A GUIDE TO VAULT TREASURE HUNTING (Condensed)

[Crosse De Sign]

Measuring at Treasure Vault sites (condensed)

Renaissance period: Rod for Measuring land

During the Renaissance era, bars were used as standards of length when surveying land. These bars often used a unit of measure called a Rod, of length equal to 5.5 yards, 5.0292 metres, 16.5 feet, or ​1⁄320 of a statute mile.

A rod is the same length as a perch or a pole, and was standardized in 1620 by Edmund Gunter with his Gunter's Chain which is the length of 4 rods or 66 feet.

The rod unit was still in use as a common unit of measurement in the mid-19th century in the United States.

Dividing 16.5 feet (a rod length) by 3 = 5.5 Feet which seems to be the basis for many of the Measurements I have found in the field and could very possible be halved to 2.75 feet.

I have seen 49.5 feet which equals 3 Rods.

They also used 1/2 of a Rod as well which is 8.25 feet, I have seen 41.25 feet which is 2.5 Rods as well as 82.5 feet which equals 5 Rods.

This would also explain why I have ran into so many measurements that 33 inches divided into evenly, because 33 inches is 2.75 feet.

However this would change the numbers considerably, for instance:

82.5 feet is what I had always considered 30 varas because 82.5 feet divided by 2.75 feet or (33 inches) equals 30 (what I thought of as Varas)

But if we look at 82.5 feet measured by the Rod at 16.5 feet per rod we get 5 Rods.
Or we divide (82.5 feet) with 1/3 of a rod (5.5 feet) and we get 15 Rods. And so on.

(The measurements above are very precise in the field)

What is important here is that the only Renaissance era (ancient) Land Measuring Device I could find that aligns with the modern day American Measurements (using our same exact inch) are the Rod and Gunter Chain however they divided them up in ways that we don't use today. As far as I know Absolutely no other measuring device was invented that could be as close to our American measurements before the 1800s and the invention of the engineers chain which could measure down to one foot per link.

I thought I would also throw in how and when these measurements came about for minds that want to know.

In case your wondering why and when the rod became exactly 16.5 feet here is the answer:

The basic concept of the mile originated in Roman times. The Romans used a unit of distance called the mille passum, which literally translated into "a thousand paces." Since each pace was considered to be five Roman feet–which were a bit shorter than our modern feet–the mile ended up being 5,000 Roman feet, or roughly 4,850 of our modern feet.

If the mile originated with 5,000 Roman feet, how did we end up with a mile that is 5,280 feet? Blame the furlong. The furlong wasn't always just an arcane unit of measure that horseracing fans gabbed about; it once had significance as the length of the furrow a team of oxen could plow in a day. In 1592, Parliament set about determining the length of the mile and decided that each one should be made up of eight furlongs. Since a furlong was 660 feet, we ended up with a 5,280-foot mile.

So when we break the Mile down by 8 furlongs of 660 feet each or 1/8 of a mile we get: the Acre. Remember that a furlong was considered to be the length of a furrow a team of oxen could plow in one day without resting. An acre–which gets its name from an Old English word meaning "open field" and over time, the old Saxon inhabitants of England established that this area (an acre) was equivalent to a long, thin strip of land one furlong in length or 1 chain x 10 chains an old unit of length equivalent to 66 feet wide x 660 feet long. That's how we ended up with an acre that's equivalent to 43,560 square feet, and a chain of 66 feet which when broken down becomes the rod of 16.5 feet or 1/4 of a chain.

Measurements are extremely Important as they absolutely verify that we are dealing with man made markers from the 1600s forward and not something older. (its not always easy to tell man made from nature) but measurements are about as good as it gets to tell the difference in the field.

Here is how this particular triangle works: These saguaros were all the same size and alive and well just a few years ago.

First to place you in the right spot, in the picture you would be standing where the red,green and black lines intersect:

Looking down the Red line towards the blue line is 225 degrees on the Compass now looking down the Black line which goes to the crisscross spot (circled in black) we have a compass degree of 294 degrees or 69 degrees off from the 225 Red line, this doesn't sound like much until you realize that the opposite way which is the wider angle between the red line and the Black line (not shown) is actually 111 degrees apart, or 21 degrees off perpendicular which is 7x3 which are Both Holy numbers.
Now for the Blue Line which on the compass is 24 degrees going from the red line to the green line, which again doesn't sound like much until you realize that it is exactly 90 degrees perpendicular to the black line that crosses it which is going to the Crisscross spot.

View attachment 1644159

As far as distance (from the still alive saguaro to the crisscross spot it is 60 feet) I also circled a cactus which aligns with the middle living saguaro to the crisscross spot at 39x3 or 117 feet behind the middle cactus, which all ads up to 177 feet from the back cactus to the crisscross spot.

39 feet is important because of the number 13, and the cactus triangle itself when measured around equals 39 feet as well, this is where the tricky part comes in there is 21 feet missing to the crisscross spot and of course here are the holy numbers again 7x3=21+39=60 feet.

What I am trying to relay here is that they used a fixed set of markers to go so many degrees off from, in this case it was the holy 111 or 21 degrees off perpendicular, that way they did not have the problem with magnetic declination which was a huge problem in those days.

These degrees off are not limited to just triangles.

All very interesting info & deciphering sandy.

 

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[cyzak]

Is there any significance to the main cactus having a right limb.

 

[sandy1]

Is there any significance to the main cactus having a right limb.

No, these were planted in the late 1700s to early 1800s as small probably around a foot tall to mark this kings vault (the sentinels are still planting saguaros at this very spot to this day in order to replace the old or dead ones)

 

[Warpony]

you post about triangle rocks at a public lake rock wall but have no interest on actual caves and discoveries?good luck, looks like your "treasure hunter" methods really doing you some good and found you lots of treasure.

 

[cyzak]

No, these were planted in the late 1700s to early 1800s as small probably around a foot tall to mark this kings vault (the sentinels are still planting saguaros at this very spot to this day in order to replace the old or dead ones)

View attachment 1645605sandy1 were i have the red arrow what does that signify as to the engineering of the site.

 

[sandy1]

View attachment 1645605sandy1 were i have the red arrow what does that signify as to the engineering of the site.

This is the crisscross spot.

 

[cyzak]

It looked like there was some rocks stacked there or laid on the ground were your crisscross is from the photo is what i was looking at.

 

[sandy1]

It looked like there was some rocks stacked there or laid on the ground were your crisscross is from the photo is what i was looking at.

The rocks are what I dug up there.

 

[Warpony]

Your right I did not continue because of a fear of getting stuck it a tight squeeze. I also did not have rope, or much daylight, and nobody knew where I was. I forgot to mention inside the cave was a smooth cedar branch, could be natural but it was 10feet down in a cave on a mountain with no cedars on it. It is Apache country; one cliff wall a mile down the canyon from us is covered in rock art like a canvas. Also at the bottom of the mountain was a beed camp, where I filled my pockets with beeds in 5 minutes, and left hundreds of them on the ground still. I plan to return to this cave when time comes.

 

[Warpony]

Yes

 

[cyzak]

The rocks are what I dug up there.

Ok so this spot is a continuation of a triangle were do you go from there.

 

[cyzak]

Yes

Excellent Southern new mexico has a very vast expanse of unexplored places like what you have found.

 

[Warpony]

Your user picture is from the caballos. Am I correct? Or wrong

 

[cyzak]

No that is from Colorado a Spanish mine we located about 10,500 down south.

 

[sdcfia]

Your right I did not continue because of a fear of getting stuck it a tight squeeze. I also did not have rope, or much daylight, and nobody knew where I was. I forgot to mention inside the cave was a smooth cedar branch, could be natural but it was 10feet down in a cave on a mountain with no cedars on it. It is Apache country; one cliff wall a mile down the canyon from us is covered in rock art like a canvas. Also at the bottom of the mountain was a beed camp, where I filled my pockets with beeds in 5 minutes, and left hundreds of them on the ground still. I plan to return to this cave when time comes.

Sounds like fun - be careful. By the way, the Apache did not create petroglyphs (carvings), but they did occasionally do pictographs (painted or smudged images). If you have carvings, those may have been created in the more distant past, with the Apache using the site later. I suppose there is a reliable water source somewhere nearby.

 

[Warpony]

Thunderbirds and Mules can be mimbres? And the closest existing source is about 4-6 miles away I believe. This question is curiosity not debatful, I am open to learn, but I have always known the art in the area to be Apache? A have a photo of one low quality one I found if curious, but I don’t have any pics of my good ones

 

[sdcfia]

Thunderbirds and Mules can be mimbres? And the closest existing source is about 4-6 miles away I believe. This question is curiosity not debatful, I am open to learn, but I have always known the art in the area to be Apache? A have a photo of one low quality one I found if curious, but I don’t have any pics of my good ones

The origins of rock carvings are debatable. Archeologists have many theories about the past, and I suppose some of them might be correct, such as what the natives used for paint pigments for painting pottery, where they got their obsidian for arrowheads - that sort of thing. When it comes to the age, creators, and meanings of their petroglyphs, all bets are off IMO. If you are in the Mimbres region, then the rock carvings are plentiful and intriguing. They could have come from many different sources, far distant past to fairly recent years and all points in between. Some carvers liked to disguise their work to resemble older stuff. If you're interested in rock art, take high-resolution photos.

Water sources are another tricky subject. As climate changes back and forth in cycles, rainfall, water tables, etc. do too. Springs dry up, they reappear. Remember too, sites such as yours may have been strictly temporary or seasonal and the users may have relied on tinajas to collect water in the rainy season, especially if you're in the lower elevations. If you can find those, they're a great place to find arrowheads, rock art and other artifacts.

 

[Al D]

Sandy, I am a young researcher, who is more interested in uncovering history than uncovering wealth. 2 weeks ago I discovered a cave. Not just a common cave; but one high in cliffs which is only large enough to crawl in. It cannot be seen unless stepped over, being it is in a cubby in the cliff. inside it drops quickly about 8yds before flattening and going straight into the mountain. about 9yds in the cave tunnel drops into what looks to be a room or pit. I did not continue to see down into it. this cave is located about 30 yards above a large cave which can be seen for miles, but the large cave is a quick dead end and only appealing from a distance. Across the canyon from it is a stand space between towering smooth cliff walls, high in the mountain. In this stand space is the perfect cutout of a doorway in the rock, but is solid rock and unmovable; almost like a mockery or false doorway. These cliffs are far from civilization, or human contact. i would like opinion, and possibly feedback on my research which can be provided.
Thank You.

You must check this out, keep us posted if possible

 

[mdog]

I know this is horrible but i can not show a photo of this its a 7 on my site with 3 dots and its carved on top of a flat rock and its 20 feet from a natural spring. I can not show a picture of it unfortunately but i did make a drawing here is what it looks like. Does anybody have any idea what the 3 dots would be on the 7 for. I know i am close to a spring and the 7 goes with that but the 3 dots i can not figure out. View attachment 1643818

You might try this. The three dots could represent three objects and the 7 might be one of them. Measure the two lines and use those numbers to start your search. If the numbers are 5 and three, look out 30 feet then 300 feet. If you find something at 30 feet, look out 50 feet from there. Also, are there two hills that you might have to walk around?

 

[Warpony]

will be a while before return due to health issues, about 2-3 months, but will do.