Pirate Treasure-Trying to get a permit to dig up

[Bigdogdad]

Kentucky Kache-What makes you think I want attention? Just because I come onto the World Wide Web and tell parts of my story. Just because I put links to my websites? Attention? Naw. I'm just bored. Hey, maybe its because I am writing a book that is about treasure hunting that I plan to sell. But don't tell anyone cause I am trying to keep it a secret. Since when did wanting attention become a bad thing? I am turning people? Would that be on or off. If you don't like it don't read it. Judging by the amount of views and replies this thread has generated in a short amount of time makes you wonder, are people tuning in and watching to see what will happen next? Kind of like seeing an approaching train wreck, you just can't help but look. I am a risk-taker. Not skeered. Why have you posted 5578 times on TN? Are you seeking attention or do you just like to hear yourself type? Is that your picture on your profile?

Denniss-metal detecting without a permit is not allowed. Core sampling is against the law. Digging with a backhoe on state land is against the law. Telling your story to the world is socially acceptable and encouraged.

Part of my plan if allowed to dig will be to set it up as a pay-per-view internet based live event. Because there is the distinct possibilty that anything valuable found might be taken away by the powers that be, I am trying to make money off the event. Is there something wrong with my line of thinking?

 

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[ECS]

ROCKY BLUFF TREASURE FOUND IN 1935?

In 1935,an old disdisheveled bum wandered about Miami trying to sell a map of Gaspar's buried treasure for $3000.00.The bum was PABLO SANCHEZ,and claimed he was told the story and location by Johnny Gomez,who claimed to have been 11 years old and live with Gaspar's pirates, when the USS ENTERPRISE blew Gaspar's ship out of the water.
Sanchez eventually found a buyer in RICK COLE,a night clerk at a thirdrate Miami hotel,who paid him $500.00.Cole had an electrical enginner friend,CHARLES R HALE build a "machine" that could detect gold and silver in the ground.
Sanchez then traveled with Cole and Hale to a "rocky bluff on Tampa Bay",where they discovered an assortment of gold coins.

 

[Bigdogdad]

Kentucky Kache-maybe I need to make it a little clearer when I am being sarcastic. I also think you were implying without stating clearly, that I am turning people off including you. If anything about this thread is a turnoff to ANYBODY then don't read it. There are thousands of threads both old/new on TN. People seem to think they can come on here and say anything they want about my integrity and character and I am just supposed to take it like a scolded little boy caught fibbing. I do not have a habit of lying or stretching the truth about anything. Of course I am looking for attention! So what. What were your 1000's upon 1000's of posts for? Why did you write a book?

ECS- Rocky Bluff is a place. We have a Rocky Bluff library and lots of other Rocky Bluff related things here. Dig a little deeper. It can't be that hard.

I tried contacting the Head of all things archaeology for Florida today. She was not available. I left a message for her to please call me back.

I have been asked many questions on here and have always tried to give a prompt and easy to understand reply. When I have asked questions I have rarely gotten an answer. Let me try a couple easy ones again.

What would be some ways that "proof" of a treasures existence could be shown prior to any digging? Core sampling or drilling is considered digging.

Assuming there really were pirates besides the ones at Disney World, where would they have kept their booty on the ship and where would they have kept their booty at a land based camp?

If I claim to have seen dowsing work and it was proven to me, why would someone say that dowsing does not work unless it was proven to them that it doesn't?

Are the majority of people on TN negative and non-believers in caches of treasure or does it just seem that way?

 

[ECS]

EXAMPLE OF A DOCUMENTED WELL KNOWN PIRATE CAMP

In 1818,Capt Henry Ross set up a permanent camp for his pirate,smuggling,and slave trade activities on a small island with a natural lagoon for a harbour in Tampa Bay.Ross's 3 mast schooner had a 5 ft draft,so this was an ideal place to hide.
What began with a few shacks constructed with ship timbers,grew to include a dug well,two storehouse,a fort,and a dock on the lagoon.
Plundering went well for Capt Ross utill 1821,when the USS GRAMPUS,captained by Lt Francis Gregory, caught site of his schooner at Egmont Channel.The GRAMPUS gave chase,and Ross fled to his island refuge,knowing the heavy leaden GRAMPUS could not enter the lagoon.
Gregory ordered a full broadside with the GRAMPUS' 12 and 24 pounders,scored a direct hit on Ross' ship,which sunk straightaway.
Gregory then ordered a landing party to assault the island as the pirates escaped into the mangroves on the island.
The GRAMPUS crew then search the island for treasure,finding none,set fire to the entire encampment.
ROSS ISLAND is north of St Petersburg on Tampa Bay.

 

[ECS]

ANOTHER FLORIDA WEST COAST PIRATE,ANOTHER BURIED TREASURE STORY

LOUIS d'AURY,born 1707 in France,was another pirate who had various temporary camps on Florida's Gulf coast.
It is claimes that between the years of 1740-1755,he buried treasure at several locations.
In a concrete vault on HONERMOON ISLAND,d'Aury placed gold,silver and jewery.
On the north bank of the Pithlachascotte River,he had his crew craft a limestone vault for his booty.
11 chests of gold and silver were buried "in the vicinity of a small spring,located on a SMALL BLUFF,near some oak trees that formed a distinct marker".

 

[lorddean13]

Maybe it is just me but if I am going to nomadic and sail for a living when I make port I wouldn't take my loot off the boat. I would take what I needed and leave the rest on my boat. Especially if I were a hunter and wanted criminal. You never know when you'd have to make a break for it. Then again that's just me.

Sent from my iPhone using TreasureNet

 

[Bigdogdad]

ECS-I feel like your getting close. Egmont Key is one of the places I took Ovid to when I had him on a boat. He had marked a chest on a ridge on a topographical map. I explored around Egmont when I was a teenager. I have said for the last 25 years that the silver was in a hollowed out spot under limestone. Interesting that you mention a "limestone vault". I actually think d'Aury was one of the pirates from Rocky Bluff. If you dig deep enough I know you will come up with references of some silver bars being found at Rocky Bluff. I play dumb sometimes just to see how people react to my "tales".

Lorddean13-I don't doubt what you say is true in some circumstances. But it is a known fact that pirates had base camps that they operated out of as they needed to have a fresh supply of food and water. There was a small creek running through Rocky Bluff. There was also a place just downriver that jutted out. This is where the lookouts would be to watch for the "Feds".

 

[PYRATE]

.......
What would be some ways that "proof" of a treasures existence could be shown prior to any digging? Core sampling or drilling is considered digging.
.......

As I mentioned in an earlier post here, you should invest a small amount of money and rent some ground penetrating radar equipment.

GPR is a legitimate technology used by archaeologists, environmental surveyors, soil engineers and many others experts to determine subsurface conditions prior to turning dirt.

GPR is far cheaper than heavy equipment and will greatly minimize expenses if your pirate cache is indeed a reality as it will pinpoint the exact locations where you should use equipment to turn soil.

It is absurd that I, whose only archaeological experience is hiring people to conduct NHPA studies, should be telling someone who claims to be an expert how to go about conducting an archaeological survey.

me still be thinkin' ye be knowin' nuttin' 'bout pyrates, now me be thinkin' ye be knowin' nary 'bout lookin' fer booty

 

[Bigdogdad]

Kentucky Kache-I know exactly what I am doing. I joined TN in March. Everything has worked out great. I am not the least worried about acceptance. Thank you for your concern and wonderful advice. Just curious, have you ever dug for and found a cache of treasure?

Pyrate-I applied in writing for a permit to do a thorough field survey as this is required by law. My request was denied. I only wanted to do it for the experience and the video. I already know the EXACT location. When this is over we will see who all looks like a fool.

What I hope is treasure may not be. I have the guts and wherewithall to see this through. GPR is highly overrated. I think too many people have watched too many TV shows. It also does not work well into a salty water table. I could have at anytime snuck in and taken a sample of what is there. Most people given the chance, would. I like the suspense. Makes for a better story. The more I am underestimated, the more foolish the detractors will look.

 

[lorddean13]

I have used GPR and they work really well especially when looking for ground layer disturbances. If you need and help with them I do have one.

Sent from my iPhone using TreasureNet

 

[Bigdogdad]

lorddean 13-Thanks for the offer for GPR help.

Kentucky Kache-I try to make this about the pirate silver. I respond to all questions and comments put on here. I went back and EVERY post that you have made on here is about me and not the silver. In fact just about every one is a criticism of some sort. Do you expect me to ignore you? I asked you if you had found treasure because you claimed to have written a book, you have made over 5500 posts, and your profile says cache hunting. Not one of your POSTS on here have been about cache hunting or the title of this thread: PIRATE TREASURE KK-Are you "just a lot of talk"?

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Kentucky Kache-I know exactly what I am doing. I joined TN in March. Everything has worked out great. I am not the least worried about acceptance. Thank you for your concern and wonderful advice. Just curious, have you ever dug for and found a cache of treasure?

Pyrate-I applied in writing for a permit to do a thorough field survey as this is required by law. My request was denied. I only wanted to do it for the experience and the video. I already know the EXACT location. When this is over we will see who all looks like a fool.

What I hope is treasure may not be. I have the guts and wherewithall to see this through. GPR is highly overrated. I think too many people have watched too many TV shows. It also does not work well into a salty water table. I could have at anytime snuck in and taken a sample of what is there. Most people given the chance, would. I like the suspense. Makes for a better story. The more I am underestimated, the more foolish the detractors will look.

I just read this. Why do you need a GPR when you have a dowsing rod and an LRL?

Im sorry Tim, I just couldnt help myself.

 

[ECS]

CAUTION! READING THIS POST MAY PUSH BUTTONS!

I tried contacting the Head of all things archaeology for Florida today. She was not available. I left a message for her to please call me back.

I have been asked many questions on here and have always tried to give a prompt and easy to understand reply. When I have asked questions I have rarely gotten an answer. Let me try a couple easy ones again.

What would be some ways that "proof" of a treasures existence could be shown prior to any digging?

If I claim to have seen dowsing work and it was proven to me, why would someone say that dowsing does not work unless it was proven to them that it doesn't?

"They don't give permits for TREASURE HUNTING"
1.Comprehend what the STATE of FLORIDA is telling you.
"You just don't get it do you?I am cocky.I am an alpha male.I am a real man.I am a treasure hunter."- BIGDOGDAD-SWAMPGOLD #854
2.Lose that braggadocio attitude,and don't mention treasure or Ovid's well marked road atlas and dowsing as "proof".
3.Form an LLC with a title like "ROCKY BLUFF HISTORICAL CAMPSITE RESEARCH & PRESERVATION"
4.Hire a Florida undergraduate archaeology student who needs field work for a thesis to write a historical proposal on the site-including signs of habitation ,ie pottery,utensils,musket balls,potshards,campfire sites,and the possibilty of coins to help date the time periods in the strata.
Detail how the site would be laid out,and how each strata layer would be documented and photographed with items insitu before commencing to the next strata.
5.Submit proposal to the State of Florida for a grant and permit to excavate the ROCKY BLUFF HISTORICAL SITE.

 

[maipenrai]

Good idea from ECS. If every time you call someone and they are not available, you could just be rubbing people the wrong way. ECS has a good idea, try to use it.

 

[lorddean13]

Good idea from ECS. If every time you call someone and they are not available, you could just be rubbing people the wrong way. ECS has a good idea, try to use it.

I agree

Sent from my iPhone using TreasureNet

 

[Bigdogdad]

Okay, I get it. I can definitley irritate people and rub them the wrong way. I do it without tryng and when I try to do it I come across as a real rectum. I am truly sorry for offending anybody. Thanks for any and all advice. I did not come to TN to upset anyone. I am just a little overly sensitive to negativity about my treasure activities. No more about me unless someone specifically asks a question.

It is too late at this point for me to try and pretend I am wanting to do anything at Rocky Bluff other than trying to dig up what I hope is tons of pirate silver bars. I have been convinced that they are there for over 25 years. I have been working construction in SW Florida and sometimes the heat and hard work burns me out. Everytime I pass by Rocky Bluff it causes me a little bit of mental stress because I have not done something to try to dig up the silver.

Now that the story has come out I sometimes have a hard time thinking straight. I have gone back and read some of my prior posts on this and other threads and I am not proud of a lot of things I have said. I would not beleive a word of my story if I hadn't lived it.

The story of the pirate silver is about to be released by the Tampa paper. I have some ideas on how to get the state to work with me on this dig. I know that some of the people with the state do not want to talk to me as my reputation for confrontation has preceded me. The only person that has a chance to look like a fool is me. The odds of the silver being where I hope it is are stacked against me.

I would like a fresh start from here to try to be more civil with EVERYONE. Can we all get along. Are we all not on here because of our passion for treasure hunting? WE all want either fame, fortune or fun. I would like a large helping of each.

 

[Jeffro]

If I claim to have seen dowsing work and it was proven to me, why would someone say that dowsing does not work unless it was proven to them that it doesn't?

Are the majority of people on TN negative and non-believers in caches of treasure or does it just seem that way?

Not non-believers in caches, there have been quite a few posted over the years that are quite fascinating. Non- believers in dowsing and LRL's more often than not.... and that's no reflection on your personal beliefs, just the long timers here have seen every bold statement there is regarding those subjects and very little actual finds.

Sure I see guys dowse for water all the time and they find it. Not so hard to do here in Oregon. Pretty much anywhere you dig a well you will hit water.......

Also the guys who dowse lines for sewer, gas and electric. Mmmmmmm, maybe, maybe not. I know some people that do it frequently and do quite well. OK, fair enough. As has been posted before, if you're in the business long enough, you can pretty much go to any property and "know" subconsciously "about" where the lines are.....

But I have yet to see one verifiable instance where an LRL "machine" has actually located anything. Lots and lots of arguments and fighting and excuses and BS in general...... actually we're pretty much wore out regarding the subject. Been there, done that.

 

[Jeffro]

Just finished catching up on this thread, I replied to a post you had made a day or so ago BDD, then the thread took a turn. For the better it seems!

Look, we are all not being so much negative as we are just a tad skeptical. Again, no reflection on you, we've just seen them come and go quite a bit on here. There are a lot of knowledgeable people on this site. Sometimes a little blow to the ego is necessary to see who's who.

So far my impression of you is one of esteem. You do have the fortitude to see things through. Listen to these people, both positive and negative, and many options may open up for you.

It takes a little getting used to, but we're not a bad crowd all-in-all...

 

[Bigdogdad]

Okay, I am going to try to get back to talking about the pirate silver. I will try to explain what happened. Forgive me if I repeat myself. This thread is too long for me to want to go back and read what I have written.

When Ovid told me over the phone what he could do I was very skeptical. I figured that it would not take long to tell if this whole dowsing thing could work. As I think I mentioned I had been an engineer in the army and had jungle training involving a lot of compass work. A compass will always point to magnetic north which is slightly off from true north. It is very, very reliable and has been used for centuries. I would compare Ovid's use of his pendulum's as if it was his own compass. It was extremely consistent.

On our first day together I had the opportunity to see what would happen if I got him near Rocky Bluff. Without hestitation his pendulum led him from a half mile away, directly to a very specific spot on the ground. Using his other pendulum's, he told me it was silver and drew the outline of the silver cache on the ground. It was roughly the size of a small car. As it was state property I did nothing about it. We had many, many other experiences together and I would watch him as closely as possible and he was able to do amazing things that would prove very convincingly to me that he could do what he said he could.

Fast forward two years. I got the opportunity to meet two guys who claimed they could locate precious metal at a distance. They did not believe in the least in dowsing. I agreed to meet them at Rocky Bluff. I told them I would be off to the side watching them but would not get involved in their electronic survey at the site. They had created their own machine out of a hodgepodge of parts. Microwave oven parts. Radar detector parts. Some sort of military electronic equipment. They had a generator to run it. This was around 1990 or so. They told me that when the generator started and the machine was turned on, everybody in the area's TV's would quit working. This was before cable.

I stood back and watched. They placed a probe in the ground that had a wire attached to a pole that had an arm that swung on ball bearings. When everything was running, they swung the pole in a circle. I watched from behind. They were probably 100 feet from where Ovid had marked the silver. The rod pointed at the silver location as if it was a compass. They placed a flag in the ground well past the silver location and another where they had been standing. They repeated this procedure two more times. They attached strings to each flag. Where the lines interesected was directly over the spot Ovid had marked for silver. They got out another detector that was also built by them and it read non-ferous metal.

I told them this was where Ovid said the pile of silver was. They were convinced something was there. The ground was solid rock. We discussed this a bit. They were not interested in silver. The price of silver was very low in 1990 and they were after some other treasures. We did some more things together at a later date. I saw their machine in action again. I don't know if 100 feet is considered a LRL (long range locator) I have since talked to one of them and he said they had perfected it to a range of miles.

These guys were very scientific about all this. They had leased a piece of property and spent two months with a metal detector clearing it of all metal. They then took turns placing silver or gold in the ground to test each other using the machines as they developed them. They had split up years ago. They did not try to sell the machines. This guy is going to build a new one with the latest and greatest advances in technology that he can incorporate into it.

Fast forward 20 years. I join TN. I told some of my story. The site was confirmed by others to contain a large amount of non-ferrous metal in exactly the same square on the ground. All this right in the middle of an old pirate camp.

I am going to try to convince the state that they cannot afford to ignore this opportunity to enrich the states coffers. Florida is claiming to be short on funds. I came up with the idea today that I want to work with the state on a live pay-per-view internet based dig at this site. I want 50% of the silver and 50% of the funds from the internet site with the est going to the state. This will cost the state NOTHING and I am not asking them to do anything but stay out of the way and watch.

We will have state certified archaelogists on site to insure things are done properly. The first phase will be a test survey with all the electronic equipment that we can utilize. If what I say is there appears to be so, we will regroup and then do a supervised, slow, careful dig down to what is hopefully a pile of silver. With the amount of free press that we could get we could have an audience in the tens of millions. If we charged a couple of bucks to subsrcibe to the website we could posiibly bring in a huge fortune in money. Again, this would cost the state NOTHING. If there is nothing there but junk, so be it. I look the fool, of course, a rich fool.

I don't know why the state officials would turn this down. It could be a win/win situatiuon for all involved. With all the negative press Florida has had with face eating zombies, people shooting each other and lots of other craziness, a treasure dig for pirate silver would be a great distraction. I have an LLC set up for this. I have purchased insurance and filed it with the county. I have registered my video company with the county. I am ready.

So what do you all think? Try to keep it to constructive criticism please.

 

[signal]

BDD,

Let me ask just some critical questions. Why would two people, who invented such a device, meet up with YOU? In other words, they have a device, that would be worth, arguably hundreds of millions of dollars. Its super top secret, and none like it even exists today. But what would even lead someone like that to contact you, meet with you, and why would they feel they needed to prove to you and give you a sample?

And if that is not extraordinary enough (one could argue your life is one extraordinary event after another), you meet Ovid, who seems to have dowsing powers far beyond anyone else. When I say that, I mean, that there is no dowser on this forum, or anywhere, who has demonstrated anywhere near the level of the "craft" that you claim Ovid has. To find someone like that would be remarkable. According to you he had already led Mel Fisher to gold, and likely achieved many other badges of honor, so why sync up with you?

These are just critical thinking questions, please don't take it the wrong way.