Undeniable proof that gun control works

[Doc-USN(Ret)]

Yes statistics. Anyone can pick out they want to get their point across, such as you Stockpicker. you want everyone to believe that banning guns has lead to the decrease murder rate in NYC. What you failed to do as most liberals do, is tell the rest of the story. From what TreasureHunter wrote, you left out a whole lot of facts and stats. You did that because it contradicts what you were trying to make us believe. Next thing NYC has to do is ban knives and Apple products so the crime rate will go down. Stay thirsty my friends, and have another sip of that Big Gulp. Doc

 

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[0121stockpicker]

Yes statistics. Anyone can pick out they want to get their point across, such as you Stockpicker. you want everyone to believe that banning guns has lead to the decrease murder rate in NYC. What you failed to do as most liberals do, is tell the rest of the story. From what TreasureHunter wrote, you left out a whole lot of facts and stats. You did that because it contradicts what you were trying to make us believe. Next thing NYC has to do is ban knives and Apple products so the crime rate will go down. Stay thirsty my friends, and have another sip of that Big Gulp. Doc

That was the whole point of my thread. Obviously you missed that. It's the same as when pro gun people try and use Chicago and DC as examples. I'm a registered republican so I have no idea what you are talking about calling my a "liberal". I'm a free thinking looking for the truth. And you?

 

[Doc-USN(Ret)]

Yes I want the truth but in order to get it one has to have the WHOLE truth. If you disagree with that then you really don't want the truth. You can't pick and choose.

 

[0121stockpicker]

Yes I want the truth but in order to get it one has to have the WHOLE truth. If you disagree with that then you really don't want the truth. You can't pick and choose.

We completely agree - hopefully you remember that regardless of what side of a discussion you are on.

 

[Doc-USN(Ret)]

And by the way. If you read my post more carefully, I did not call you personally a liberal. I said, "as most liberals do." Don't take offense, I'm Just sayin'.

 

[worldtalker]

That was the whole point of my thread. Obviously you missed that. It's the same as when pro gun people try and use Chicago and DC as examples. I'm a registered republican so I have no idea what you are talking about calling my a "liberal". I'm a free thinking looking for the truth. And you?

I'm a free thinking looking for the truth. And you?


Seems to me I read this years ago,You shall know the TRUTH,and,the TRUTH shall set you free.

 

[Jason in Enid]

It's the same as when pro gun people try and use Chicago and DC as examples.

No, no, no..... THAT is a twisting of truth. "pro gun people" are not focusing on those cities. Those are the cities the liberals are using as a reason to ban guns. When the 2nd amendment side references them, it's only to point out the failures of the statistics used by the liberals.

 

[Rebel - KGC]

No, no, no..... THAT is a twisting of truth. "pro gun people" are not focusing on those cities. Those are the cities the liberals are using as a reason to ban guns. When the 2nd amendment side references them, it's only to point out the failures of the statistics used by the liberals.

LIBERALS...? WHAT Liberals? !!!

 

[ShadowLine]

No, no, no..... THAT is a twisting of truth. "pro gun people" are not focusing on those cities. Those are the cities the liberals are using as a reason to ban guns. When the 2nd amendment side references them, it's only to point out the failures of the statistics used by the liberals.

Excellent point. I don't argue anything about any cities because the 2nd Amendment is not about violence or crime. The 2nd Amendment is about my own right to preserve life and our collective responsibility to protect the constitution and our freedom. I always find it odd that the people that exercise their 1st Amendment rights most often like to pretend its not the 2nd Amendment protecting that right.

 

[0121stockpicker]

Excellent point. I don't argue anything about any cities because the 2nd Amendment is not about violence or crime. The 2nd Amendment is about my own right to preserve life and our collective responsibility to protect the constitution and our freedom. I always find it odd that the people that exercise their 1st Amendment rights most often like to pretend its not the 2nd Amendment protecting that right.

Interesting statement. Name me any significant historical event since the independence of this country where US citizens used guns to protect their 1st amendment rights against the United States government? Name one significant movement that has gained rights through the use of violence? Civil rights movement, woman's right to vote, etc, etc. the 1st amendment has been safeguarded by the checks and balance system of our government and 200 years of constitutional law. Not by violence. Best

 

[Dano Sverige]

Interesting statement. Name me any significant historical event since the independence of this country where US citizens used guns to protect their 1st amendment rights against the United States government? Name one significant movement that has gained rights through the use of violence? Civil rights movement, woman's right to vote, etc, etc. the 1st amendment has been safeguarded by the checks and balance system of our government and 200 years of constitutional law. Not by violence. Best

Are you mad??...That would mean them actually using "logic" and admitting that they're...wr....wr.....WRONG! Arrrrggghhh, sacrilege!

 

[0121stockpicker]

Are you mad??...That would mean them actually using "logic" and admitting that they're...wr....wr.....WRONG! Arrrrggghhh, sacrilege!

I doubt that will ever happen. If there is any response at all, it will likely just be a personal attack or a "your head is in the sand" comment. you can always tell when the discussion starts getting to the point where it was start switching over to personal comments. Just a sign that someone lacks the ability to hold an intelligent conversation.

 

[ShadowLine]

Interesting statement. Name me any significant historical event since the independence of this country where US citizens used guns to protect their 1st amendment rights against the United States government? Name one significant movement that has gained rights through the use of violence? Civil rights movement, woman's right to vote, etc, etc. the 1st amendment has been safeguarded by the checks and balance system of our government and 200 years of constitutional law. Not by violence. Best

You should notice I never referred to violence. I am suggesting it is the presence of the weapons and the ability of the citizenship of this country to use those weapons to defend our freedoms that deters the infringement of our rights.

But, I can refer you to research the Battle of Athens. That was a clear example of the 2nd Amendment rights being exercised to preserve the freedoms of the people.

 

[ShadowLine]

Are you mad??...That would mean them actually using "logic" and admitting that they're...wr....wr.....WRONG! Arrrrggghhh, sacrilege!

Yep no rights were ever gained through armed conflict in this country. The Revolutionary War and Civil War never took place.

 

[0121stockpicker]

You should notice I never referred to violence. I am suggesting it is the presence of the weapons and the ability of the citizenship of this country to use those weapons to defend our freedoms that deters the infringement of our rights.

But, I can refer you to research the Battle of Athens. That was a clear example of the 2nd Amendment rights being exercised to preserve the freedoms of the people.

If the battle of Athens is the only example then you have more than proven the point right.

And why don't you read the punch line of what happened after the battle. Personally I would not be holding that out as a good example.

 

[ShadowLine]

If the battle of Athens is the only example then you have more than proven the point right.

And why don't you read the punch line of what happened after the battle. Personally I would not be holding that out as a good example.

Its your option whether to accept that as an example or not. How do you counter my position that the 2nd Amendment is a deterrent to violence?

 

[0121stockpicker]

Shadow, in logic you do not prove a negative. I think you will see that posted many places or or you can look it up. You prove that something is true/valid.

 

[0121stockpicker]

Its your option whether to accept that as an example or not. How do you counter my position that the 2nd Amendment is a deterrent to violence?

Thesis - the second amendment is a deterrence to violence.

Proof - .....

It's done like geometry proofs if you remember those.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

Shadow, he asked you to name one example and Athens was a good one but he didn't like it, the American Revolution is the prime example but that doesn't seem to count and neither does the war of northern aggression (civil war).

Its your option whether to accept that as an example or not. How do you counter my position that the 2nd Amendment is a deterrent to violence?

 

[Dano Sverige]

Its your option whether to accept that as an example or not. How do you counter my position that the 2nd Amendment is a deterrent to violence?

How do you counter the position that the 2nd allows so much violence to be commited with guns far in excess of it's original purpose?