Joe hunter
Bronze Member
- Mar 2, 2013
- 2,159
- 1,896
- Detector(s) used
- Xp Deus ,
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Not sure but I think I found a piece of cannon.It was half way up a very steep hill.
Cannon ?
- Thread starter Joe hunter
- Start date
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Well I will await those... if any... possible picture posts.
Further pieces... if any... to the puzzle may or may not help... but...
more is more regardless.
Especially if it may offer more to a "solve".
This is yet to be seen.
Upvote
0
- May 9, 2012
- 23,965
- 81,318
- Primary Interest:
- Other
Only feels of ideas.
Field cannon. 1700' s. But what was the original source and design?
My portable device limits my limited exploring but ..larger French had an example of near similar muzzle on one.
1700' s field cannon muzzle design - Google Search
Sorry ,those skills of mine showing again....The picture of three cannons drawn. Center cannon.
Upvote
0
- May 9, 2012
- 23,965
- 81,318
- Primary Interest:
- Other
Ohh boy. Now the wheels are creaking.
The muzzle looks more like a mortar ,but length from my poor estimation is greater....so , could it be a howitzer?
Would have been easier to get it uphill than a cannon.
The muzzle looks more like a mortar ,but length from my poor estimation is greater....so , could it be a howitzer?
Would have been easier to get it uphill than a cannon.
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
It has a howitzer "look" to some degree.
Upvote
0
Dug
Bronze Member
- Feb 18, 2013
- 1,138
- 1,264
- Detector(s) used
- XP Deus/Sovereign GT.
- Primary Interest:
- Relic Hunting
What bore size were rail guns?
Quite some time ago I dug two pieces of what I suspect are one (one piece has the trunion attached) and they appear to be about 2" which led me to believe they were a rail gun. I do not want to post pics as it would appear that I'm hijacking the thread, just curious if OP's post is possibly a rail gun?
Quite some time ago I dug two pieces of what I suspect are one (one piece has the trunion attached) and they appear to be about 2" which led me to believe they were a rail gun. I do not want to post pics as it would appear that I'm hijacking the thread, just curious if OP's post is possibly a rail gun?
Last edited:
Upvote
0
OP
OP
Joe hunter
Bronze Member
- Mar 2, 2013
- 2,159
- 1,896
- Detector(s) used
- Xp Deus ,
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
- Thread starter
- #47
I was wondering about swivel cannons as well.I don't think teenagers would bring things along to break the cannon or explode it with enough force for this fragment to be alone where I found it.When I go back up I'll get more photos so you can see the lay of the land.
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
I did a brief look on swivels... no matches thus far.
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Actually was one of the first searches I did.
Due to size.
Due to size.
Upvote
0
cw0909
Silver Member
- Dec 24, 2006
- 4,378
- 3,237
- Primary Interest:
- Other
french search, use your browser translator
for some reason the search link doesnt work
you may have to search, cannon, then select choices from list on left
https://www.photo.rmn.fr/CorexDoc/RMN/Media/TR4_MD5/3/b/6/3/06-522015.jpg
https://www.photo.rmn.fr/CS.aspx?VP...&VBID=2CO5PCHCVP1YJ&SMLS=1&RW=911&RH=452&PN=3
for some reason the search link doesnt work
you may have to search, cannon, then select choices from list on left
https://www.photo.rmn.fr/CorexDoc/RMN/Media/TR4_MD5/3/b/6/3/06-522015.jpg
https://www.photo.rmn.fr/CS.aspx?VP...&VBID=2CO5PCHCVP1YJ&SMLS=1&RW=911&RH=452&PN=3
Last edited:
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
I see no match.
Upvote
0
TheCannonballGuy
Gold Member
- Feb 24, 2006
- 6,596
- 13,383
- Detector(s) used
- White's 6000, Nautilus DMC-1, Minelab
- Primary Interest:
- Relic Hunting
I'm sticking to my guns 
that this cannon fragment is from a Colonial-Era Military Field cannon. First... noting that we have somewhat less than half of the barrel's diameter, I estimate from the photo that this cannon's thickness just AFT of the much wider muzzle-swell is at least 6 inches, with a bore diameter of slightly over 2 inches (being a 1-Pounder caliber cannon). Being so thick (6-inches) at the muzzle end (which is typically somewhat smaller than the breech end), that is one honkin' heavy-bodied cannon barrel. No "signal gun" nor swivel gun nor lawn-ornament cannon I've ever seen is so heavy-bodied for its caliber (bore diameter).
In the Colonial Era, ironcasting of very large objects (weighing hundreds of pounds) was still a very inexact, crude science. Large cast-iron cannons typically contained large casting-flaw airbubbles inside the iron, which caused weakness when the iron was subjected to the massive blast of firing the heavy iron cannonball. That is why bronze was preferred over iron for cannons in the Colonial Era. Military shipwrecks from that time typically contain mostly bronze cannons. To compensate for the known weakness of cast-iron, cannons made from that metal were deliberately cast with an extra-thick body in comparison to bronze cannons of the same caliber.
Advances in the science of heavy metal casting in the early 1800s allowed cannons to be manufactured lighter than their heavy ancestors. This is why the famous 12-Pounder Napoleon cannon of American civil war fame was classified as a "Light 12-Pounder."
About trying to match up the muzzle-swell, fillets, etc... good luck. I will be enormously impressed if anybody can manage to do that. The Colonial Era saw many wars in Europe, and Naval battles in the Caribbean, etc. The Colonial Powers (Britain, France, Spain, even the Netherlands and Denmark) frequently captured cannons from their enemies, and shipped the surplus to their colonies in the Americas. For example, Joe Hunter's cannon fragment could have been captured during the French-&-Indian War, and used by the Americans in the Revolution. It could be a leftover from when New York was a Dutch colony. There is such a staggering variety of European-made (and, Colonist-made) cannons used in the Americas in the Colonial Era, somebody will have to be either extremely skillful or extremely lucky to find a match for this cannon, especially having only the muzzle area to go by. If y'all want to try, I suggest looking for 1-Pounder Colonial Era cannons, European and American. If somebody succeeds, I will publically sing your praises in this forum.
Because I've written so much since my first point, let me repeat it... this cannon, being at least 6-inches thick at the muzzle NOT counting the muzzle swell, in my opinion is too heavy-bodied to be a signal gun, or swivel/rail gun, or lawn-ornament cannon. Cannons which were made to only fire "blanks" (signal guns, lawn-ornament cannons) did not need to be so thick-bodied. Swivel/rail guns were lightweight so they could be mounted on an iron "pin" in the ship's wooden railing.
that this cannon fragment is from a Colonial-Era Military Field cannon. First... noting that we have somewhat less than half of the barrel's diameter, I estimate from the photo that this cannon's thickness just AFT of the much wider muzzle-swell is at least 6 inches, with a bore diameter of slightly over 2 inches (being a 1-Pounder caliber cannon). Being so thick (6-inches) at the muzzle end (which is typically somewhat smaller than the breech end), that is one honkin' heavy-bodied cannon barrel. No "signal gun" nor swivel gun nor lawn-ornament cannon I've ever seen is so heavy-bodied for its caliber (bore diameter).In the Colonial Era, ironcasting of very large objects (weighing hundreds of pounds) was still a very inexact, crude science. Large cast-iron cannons typically contained large casting-flaw airbubbles inside the iron, which caused weakness when the iron was subjected to the massive blast of firing the heavy iron cannonball. That is why bronze was preferred over iron for cannons in the Colonial Era. Military shipwrecks from that time typically contain mostly bronze cannons. To compensate for the known weakness of cast-iron, cannons made from that metal were deliberately cast with an extra-thick body in comparison to bronze cannons of the same caliber.
Advances in the science of heavy metal casting in the early 1800s allowed cannons to be manufactured lighter than their heavy ancestors. This is why the famous 12-Pounder Napoleon cannon of American civil war fame was classified as a "Light 12-Pounder."
About trying to match up the muzzle-swell, fillets, etc... good luck.
I will be enormously impressed if anybody can manage to do that. The Colonial Era saw many wars in Europe, and Naval battles in the Caribbean, etc. The Colonial Powers (Britain, France, Spain, even the Netherlands and Denmark) frequently captured cannons from their enemies, and shipped the surplus to their colonies in the Americas. For example, Joe Hunter's cannon fragment could have been captured during the French-&-Indian War, and used by the Americans in the Revolution. It could be a leftover from when New York was a Dutch colony. There is such a staggering variety of European-made (and, Colonist-made) cannons used in the Americas in the Colonial Era, somebody will have to be either extremely skillful or extremely lucky to find a match for this cannon, especially having only the muzzle area to go by. If y'all want to try, I suggest looking for 1-Pounder Colonial Era cannons, European and American. If somebody succeeds, I will publically sing your praises in this forum. Because I've written so much since my first point, let me repeat it... this cannon, being at least 6-inches thick at the muzzle NOT counting the muzzle swell, in my opinion is too heavy-bodied to be a signal gun, or swivel/rail gun, or lawn-ornament cannon. Cannons which were made to only fire "blanks" (signal guns, lawn-ornament cannons) did not need to be so thick-bodied. Swivel/rail guns were lightweight so they could be mounted on an iron "pin" in the ship's wooden railing.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
NOLA_Ken
Gold Member
- Jan 4, 2011
- 5,214
- 4,179
- Detector(s) used
- several, mostly Garrett
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
I know mainly 20th Century artillery, but that definitely looks like a cannon barrel fragment, and the thickness of the walls says it was meant to take the pressure of firing a projectile. The big problem I see in making an ID on it is that at the time cannon were not just a military weapon, merchant ships had privately owned and purchased cannon, as well as private companies settling or trading on the frontiers. Those cannon came from all over Europe. If there was a battle in that location, it could have been pressed into service from almost anywhere. The first step is to look for a reason why a cannon might have been there in the first place, and keep in mind it could go back to some small French Indian War skirmish even. I'd spend some time talking to local historians....
Without giving up the location, you said it was found on a hill, is there a road at the bottom? A hill or field on the other side? I'm just thinking of where other fragments might be if there are any. My thought is that if it blew near the muzzle, the carriage and breech probably stayed pretty much where they were and would have been hauled off long ago, but there's a good chance other pieces of the muzzle could still be there, but just in the opposite direction from where this one ended up. If there's a field there, there is a good chance that any big fragments would have been turned up by plows over the years and could have been dumped with rocks along the field boundary.
Without giving up the location, you said it was found on a hill, is there a road at the bottom? A hill or field on the other side? I'm just thinking of where other fragments might be if there are any. My thought is that if it blew near the muzzle, the carriage and breech probably stayed pretty much where they were and would have been hauled off long ago, but there's a good chance other pieces of the muzzle could still be there, but just in the opposite direction from where this one ended up. If there's a field there, there is a good chance that any big fragments would have been turned up by plows over the years and could have been dumped with rocks along the field boundary.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Ok folks...
Now we have a mystery and a "challenge"
"Theory must never contradict empirical fact" - Einstein
em·pir·i·cal
adjective: empirical
based on, concerned with, or verifiable by observation or experience rather than theory or pure logic.
"they provided considerable empirical evidence to support their argument"
Now we have a mystery and a "challenge"
"Theory must never contradict empirical fact" - Einstein
em·pir·i·cal
adjective: empirical
based on, concerned with, or verifiable by observation or experience rather than theory or pure logic.
"they provided considerable empirical evidence to support their argument"
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
So lets continue.
Maybe the conclusion / solve of this item awaits.
Maybe the conclusion / solve of this item awaits.
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
FIRST thing at hand...
BIGGER / CLOSER PICTURE(S) PLEASE !
Especially of that "banding".
Detail / macro / close up etc.
Thanks OP.
BIGGER / CLOSER PICTURE(S) PLEASE !
Especially of that "banding".
Detail / macro / close up etc.
Thanks OP.
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
CBG and Nola...
First I will say...
Both of you have my respect as to your knowledge(s).
With that said... perhaps you will now respect mine
First...
I am totally aware of the mass of produced cannon from all reaches of the world...
But one must remember...
Cannon LIKE THIS were produced ONLY in foundries.
MOST Foundries were cash cows... producing everything from kitchen utensils to cannon.
They were important and competitive.
Always looking to make the "next big thing".
But THIS particular item did not follow any traditional design.
My point to this babble is... In essence...
All cannon LIKE THIS are "related" to its predecessor.
In other words... designs did not really "jump" to a severe change.
with that babble babbled...
Like I stated before... there is the remote possibility of this being a "prototype" design.
Hence its / the "failure".
First I will say...
Both of you have my respect as to your knowledge(s).
With that said... perhaps you will now respect mine
First...
I am totally aware of the mass of produced cannon from all reaches of the world...
But one must remember...
Cannon LIKE THIS were produced ONLY in foundries.
MOST Foundries were cash cows... producing everything from kitchen utensils to cannon.
They were important and competitive.
Always looking to make the "next big thing".
But THIS particular item did not follow any traditional design.
My point to this babble is... In essence...
All cannon LIKE THIS are "related" to its predecessor.
In other words... designs did not really "jump" to a severe change.
with that babble babbled...
Like I stated before... there is the remote possibility of this being a "prototype" design.
Hence its / the "failure".
Upvote
0
- Aug 19, 2014
- 38,266
- 139,063
- Detector(s) used
- JW 8X-ML X2-VP 585
- Primary Interest:
- All Treasure Hunting
Oh... forgo this ... might find an interesting read.
Foundry makes replica cannon just for fun | Clarksville Foundry
Foundry makes replica cannon just for fun | Clarksville Foundry
Upvote
0
Top Member Reactions
-
3513 -
2080 -
2011 -
1151 -
1138 -
923 -
840 -
806 -
806 -
777 -
761 -
535 -
515 -
464 -
450 -
422 -
415 -
E
412
-
410 -
406
Users who are viewing this thread
Latest Discussions
-
-
-
It Gets Even Weirder - Strange Witchcraft? Findings While Metal Detecting- Latest: Terry Soloman
-
-
