Three Hikers Missing What Happened Where Are They

[jimb]

They found the last guys bones today it was in the news.

 

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[Cubfan64]

They found the last guys bones today it was in the news.

Actually they found the 3rd body over this past weekend - Saturday I believe.

 

[cactusjumper]

Paul,

You are correct.

"Cooper and SSAR found (the third body) about 1100 on Saturday, January 15, 2011. He was found on Black Mesa about 3/4's of mile from where the other two were found by Gywnn on Wednesday, January 5th."......Tom Kollenborn

Take care,

Joe

 

[Blindbowman]

here rest 3 treasure hunters
here rest 3 brave men
here rest 3 men who dared to believe
here rest men without fear of the unknown
here the dutchman looks over them
here they rest ...amen

 

[silent hunter]

Blindbowman It's not your fault the three men are dead. Those of us who are compelled to search, do so just like a base jumper jumps from a low building or tower. Or a person who might want to swim with great white sharks after pouring blood in water to bait them!! I read your post often and even if you gave those men the map they used to get lost it was not your fault.

Best Wishes
Kurt Painter

 

[assistanttoauthors]

Hey, those lost hikers were not even looking for the Lost Dutchman, they were looking for the cave of gold bars, which has two entrances; one which the Indians enter and protect the gold. They befriended an old Indian in Utah who sent them there. Why they would go knowing they were waiting for them really does not make sense. I have the shizzz!!! to back it up. Hey, Kurt I read somewhere that if you found gold you would make a basket out of straw and carry it out silently. Is that a true story?

 

[Cubfan64]

Hey, those lost hikers were not even looking for the Lost Dutchman, they were looking for the cave of gold bars, which has two entrances; one which the Indians enter and protect the gold. They befriended an old Indian in Utah who sent them there. Why they would go knowing they were waiting for them really does not make sense. I have the shizzz!!! to back it up. Hey, Kurt I read somewhere that if you found gold you would make a basket out of straw and carry it out silently. Is that a true story?

Considering you are a supporter of the book "Spirits in the Mountains," it's impossible for me to take this seriously at all.

 

[assistanttoauthors]

Well since I see a full view of the awesome Superstition Mts. every time I go outside and you live where? I am not sure I can take you seriously. I personally have taken over 30 trips into the Superstition Wilderness. The words I spoke above came from the family to the man who found them, I take him seriously. About the book and the Johnson brothers, I worked for a year helping them put the book together on a daily basis and only received a total of $50. After correcting everything in the way of editing the book, they chose not to make the corrections and printed it with all the errors. The brothers did find one of the Peralta mines but it is not the Lost Dutchman Mine. I do not agree with all the spiritual stuff, but everything else is there for you to refind, but we have so many who search for the mine but do not really want it found. The treatment they received from this unbelieving community was really disgraceful.
Come on out here and I personally will show you their find. It would be nice if someone would just go and prove them wrong and open it up to see there really is gold in them thar hills. I have proof.

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

You overlook the Superstitions out your door and you have only been there 30 times 30 times is nothing to most of the folks who travel a whole lot further to go into the Supes. We spent over 30 days just working one valley.

We were in the Supes longer than that just this past winter. Just because you live somewhere, doesn't mean you know anything about it.

80% of people NEVER look at the things in their own back yards. Most New Yorkers have never been to the Statue of Liberty, or the Museum of Natural History or the Empire State Building.

Things like famous buildings and parks are usually tourist destinations. Even dutch hunters are considered tourists by the locals - just ask some of the AJ residents here on this forum (some even complain about my driving slow through Apache Junction. )

I have to correct you though - the 3 men - were out for what they thought was the LDM. As was Jesse Capen, who also disappeared.

Beth

 

[Oroblanco]

Well since I see a full view of the awesome Superstition Mts. every time I go outside and you live where? I am not sure I can take you seriously. I personally have taken over 30 trips into the Superstition Wilderness. The words I spoke above came from the family to the man who found them, I take him seriously. About the book and the Johnson brothers, I worked for a year helping them put the book together on a daily basis and only received a total of $50. After correcting everything in the way of editing the book, they chose not to make the corrections and printed it with all the errors. The brothers did find one of the Peralta mines but it is not the Lost Dutchman Mine. I do not agree with all the spiritual stuff, but everything else is there for you to refind, but we have so many who search for the mine but do not really want it found. The treatment they received from this unbelieving community was really disgraceful.
Come on out here and I personally will show you their find. It would be nice if someone would just go and prove them wrong and open it up to see there really is gold in them thar hills. I have proof.

I realize this was addressed to our mutual friend Cubfan, but a part of your statements are aimed at our community so am replying for "us" and welcome anyone else to do so where they disagree with anything I say.

That "treatment" received by several persons whom have made rather outrageous claims to have found the Lost Dutchman gold mine, Peralta et al, without showing any ore, gold or photos of the mine to illustrate the vein has been courteous and patient. Always there are excuses for this lack of proof. When we ask serious questions about the claims being made, we who made the questions have been seen as the "enemy" and often find those persons responding by name calling. (Santa Fe NM being one example who comes to mind, I have his name calling posts if you doubt that happened) There may have been a few sarcastic remarks made but in large part most everyone has tried to keep an open mind about it when someone pops up "shouting" that they have found the illusive lost mine, but no one should expect that we are such a gullible bunch of rubes that we are going to just accept any story without question, we need to see photos at a minimum. Want to see photos inside of a real mine hidden in the Superstitions, shot by one of our members here? There are a bunch of them if you care to look, and in those cases the persons who shot the photos were not claiming it is the Lost Dutchman gold mine. There is a good reason for that, which perhaps you are not aware.

The Lost Dutchman gold mine is arguably the most famous lost mine in the USA, and supposedly has gold ore that is some of the richest ever found on Earth. We are not talking about a rock vein with a few visible specks of gold in it, this was one-quarter gold roughly speaking. There are a few specimens of this gold still in existence, and since gold ores can be compared in a scientific way by a geologist or SOME assayers (who have a great deal of experience) and since so many different people have all claimed to have found the Lost Dutchman, but never have a single speck of gold to show for it, not to mention the fact that no two of these sites match those of any other claimed site, if we were to just start passing out proud congratulations to each and every one who pops onto the internet to crow about having found the Lost Dutchman, we would have little time for any serious discussion of the subject.

I have to respectfully disagree with your summing up the way those prior claimants have been "treated" as "shameful"; what I saw was a patient attempt to induce the persons to state their cases and present their proofs, and this was in almost every case interpreted as some kind of a personal attack. You would have it sound as if we were nothing but a group of internet trolls, waiting for victims to pounce on for having innocently said they found the lost Peralta or Dutchman mine, which is very far from the truth. Quite the contrary to what you said, there are not a lot of people who want the Lost Dutchman gold mine to remain lost; most of us here want the opposite to happen and to be alive to see it. But the catch is that it has to be the real Lost Dutchman gold mine of Jacob Waltz, the ore has to match the ore he had under his deathbed. That may be impossible for those whom are trying to pull a fast one and want to gain glory out of claiming they found the famous lost mine, since unless they have found the actual mine of Jacob Waltz, they won't have that gold or even photos that will look like the right ore.

It does get tiresome to have a new person show up every couple of weeks with the same old claim about how he or she found the Lost Dutchman, with very little to prove that claim. I for one am still waiting and hoping that ONE will show up that has something more substantial and the case will be settled finally.

Good luck and good hunting to you all, I hope you find the treasures that you seek.
Oroblanco

 

[assistanttoauthors]

I really appreciate your thoughtful response. You are right they did not find the fabled mine. There are at least 8 Peralta Mines and they did find one. Because you are not allowed to dig up anything without a Treasure Trove permit it is a catch 22. One of the stories told to me by one of the geologist who was here from the time it was organized and worked with the people who manage the museum might understand why there aren't any samples.
He said of a person who is no longer with us that this person found a treasure trove near Tucson and presented evidence to the proper authorities in the form of a huge amount of gold and pictures of himself sitting atop a large stack of bars the authorities demanded the location and said they would give him a permit. When he went back everything was gone and they blew up the entrance; his gold disappeared. He got his anyway when he showed up at the bank a bank book with $7,000,000 in the account when he went to take out $10,000 for a week in Vegas.

 

[Cubfan64]

Well since I see a full view of the awesome Superstition Mts. every time I go outside and you live where? I am not sure I can take you seriously.

There's nothing to "take seriously" or not from me as I'm not the one making any claims.

On the other hand, you were the one who implied the 3 men who died in the Superstitions were:

a) Looking for a cave of gold bars
b) Sent there by a Native American from Utah
c) Entering a "trap" by going somewhere where other Native Americans were lying in wait for them

If you have proof of any of these things, please feel free to share. In fact I would suggest contacting the authorities if you believe the men may have been harmed by Native Americans protecting something.

If you can't provide CONVINCING proof of any of these, the only point of posting here seems to be to try to convince everyone that "I know something you don't know."

Doesn't concern me at all how much $ you got from the Johnson brothers to edit their book - that's between you and them. You are on record in a number of places proclaiming the significance of their find and promoting the book - The stories and photos of the "gunfighters" who were constantly stalking them around every corner is enough for me to question your credibility.

If you have the "shizzz" (whatever that means), feel free to share it with us.

 

[assistanttoauthors]

After reading further about some of these people in the Government Conspiracy section of "Treasurenet forum", I am beginning to wonder if I had better not say too much more. If anything happens to me I have contacted my family and told them where all my pics and further information is. Who I suspect might have done it to me and only open in that case. Oh, by the way myself and a friend went to the authorities about July 10, 2010 and told them about information about what we thought they may be doing up there where to look because of "I found the LDM with Google Earth" being all over the internet. We had no inside info just speculation, it only took them seven months going grid by grid to search the area. They like others do not believe anything you tell them, so why bother. Hearsay is all I have to go on at this time. I know nothing about them but what I have heard. I met Tom Kollenborn on that day. My friend already knew him.

 

[Cubfan64]

Oh, by the way myself and a friend went to the authorities about July 10, 2010 and told them about information about what we thought they may be doing up there where to look because of "I found the LDM with Google Earth" being all over the internet. We had no inside info just speculation, it only took them seven months going grid by grid to search the area. They like others do not believe anything you tell them, so why bother. Hearsay is all I have to go on at this time.

I applaud that you did the right thing in contacting the authorities. What they do (or don't do) with the information is out of your hands, but it's the right thing to do. I know of a number of people who contacted the authorities with similar information considering the plethora of "less than stellar" people posting I FOUND IT - GO HERE stories on various sites of the internet including here.

I've heard my share of conspiracy/hearsay information regarding those 3 men, but it is what it is - hearsay. In the history of the LDM and Superstition Mountains, hearsay and conspiracy's make up a pretty large percentage of the conversations

 

[Oroblanco]

I really appreciate your thoughtful response. You are right they did not find the fabled mine. There are at least 8 Peralta Mines and they did find one. Because you are not allowed to dig up anything without a Treasure Trove permit it is a catch 22. One of the stories told to me by one of the geologist who was here from the time it was organized and worked with the people who manage the museum might understand why there aren't any samples.
He said of a person who is no longer with us that this person found a treasure trove near Tucson and presented evidence to the proper authorities in the form of a huge amount of gold and pictures of himself sitting atop a large stack of bars the authorities demanded the location and said they would give him a permit. When he went back everything was gone and they blew up the entrance; his gold disappeared. He got his anyway when he showed up at the bank a bank book with $7,000,000 in the account when he went to take out $10,000 for a week in Vegas.

If you are referring to the story of 'Crazy Jake' and his gold bars fraud, I am fairly sure he was convicted of fraud.

The whole "catch 22" idea on permits ignores the miracle of photography; there are no laws restricting you from shooting photographs of any treasures, mines etc which can then be used to help substantiate a story and even help get the necessary permits to legally obtain such treasures, minus the government 'cut' of course.

I have to agree with Cubfan on the whole story of some kind of conspiracy etc. It may be entertaining to indulge in such theories but if there is any truth in them the correct thing to do is contact the authorities with that information.
Oroblanco

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

I hate to keep correcting you - but - you will get no mine in the Supers, or any other wilderness, by way of a Treasure Trove permit.

You might get a Treasure Trove permit to retrieve a "treasure" as in a cache. For a mine, you need a mining claim - not a Treasure Trove Permit, and alas, there is no mining claims being permitted in the wildernesses of our country.

You might want to go to DesertUSA - as Mr. Jim Hatt did quite a bit of research on the Treasure Trove permit process, and you will find a letter he received from the government as to what is, and what is NOT a permittable Treasure Trove.

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...d=8&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&source=www.google.com

Beth

 

[cactusjumper]

Beth,

You are correct, but I thought everyone knew that there would be no permits issued for a mine in the Superstitions. Believe that may be why they call it a "treasure trove" permit.

Take care,

Joe

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

CJ,

While most folks, I think, get the difference between a claim and a Treasure Trove permit, in this case, I don't think its the fact.

This statement:

There are at least 8 Peralta Mines and they did find one. Because you are not allowed to dig up anything without a Treasure Trove permit it is a catch 22.

Was the reasoning for me posting about mines and Treasure Troves. Finding a Peralta Mine (or any other), as you and I know, would not warrant a treasure trove permit, and this post makes it seem, to me, that there is still some confusion, by some folks, about that.

Beth

 

[cactusjumper]

Beth,

I agree about the confusion for some folks out there. Sometimes I think that confusion is fostered by people who know better.

Hope all is well with you and Roy.

Take care,

Joe

 

[mrs.oroblanco]

Joe,

I do believe you are 100% correct.

We have been under constant rain and wind, but have managed to put in part of the garden between the rain drops. (all that rain you guys had where you live (last year) was because we were not too far away ). Hope the weather clears up so that we can get all our stuff done.

At least the sheep are sheared, and the cattle are branded, so if it ever clears up, we will have some time to do our stuff.

Hope all is well with you and Carolyn, too. (and Smokey, too).

Beth