Wheres The Beef?

[ECS]

Sticking to the "JOB PRINT"...? A COVER-STORY!... LOL!

What if the "KEY" to ciphers #1 & #3 is contained in the pamphlet's Beale story?
...and the reference to 1862 & the 2nd year of the Confederate War and BEDFORD refer to the middle name of a well known KGC leader?
Once again,where is the original hand written ciphers by Beale and the box,and where or whom had them from 1862 to 1885?That is the crux of the "mystery".

 

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[Rebel - KGC]

Reb, buddy, no, the Harts took interest in the tale before they ever met anyone, even Ward. They came to the area in search of answers after already having knowledge of the Pamphlet story, and likely from reading the pamphlet first. So the question is, did they travel to the area just to investigate a possible treasure story, or did something in that story possibly remind them of something they had already heard tell of?

WRONG! Clayton Hart FIRST "knowledge" of the CIPHERS... came from N. Hazlewood, as the HART PAPER(S) indicate...

 

[tat2guy]

Just a quick thought on the copy right. Does that give Ward some type of portion if something was to be found? If so I would have done the same thing. Also selling the story for money for time invested to try and compete the mystery before he sold it. Either way he would benefit.

HHS Jay

 

[bigscoop]

More likely, Innis never had the box and ciphers, never even saw them. Here a woman writes a tell-all, very detailed book about the very subject and yet she can't even remember what was in the iron box when you ask. Don't you find it a bit odd that she was going to have "to look to see" what was inside the iron box after writing such a detailed book about the very subject? Not even any pictures of the items to support/confirm her own claims. This is just another claim without any means of confirmation. This is why Bigfoot still exist because someone said they saw one.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Just a quick thought on the copy right. Does that give Ward some type of portion if something was to be found? If so I would have done the same thing. Also selling the story for money for time invested to try and compete the mystery before he sold it. Either way he would benefit.

HHS Jay

NAH...

 

[doverturtle]

Add to this that Justintime claims he got his copy of the DOI from the box, which is evidently a different box from that of Pauline Innis.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

More likely, Innis never had the box and ciphers, never even saw them. Here a woman writes a tell-all, very detailed book about the very subject and yet she can't even remember what was in the iron box when you ask. Don't you find it a bit odd that she was going to have "to look to see" what was inside the iron box after writing such a detailed book about the very subject? Not even any pictures of the items to support/confirm her own claims. This is just another claim without any means of confirmation. This is why Bigfoot still exist because someone said they saw one.

Pauline was "connected" with the Friedmans & NSA...

 

[bigscoop]

Pauline was "connected" with the Friedmans & NSA...

I hear tell she was also connected to the KGC, CIA, Secret Service, and also a member of that other super secret organization they won't even provide initials for. But most of all she was a darn good, "storyteller."

 

[bigscoop]

Add to this that Justintime claims he got his copy of the DOI from the box, which is evidently a different box from that of Pauline Innis.

And there are even claims of forth ciphers, etc. Stick to what we can "confirm"....all else is just suspicion, hearsay, and/or fabrication. After 125 years of intense research by thousands of researchers at least we have managed to confirm this much; in 1885 there was a story published about a fantastic treasure. And we really can't confirm much beyond this.

 

[bigscoop]

Mrs. Innis was not a storyteller. I have respect for her because she did get out in the mountains dug holes and researched the Beale Treasure. She went to St. Louis to look for the "KEY" letter in the dead mail of the post office. She also wrote other books one was on etiquette of the government officials in Washington, D.C. every Senator and House of Representatives most likely have a copy of this book. She was a refined and most intelligent woman married to an Admiral and all. I don't believe I would classify her as a storyteller but a first class researcher.

A first class researching who didn't recognize the need to present confirmation of her claim, i.e., the existence of the box and its contents? A first class researcher that can't even remember what the subject matter was in one of the very detailed, investigative books she wrote?
Question: What was in the iron box?
Answer: I don't recall, get back to you later on that.

Loyalties aside, not very convincing.

 

[bigscoop]

As the claim on the fourth code, my brother and I and a Cheyenne Indian and his daughter were the ones that solved the fourth code to the Beale Ciphers. What is the fourth code? Well it is the two small pieces of paper that were left in the iron box in Pauline Innis' last book about the Beale Treasure and there was also a copy in her first book. Those two small pieces of paper were torn apart. They were torn apart because that is where a vault line runs between the huge stones that are on top the Blue Ridge Mountains somewhere but I am not going to tell where. Each of those numbers represent a stone. These stones make up a large "J" and according to old Spanish and Templar treasure symbols the "J" represents treasure at one end of a straight line. We could never get a permit of the Parks because of all the research that had to be done to preserve any endangered species whether animal or trees. But the large "J" is up there and it is about 70 feet long and 30 feet wide at the base.

Clouds. I can't tell you the number of times that I have looked into the clouds and said, "Hey, that looks just like......". If we look hard enough and long enough we can probably find the entire alphabet in various rock formations, "especially when we are inspired to find them." And folk lore, it is everywhere. Over the years hundreds of people have scoured those mountains in seach of this sign and that sign, and by gosh, most of them eventually claiming to have found them. So, Beale must have left signs all over the Blue Ridge as markers to the hundred or so hiding places he created up there.

 

[bigscoop]

In 1680 the Ute Indians united in an uprising that drove the Spanish from the territory for many years to come, this is all well documented. From this event came stories of vast riches left behind, mines that were then concealed by the Indians and the treasures dispersed and hidden so well they have never been recovered. In reality, there were very few Spaniards in the region and the mines and treasures were extremely thin, at best, as were the locations. From this single event hundreds of various stories started circulating and just as with the Beale story, hundreds of people began chasing the clues of treasure stories that never really existed. Today there are still people chasing them even though they cannot confirm the original tale. And, they will continue to chase those fantasies. It is this same desire that allowed the Indians to lead the Spanish around an entire continent in search of those golden cities, because the Indians kept telling them, "They're over there." And so the Spanish continue to believe without so much as a single piece of evidence to confirm the actual existence of those golden cities.

Treasure discoveries; history provides that they come in two forms, those that were discovered through pure blind luck where there was no prior knowledge at all, and those that were discovered because their actual existence could be confirmed.

 

[ECS]

And there are even claims of forth ciphers, etc. Stick to what we can "confirm"....all else is just suspicion, hearsay, and/or fabrication. After 125 years of intense research by thousands of researchers at least we have managed to confirm this much; in 1885 there was a story published about a fantastic treasure. And we really can't confirm much beyond this.

The only REAL source that the Beale treasure exists is the pamphlet.Outside of that are connections,tenuous at best.

 

[bigscoop]

The only REAL source that the Beale treasure exists is the pamphlet.Outside of that are connections,tenuous at best.

And, thus far, we can't even confirm there ever was a treasure, or the source of the tale.

 

[bigscoop]

Lt. Pikes stolen maps from the Spanish and published in his 1810 journal revealed gold that James Pursley found in 1805. James Pursley traveled around with 3,000 to 5,000 Indians on the Platte River. TJB added Indians to his work force to recover more gold and silver. Also Lt. Pikes book also revealed the Spanish Governments depositories of gold and silver. They may have obtained this gold and silver from the caves or depositories. Also as agents for the US Government they could have excepted bribes from the Spanish government as did General Wilkerson. All of these methods plus the selling of guns and powder to the Mexicans could have gotten the $750,000 value of the Beale Treasure. Dr. Robertson's one shipment netted him $80,000. so it's not out of the question. I know all speculation but nothing definite. I am only showing the possibilities for the sources of the treasure known as the Beale Treasure.

And you are correct, what you present isn't entirely out of the question. Personally, and from what I know today, I feel that "if" the story is true then the time period is also correct, but I am also 50-50 with the simple fiction/factional story notion as well.

 

[ECS]

And you are correct, what you present isn't entirely out of the question. Personally, and from what I know today, I feel that "if" the story is true then the time period is also correct, but I am also 50-50 with the simple fiction/factional story notion as well.

As you mentioned on another Beale tread,many real historical events can made to create the plausibilty of a Beale scenario,but for intents and purposes,does not make the Beale treasure a fact.

 

[bigscoop]

It's really a brilliantly crafted mystery either way, weather that was the original intent or not. It is just a very believable tale at first read and at face value.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

It's really a brilliantly crafted mystery either way, weather that was the original intent or not. It is just a very believable tale at first read and at face value.

(Speaking in Paul Harvey voice...) "And now... for the REST of the story...) THE HART PAPER(S)!

 

[bigscoop]

Ward, Sherman, and if the story is true, another third party with no known identity. The fact that the story was copyrighted is strong indication that future gain was anticipated in the publishing of the pamphlet. Unless there was some sort of a contact insuring a division of of these future gains then Ward would have been the only person with legal representation/proof of his rights to these gains. The fact that pamphlet went through the copyright process is favorable to the "publication for profit" notion, or the dime novel theory. However, the copyright could have also been pursued as a legal means of establishing where the original tale came from in the event of future legal actions in seeking a portion of any recovery, though this certainly wouldn't have provided any guarantees of collection and it still would have only legally placed Ward in that position should it arise, unless of course, there was prior contract in existence between Ward and parties unknown. So what I'm getting at here is this; if this wasn't just a simple case of publication for profit, and there actually was some sort of an agreement between Ward and parties unknown, then a lawyer would have to have been involved.

The story, the portion where the unknown author is interviewing Morriss, it is laid out much in the same proceedings as a lawyer and a potential client discuss and arrange for possible representation. "If" this was the actual case, then your unknown author was most likely a lawyer. Add to this this that in the basic scheme of things, Morriss was actually in the position of being the executor of wills if his agreed services were ever required. As we read the story it was, in the event that Morriss was unable to fulfill his duties, he was then to find another acceptable party to place that trust in, and who better then a lawyer?

A lawyer would have had all the resources and knowledge to have arranged the Beale Pamphlet, and, it could have also been required in order to draw out any potential parties since C3 wasn't solvable and without solution. And, given the nature of the business it would have also been in everyone's best interest if the lawyer remained unknown until a positive response in connection to the story was encountered. This would explain Ward and the possible alternate reason for the copyright.

One has to remember, that even in 1885, if a recovery was made, and due to the fact that pamphlet story established true owners, even if their names were not fully know, then that money would have gone into trust until all possible resources in identifying the rightful owners and their heirs had been exhausted, and just imagine the claims that would likely come forward 50 to 100 years after the fact. So "yes" there was certainly need for an informed lawyer in the event that the story actually lead to a recovery. So, "if" the story was true, the who would have likely been the unknown author? Perhaps, "a lawyer". And if it was a lawyer then we know he conducted important in Richmond, which also makes sense that he would. Hence, has anyone else searched the legal resources/court documents in search of a suspect?

 

[bigscoop]

"If" the lawyer angle is accurate, then it's certain to be someone who was comfortable to place his trust in Ward. By acting as the agent Ward would have been the shield, or the pre-screener of the possible contacts and claims, this arrangement then allowing Ward to pass the information to the attorney so he could evaluate each inquiry or claim without exposing his own identity. So basically, in this sense, the Beale Pamphlet would have been the bait. And if this is the case it would have been this way, otherwise claims would have started piling in the moment the public realized an attorney was looking for possible unknown heirs to a yet recovered fortune. Can you imagine the amount of bogus claims that would have come rushing in. It would be like running an ad in the newspaper asking who lost the winning multimillion dollar lottery ticket you just found. But with Ward in place the attorney could then pick and choose which claims he felt could be valid. Remember, as an attorney, he would have to create a casefile on every claim that walked through the door otherwise.