200 yrs old? Pirate? Native? Or religious? Any hidden meaning? Treasure map?

[Joecoins]

Hello,
I have something real special,
Purchased at a fleamarket in quebec.
It was literaly tangled with a bunch of stuff and i had to cut some other peices to get it loose from the pile.

I need help finding out its purpose and significance.
Please take a look at the photos ,its worth it!
I included a photo with important notes i have made on the peice.
Thanks in advance.
!!!!New and better photos, Beads page 8, Coins pg9.!!!!!
New photos again! Page 11

 

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[HenryWaltonJonesJr]

I wonder if these represent wheat on either side of the cross. Wheat represents the bounty of the earth in Catholicism. Bounty in the Earth could be buried treasure. ; )

 

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[diggummup]

I wonder if these represent wheat on either side of the cross. Wheat represents the bounty of the earth in Catholicism. Bounty in the Earth could be buried treasure. ; )

View attachment 1293430

Yes, already mentioned earlier in the thread.

 

[Metro Retro]

It's such a great looking necklace -- my first impression was that of a very simple milagros, however, I agree with On.Off (post #102) that these are machine cut beads.

If the color is showing 'true' on my monitor, then I would say possibly a brass or more likely a tombac. I don't think that the necklace in its entirety is terribly old (maybe within the last 30 years or so), but comprised of the various vintage/antique components. It's a great score!

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Hello all. What a neat and interesting find. I'm on my celphon on limited data but I tried to read most of it. I would have to agree that the coins show years of being in circulation. Just curious, what are the mint marks on your reales? Also imo the key to identification lies in IDing the brass medallion. It shouldn't be extremely hard to find a match unless its unique but probably not. I will try in a week or so when I get back in town. I dont know how much you paid but i would have bought it too.

 

[Joecoins]

Yes, already mentioned earlier in the thread.

Hi, thanks for your interest,
You probably should have directed your comment to post #143 lol.
Mr henry walter jones junior ,did make an interesting observation i hadnt thought of before, yes i knew it was wheat, but the christian interpretation of bounty in the earth was new to me

 

[Joecoins]

Look close at the bead photos please, all evidently are hand tooled, hand made , all unique patterns, sizes colors. There is no evidence of machine cut.
I am confident the necklace is intact from about 1820s
Made with peices of jewelry that were antique possibly back then in 1820, meaning the beads are potentialy much older than the coins,

Thank you for your interest

 

[Joecoins]

It's such a great looking necklace -- my first impression was that of a very simple milagros, however, I agree with On.Off (post #102) that these are machine cut beads.

If the color is showing 'true' on my monitor, then I would say possibly a brass or more likely a tombac. I don't think that the necklace in its entirety is terribly old (maybe within the last 30 years or so), but comprised of the various vintage/antique components. It's a great score!

***See above

 

[Joecoins]

Hello all. What a neat and interesting find. I'm on my celphon on limited data but I tried to read most of it. I would have to agree that the coins show years of being in circulation. Just curious, what are the mint marks on your reales? Also imo the key to identification lies in IDing the brass medallion. It shouldn't be extremely hard to find a match unless its unique but probably not. I will try in a week or so when I get back in town. I dont know how much you paid but i would have bought it too.

Hi,
I am quite certain the medallion is a unique casting, and not a pattern or technical medal. I appreciate any help if you find something similar.
The coins are from the mints,
1773-potosi
1784-lima
1795-lima
#4=?

 

[Joecoins]

Heres an interesting coincidence?, 1773 = Tea party,
1784= Treaty of Paris, 1795 = treaty of greenville/ treaty of madrid.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Yes it may be a unique casting but it looks familiar and also very worn.. I guess you know it was not unusual for these spanish reales to have holes put in them. They were often strung because people didn't have modern style pockets. So the holes may have already been in the coins before it was strung on the brass beads.

 

[Joecoins]

Yes it may be a unique casting but it looks familiar and also very worn.. I guess you know it was not unusual for these spanish reales to have holes put in them. They were often strung because people didn't have modern style pockets. So the holes may have already been in the coins before it was strung on the brass beads.

Some stuff is a little familiar to it yes...
If you find something very similar please post it that would be amazing.
Ive heard that explenation for the holes before, indeed i have mannny colonial tokens with holes punched.
But i beleive these coins had the holes made when assembled to the necklace.
If you notice the holes are all in the same spot on the coins.

 

[Metro Retro]

Look close at the bead photos please, all evidently are hand tooled, hand made , all unique patterns, sizes colors. There is no evidence of machine cut.
I am confident the necklace is intact from about 1820s
Made with peices of jewelry that were antique possibly back then in 1820, meaning the beads are potentialy much older than the coins,

Thank you for your interest

OK, I see what you're saying JoeCoins and have blown up the images on my screen to see the hand cut beads. Perhaps a curator in South American ethnology can assist?

It is unfortunate that Barry Weber is no longer with us, as he would have been able to properly appraise the piece. I'm sure that this mystery will be solved soon.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

There are tons of religious medals and it can be a daunting task to find a match. It takes a lot of time to scroll through images. Hard to see on my celphon but if the beads are hand fabricated then the medal may also be. Its possible. Just a gut feeling that the dates and mint marks on the reales are random. Post some pics front and back of the unidentified coin. Maybe start a new what is it thread just to get the coin identified. There are people here that can id that coin for sure. I have seen it done here with much less to work with. Don't turn down any clue.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Then again the dates may be birth dates of children or something personal.

 

[relic lover]

I would definitely start a new thread for the mystery coin

 

[cw0909]

joecoins, ive looked and looked for this medal, you would think
there would be a new variation of and old medal, i think it may
be jesuit, it reminds me of the late 1700s early 1800s jesuit trade rings

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Now that i can see it better on my laptop, it does look like the designs on the medal were engraved and/or tool stamped by hand. Its very crudely made with the designs almost childlike or the crucifix is very worn as the craftsmanship from that spanish colonial era was much more detailed. Much of the detail may have worn off. There is no detail visible on the crucifix.

 

[ARC]

I think I said this already btw...

This piece... I would bet hard on it...

IS gun bronze.

Same bronze used to make bronze cannon ... ships bells... ships misc items... and of course... arms.

 

[Joecoins]

Yup it is very worn , even looks like they stamped two large circular eyes on the face wich are also worn
In certain lights i think i see original detail , unless im just seeing things,

 

[Joecoins]

I started a new thread for the mystery coin ,with a few new photos