Why did Travis Tumlinson Fake the Stone Maps as a Hoax?

[nobodie]

Some people on the forum say things to get a rise out of others, just to keep things going. This is our loss.

 

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[Hal Croves]

Hal,

As I said, I was asked for my opinion if he should just stop posting. My opinion, was yes. It was Ryan's idea and it came out after our conversation got heated, on his part not mine. I don't like being forced into someone else's conclusions, but I don't get angry.

Good luck,

Joe

Who would like it?

I think that your advice was smart for the Tumlinson's sake and gives the research team time to explore their ideas.
My only observation, the Tumlinsons now need their own publicist.

 

[Hal Croves]

No hal I have never met the Tomlinsons nor do I speak for them. And I'm not even sure I agree with everything that is going on in Texas but I'd at least like to have the right to listen to what they have to say and what they are uncovering without you injecting your opinion and throwing jabs. I would say we are all reasonably intelligent adults here on the forum and are perfectly capable of coming to our own conclusions about the "dribble" as you put it. But thanks to you we have been stripped of that right. In the future I would appreciate it if you would let us make our own decisions and if you don't like some of the information and research people post on here then hunt them down and tell them about it. Don't flog them on the forum. Some of us want to hear what they are finding in Texas. Also hal I'm not your father. Buy your own first class ticket to Texas

I think that social media might not be your thing. The idea here is to bat around ideas and opposing views, see how they hold up to scrutiny. What part of that don't you get? Some ideas collapse under their own weight, some hold up. I have been on both sides. Honestly, you should contact Ryan directly or buy yourself a first class ticket to Texas if you are that interested. But remember this, he didn't get shut down, he took his ball and went home.

 

[Weaversneedle]

I think that social media might not be your thing. The idea here is to bat around ideas and opposing views, see how they hold up to scrutiny. What part of that don't you get? Some ideas collapse under their own weight, some hold up. I have been on both sides. Honestly, you should contact Ryan directly or buy yourself a first class ticket to Texas if you are that interested. But remember this, he didn't get shut down, he took his ball and went home.

I don't have to go to Texas . I am perfectly content waiting for the TV show to come out before I scrutinize it and pick it apart. Only an idiot would pick some one's research apart before all the evidence has been brought forth. My opinion of you is you are a control freak and you can't stand it that you have no control over what is going on in Texas. I say it's their project to do with as they please and most of us thought they were doing OK and looked forward to hearing their progress. The only thing I can see they did wrong was to post their findings on a public forum where idiots are allowed to torment hard working researchers

 

[nobodie]

Oh no, you didn't?

 

[Hal Croves]

You might consider finding another hobby while you wait. Insults and personal attacks are never a good thing.

Lets leave it here if you can.

 

[Weaversneedle]

You might consider finding another hobby while you wait. Insults and personal attacks are never a good thing.

Lets leave it here if you can.

Oh I see how it goes around here. You are allowed to belittle, berate, insult and torment but the rest of us aren't. No problem, I'm done

 

[Hal Croves]

Oh I see how it goes around here. You are allowed to belittle, berate, insult and torment but the rest of us aren't. No problem, I'm done

No, I believe in free speech and appreciate honesty. Belittle, berate, insult and torment away if that's your thing. I just see you following the trend of getting banned and inevitably blaming me.

 

[Weaversneedle]

No, I believe in free speech and appreciate honesty. Belittle, berate, insult and torment away if that's your thing. I just see you following the trend of getting banned and inevitably blaming me.

Sounds to me like you are trying to live up to your reputation. I said I was done

 

[Hal Croves]

Sounds to me like you are trying to live up to your reputation. I said I was done

Great.

 

[Old]

Hal wrote.....>>One report suggested that Waltz was a Republican and made a concerted effort to vote. Based on his relationship with Julia, I would gamble to say that this could be correct. <<

If I may double back to this a moment........Hal, this is a departure from your earlier thinking. No??

I though you had a working theory Waltz was somehow involved with Mississippi/Louisiana based Mason Confederates and cohorts under the direction of Albert Pike. Do you think Waltz supported and voted for Abraham Lincoln and not George McClellan? If so, why? Have you ditched one theory for the other or is there some way you reconcile these differences in policy?

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

End it gentlemen or a mod will. Do not bring issues from other forums here.....

 

[Hal Croves]

Hal wrote.....>>One report suggested that Waltz was a Republican and made a concerted effort to vote. Based on his relationship with Julia, I would gamble to say that this could be correct. <<

If I may double back to this a moment........Hal, this is a departure from your earlier thinking. No??

I though you had a working theory Waltz was somehow involved with Mississippi/Louisiana based Mason Confederates and cohorts under the direction of Albert Pike. Do you think Waltz supported and voted for Abraham Lincoln and not George McClellan? If so, why? Have you ditched one theory for the other or is there some way you reconcile these differences in policy?

Hello Old,
No, I never made the connection that Waltz had anything to do with Confederates. Could have but I don't think so. But, if I wrote that, please point it out so I can eat my words and lift some spirits around here. I do think that Confederates hid treasure, there is plenty of evidence for it, even testimony. Was Waltz a Mason? I can not comment on that. What I can tell you is that once Waltz passed, things got very strange and men who were Masons, start becoming involved, more involved in the story. But remember, Freemasonry is not one cohesive body. Look at the history of Mexico, two groups of Masons fighting for control. Same as the war of 1861-65. North vs. South which is not entirely accurate. Can you imaging lodge brothers, West Point classmates, war brothers, suddenly thrown into opposing sides? Lincoln and McClellan were at odds with use of the Union Army. Abe though George was holding back and punished him for it. Lots of opinions on this.

Anyway, I have no clue who Waltz voted for or would have, if he even did. The report of him voting Republican seems to fit his relationship with Julia. What most people don't understand is that there were many black Americans who went to Phoenix after the war. There was even a Phoenix based black lodge. I can't share everything with you right now because its the focus of my research but if you love history, this is it. Will it get you closer to the DLM? No, but it will help us understand what really happened and who was actually involved in this legend.

Julia and one of the most successful businessmen in Phoenix. BTW, he was black. He was apparently also the reason we have that photograph of Julia.

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Images: AZR & SHS


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[Old]

Interesting stuff Hal, I look forward to seeing it.

I didn't look back to try to find the original discussion of Waltz and Peg Leg being involved with a Louisiana Confederate/Mason plot. I probably did falsely attribute it to you. I remember you had strong feelings there was a Masonic tie.

The political struggle between the Lincoln camp and the McClellan camp during the 1864 election was............electric (that's a good word!). I would have guessed McClellan as Waltz' candidate but that's just a guess and a wild one at that. WAG type. Certainly nothing I can put concrete evidence behind.

Those were interesting times. I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other as far as Waltz political leanings. If indeed he did have political leanings.

I do have mixed feeling about Julia being of mixed African descent. The census data of the time doesn't reflect a large black community in Phoenix. Chinese, yes. A fairly substantial population. I'm working from memory (never good) but I only recall one person who identified as "black" for census purposes. If memory serves me correct, that was the blacksmith. Could be wrong. I have a copy of Julia's death certificate and it would, at first glance, indicate she was black. But; on further investigation, where that check mark fell is far from a settled issue.

She is most often referred to as mulatto. Mulatto meant different things to different people at the time. I could write you a book about the damage that one word has done in my part of the country. But that's for a different forum.

Lynda

 

[Hal Croves]

Interesting stuff Hal, I look forward to seeing it.

I didn't look back to try to find the original discussion of Waltz and Peg Leg being involved with a Louisiana Confederate/Mason plot. I probably did falsely attribute it to you. I remember you had strong feelings there was a Masonic tie.

The political struggle between the Lincoln camp and the McClellan camp during the 1864 election was............electric (that's a good word!). I would have guessed McClellan as Waltz' candidate but that's just a guess and a wild one at that. WAG type. Certainly nothing I can put concrete evidence behind.

Those were interesting times. I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other as far as Waltz political leanings. If indeed he did have political leanings.

I do have mixed feeling about Julia being of mixed African descent. The census data of the time doesn't reflect a large black community in Phoenix. Chinese, yes. A fairly substantial population. I'm working from memory (never good) but I only recall one person who identified as "black" for census purposes. If memory serves me correct, that was the blacksmith. Could be wrong. I have a copy of Julia's death certificate and it would, at first glance, indicate she was black. But; on further investigation, where that check mark fell is far from a settled issue.

She is most often referred to as mulatto. Mulatto meant different things to different people at the time. I could write you a book about the damage that one word has done in my part of the country. But that's for a different forum.

Lynda

There were Masonic ties. But, back then, that would have been the norm. Freemasonry played a big roll in the development of Phoenix and may continue on some unknown level. It absolutely was the link between North & South that allowed for private conversations across enemy lines. Before that, look at the capture of Santa Anna. They were about to kill the man when, according to some sources, he let his captors know that he was a brother Mason. Before that, the Spanish military, and before that, the conquistadors, and before that.... well, there are ideas. One Joseph Smith even tried to build a cult-like religion on aspects of it. Anyway, point being, Freemasonry, love it or leave it, defined much of our history.

I have a growth chart for the black population of Phoenix somewhere. Most blacks were force to assume labor based work but there were a few educated men in the area by the time Waltz kicked it. This is the time period that I am interested in. Waltz death to the late 20's. Lynda, its absolutely fascinating. If you want to understand what kept this "legend" alive, that's where to look.

 

[motel6.5]

Catusjumper, Sorry about my last post regarding you. I did not know you was a Vet. If so I would have gave you plenty of Imfo over the years,and more imfo from my copy of Storms book. Glad you got your 90, I can"t seem to get pass 20 even though I"m rated for Chemical and Radiation exposure." Can"t feel 50% of my feet on a daily basis,and my teeth are falling apart...Semper-Fi

 

[cactusjumper]

Catusjumper, Sorry about my last post regarding you. I did not know you was a Vet. If so I would have gave you plenty of Imfo over the years,and more imfo from my copy of Storms book. Glad you got your 90, I can"t seem to get pass 20 even though I"m rated for Chemical and Radiation exposure." Can"t feel 50% of my feet on a daily basis,and my teeth are falling apart...Semper-Fi

6.5,

Don't know what post you are referring to, so no harm, no foul.

If you don't have an advocate, get one. VFW usually has one available. Keep plugging away.

Once I found out about Agent Orange, I Googled "Monkey Mountain Agent Orange". Then "Camp Tien Shaw Agent Orange". I had it easy compared to what you probably went through. They sprayed Monkey Mountain 1965-66, the entire year I was there. Found out they contaminated our water supply, but who knows how long it took them to figure it out and truck in clean water. It would have been nice if they told me 40-years ago. Just waiting for us all to die.

Anyone who was in country for one (1) day and has developed diabetes, neuropathy and heart disease, can apply for a disability connected to Agent Orange exposure. It only took me around three months from the time I applied. Any Viet Nam Vet who wants more information can get it online or get in touch with me.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[sgtfda]

6.5,

Don't know what post you are referring to, so no harm, no foul.

If you don't have an advocate, get one. VFW usually has one available. Keep plugging away.

Once I found out about Agent Orange, I Googled "Monkey Mountain Agent Orange". Then "Camp Tien Shaw Agent Orange". I had it easy compared to what you probably went through. They sprayed Monkey Mountain 1965-66, the entire year I was there. Found out they contaminated our water supply, but who knows how long it took them to figure it out and truck in clean water. It would have been nice if they told me 40-years ago. Just waiting for us all to die.

Anyone who was in country for one (1) day and has developed diabetes, neuropathy and heart disease, can apply for a disability connected to Agent Orange exposure. It only took me around three months from the time I applied. Any Viet Nam Vet who wants more information can get it online or get in touch with me.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

Cool. I have type 2 and apply. Thanks

 

[EarnieP]

"Monkey Mountain"

USAF Security Service? Ditty Bopper?

 

[cactusjumper]

"Monkey Mountain"

USAF Security Service? Ditty Bopper?

Earnie,

I was with the security force for the camp. Did patrols, perimeter guard and went out with a Marine and his dog. Laid on the side of the mountain they were spraying with Agent Orange.

It was a cake-walk compared to what some went through, but I'm paying for it now.

Frank,

Don't let it ride. It can add a nice monthly chunk to your retirement.

Good luck,

Joe