Two peaks

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

First S L Dakotian, one has to consider 'was a correct diagnosis given?" A manufactured memory ? Mexico after all? ?



El Don Jose de a Mancha

 

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[UncleMatt]

lol, maybe Adams searched in the US for all those years just to throw people off!

 

[markmar]

Don Jose

And after - after all , are two peaks in Carpathian Mountains , Europe .

 

[UncleMatt]

I did have a dream where I was sitting in a coffee shop with a guy across the table from me, who was telling me in hushed tones that all the directions in the LAD tale were reversed. Someone needs to check that out! lol

 

[lastleg]

I had a dream I was in a café in New Mexico and they had no cream for my coffee. I was grousing
about it and everyone was nodding. All of a sudden an old desert rat stormed in shouting "I found
the Lost Adams!" No one even turned around. They all just wanted some cream.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

HIo Marius, so that is where the LDM is congrats hehehhehe

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[UncleMatt]

I am trying to work out a couple of bugs with my Google Earth map for the LAD. I will post the kml file so anyone who is interested can bring it up on their own Google Earth, but I also hope to post a large image file so it can be viewed from T-net without using GE.

Eventually I would like to add all the various routes that were taken by Adams, Shaw, and all the rest of the characters in this mess. Feel free to suggest corrections or things you feel should be on the map, as long as you can back it up.

 

[coco2]

It seems to me that there was a mention of Aspen trees on the top of the canyon walls, does anyone remember this being mentioned? I think it was from Adams, as one of the criteria for his searches when he returned from Calif., but it's been so long since I've shuffled through any LAD stuff, that I can't remember anything much for sure. But I thought I might bring this up in case the elevation that Aspens grow at might help your map, Uncle Matt.

I've been able to stay away from LAD stuff for maybe 2 yrs, and here I am back again. tsk.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

And welcome back my friend, coffee

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[UncleMatt]

Yes, I am trying to use the aspen grove to locate the LAD. No progress on that yet though. Sorry about the delay in my map, I'm still trying to get it to display properly.

 

[Interested Party in UK]

Looking for the LAD has mostly been done by following the various 'Adams' accounts and assuming that they are accurate and truthful. This is a fascinating story and legend which has puzzled and frustrated many a person over the last century and a half.

It could be said that if one try's to strip away the bumpf and focus on the discernible 'facts', there was an incident that took place in a lonely place in the southwest of the States sometime in the middle of the last century and gold was found and then lost. One might question whether it was placer gold or gold retrieved by murdering miners returning from California. Was the fabled Adams in a fortuitous party that left a location in Arizona and travelled into present day New Mexico?

After looking into this and going over (at times again and again), at various aspects, it is my belief that the printed versions in whatever form are unreliable and unlikely to lead to the site or area. I also do not think that Chief Nana was involved in any way and he lived up until the mid 1890s and had several opportunities to reveal anything he knew about such a location. Of course there are many gaps and missing pieces but even when considered in its entirety, it seems improbable and unlikely that there is anything remaining. If indeed there was a pot/kettle of gold, it was found and retrieved by Brewer (as suggested by Jack Purcell).

NB.

FAO Old Bookaroo

Hi, I have made a resolution to update my reading material and library, and as the considered professional who deals with academic items, please would you kindly suggest some books with stories of successful treasure hunts/adventures?

Thanking you in advance of any assistance rendered.

 

[UncleMatt]

UK, perhaps Nana did not reveal the location due to his religious beliefs. Some have suggested a burial ground lay above the LAD site on the creek, and if true, this could explain why nothing was ever revealed about the site, and then the secret died out as people passed away. Religion causes all kinds of people to do all kinds of irrational things, we see that even today!

 

[Interested Party in UK]

UK, perhaps Nana did not reveal the location due to his religious beliefs. Some have suggested a burial ground lay above the LAD site on the creek, and if true, this could explain why nothing was ever revealed about the site, and then the secret died out as people passed away. Religion causes all kinds of people to do all kinds of irrational things, we see that even today!

UM

Nana was most likely never there. How can anyone say there might have been a burial site other than those that actually visited the place? In Apache religion and cultural norms, burial places were private and not generally like graveyards according to western norms, so no place was considered a burial ground as such. Most Apaches became Christians in later life and even though they may have still held on to some earlier beliefs and cultural practices, they had virtually changed within a generation.

I will not doubt you enthusiasm or willingness to get to the bottom of this saga.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

G'd morning UK ya Britlander, Tea? Can we safely say that the LDM site was not a family site for Nana's ancestors?

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[Interested Party in UK]

G'd morning UK ya Britlander, Tea? Can we safely say that the LDM site was not a family site for Nana's ancestors?

Don Jose de La Mancha

Hello there Don

Hope things are well with you down there in old Mexico.

A steaming brew would do the job in here cold, old Blighty.

I think we can safely say that Nana's Eastern Chiricahua ancestors knew well of those mountains, but it was not considered the normal 'stomping' ground for that particular branch of the Apache nation.

 

[alaskabill]

Uncle Matt,

Are you making any progress on your "map"?

Bill

 

[UncleMatt]

I wish! I have all the elements working, I am just trying to figure out a way to combine them all into a single kmz file. I will try to work on that a little today while I am home sick with the flu.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Ladies & Gentlemen: A side thingie, The Yaqui handed down stories of family treasures etc to the oldest son, who in turn passed it down when their time was approaching.

Whoever was in charge of a family treasure would guard it with their life if necesary, but never touch it ??yet be perfectly willing to go look for another treasure.

Since the Yaqui and Apache were cousins, it is quite probable they shared this custom, hence Nana, if he actually knew of a family treasure, would be psychologically incapable of revealing it.

Jose

p.s. these family treasures were considered theirs, not the tribes', but on occasions they would be recovered for the tribes' benefit.

p.p.s. generally the tribe itself did not have a treasure, so under needs would call upon the families to show theirs.

 

[alaskabill]

Uncle Matt,

Sorry to hear that the flu caught up with you and hope you feel better soon and looking forward to your posting. Are you using a PC or a Mac? There might be another way for you to "skin the cat" and avoid having to use a kmz file. We could discuss via PM or email?

Bill

 

[UncleMatt]

I am going to try printing an image tomorrow, but I don't have Google Earth Pro, so it won't be high resolution. But it will give a general idea of what my intent is with it. Namely, to basically define an area within which the LAD must lie if all accounts are taken in. I honestly started this project expecting things to be all over the place, but there is actually an area where all the "distance landmarks" have an area in common. No, I don't think the LAD is actually in it, wouldn't that be fun, but it shows there is a lot more commonality than one might expect. Why not simply take an area, and search Google Earth section by section over time? You could eliminate areas without a canyon, which would make things much more manageable. I have my friend in Europe modeling an area using software to reject any areas that are plains land, or relatively flat with no walls of any kind. You can use a lot of tricks to search. For example, you can use elevation to rule out likely areas that Aspen might or might not grow...