood.


And sorry, but that is just the end of one of the vertical poles, its not a snake head.

 

[motel6.5]

Those are huge long logs used as the base of the ladder, must weigh in at least over 2000/lbs/each,must of taken a lot of people to set them up...I wonder if their petrified, and what is at the bottom that is so important. WR,can you get a samle of the logs for U.Matt.inquireing minds want to know more.

 

[UncleMatt]

I doubt they are that heavy, they are not large in diameter at all