THE THREAD OF TRUTHS and nutters

[Oroblanco]

Hello Seventytwo,

Mrs Oroblanco is my wife Beth, who is online also, and has not posted in this thread before that one. Others have mixed us up before too. I am still working on the photo and latitude-longitude on topozone, personally.

Oroblanco

 

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[Seventytwo]

B, you are correct. I did not copyright the place, I copywrit ed the location as the Lost Dutchman Gold mine. Why do you think I would have to go to all the trouble it takes to copyright this location anyway.

Dan Adams

 

[Peerless67]

Hey seventytwo, I dont wish to sound like a doubter, but I would like to see the letter since you did offer it up.
Also could you confirm wether Mrs Oroblanco is correct and that you found the mine outside of the wilderness, I only ask this because if that is the case you can file a claim for mining.
And if you are willing would you let us know how your panning went with the crushed ore? and did you not consider an assay?
I have to say that you are the only person who has to my knowledge put this amount of evidence in the spotlight, I dont know why but I have a tendency to believe your claims, and they are certainly more substantive than anything bowman has offered up.
Oroblanco also mentioned about a book, that to me sounds like good advice. you could make a tidy sum if indeed you have found the LDM.
I dont understand the cords you gave, can anyone translate them to google earth? I would be intrested to see where the mine is in relation to boulder canyon, seems a lot of people spent a lot of time in the wrong place. would you like to share how you came about thinking out of the box like that or was it just a fluke?

Anyway nice job, truth or lie, you have got people intrested.

BLUFF SPRING?

 

[the blindbowman]

are you talking about these lat and lon

"The pit mine, 3325.72N 11116.10 W
The Lost Dutchman Gold mine 3325.65N 11116.94 W
One of the Peralta mines 3325.93N 11117.08 W "

all of them are in the supers ..there over between picacho butte and red tanks divide left of trail 107 ..about 3/4 of mile south of brads water ...

still in the supers ...

 

[Peerless67]

GPS coordinates are not a copywritable entity - you cannot copyright public stuff as your own.

What is copyright?
Copyright is a form of protection grounded in the U.S. Constitution and granted by law for original works of authorship fixed in a tangible medium of expression. Copyright covers both published and unpublished works.

You can copyright a map or a picture - but you cannot copyright a place, and the result of gps coordinates is a place.



Hello Mrs Oroblanco welcome to the thread of nutters,

I think what he was trying to convey Mrs Oro is that he has the intelectual copyright, that is to say he has claimed that location to be the lost dutchmans mine. he has not copyrighted the location or the cords, only the right to call that location the lost dutchmans mine. he does not own the cords or the location or even the name the lost dutchmans mine, but can put them all together to name that location as the LDM with those cords, that is his intelectual property copyright.
writing a book poses the same question a book is made up of a series of words, unless you create a unique language you will be using a language that is made up of those words, do you own the copyright to the words you write? or even the paper you wrote them on?. The answer is No to both, but you own the intelectual copyright to the complete work, your work is made up of words that are not owned by copyright and on paper you dont have the copyright for. in the same way seventy two does not own the land or the cords he only has the copyright on calling that paticular set of cords the LDM

 

[the blindbowman]

thats very true ...



after seeing the mineral rights paper work from the foresty .i wonder if its worth the time ... maybe for the treasure trove permits . not mineing rights ... if you found it someone would have to have a mineing clam to mine it .. but rock hounding is the next best thing ... its more the finding itr then mineing it ...

but if you think i am crazy then there no reason to keep posting about my research here ... so i wont give any more misleeding data ,,, ...

 

[BLACKFOOT]

Re: THE THREAD OF TRUTHS

looks like my marker bowman

How do you take my picture and put your brand on it??


Mine was really a marker i found.


Blackfoot

 

[Peerless67]

Re: THE THREAD OF TRUTHS

looks like my marker bowman

How do you take my picture and put your brand on it??


Mine was really a marker i found.


Blackfoot

it was just a private joke with BB blackfoot but i will take it down, no offence was meant

 

[Cubfan64]

I've been a lurker on this thread for a long time now and haven't posted until today. Whether you think someone is telling the truth, purposely lying or delusional and confused, I personally think there is value in everyone's opinions and thoughts on the LDM.

Many inventions have been made when a person has that "aha" moment that allows them to think outside of the box for just that briefest of moments. Personally I don't see the point of ridiculing someone just because you don't happen to believe them for whatever reason. Every comment under this thread has led to further discussion, more information, theories and even some possible evidence that likely would never have come out if certain posts hadn't been made.

I think wise treasure hunter takes in absolutely every scrap of information they possibly can from whatever source is available and keeps compiling it every which way they can. Theories are presented and then reworked and thought out and information is sorted, compared, validated, invalidated etc... until either the final goal is achieved or until one finally gives up.

It serves little purpose to belittle anyone with the same hopes, dreams and idealism that all treasure hunters possess. Disagreeing is fine, but it crosses lines when personal attacks and ridicule is heaped on. If you don't believe someone, fine, state that and move on.

Imho, you never know when that "aha" moment will happen or what tiny shred of information may lead to it. I for one look forward to the day the LDM is actually found (perhaps it already has been), and I can hear the story behind it's discovery. It's that kind of optimism and idealism that fuels the hearts of every treasure hunter.

Good luck to all of you out there searching!

 

[the blindbowman]

.. i was sighting my new 270 wsm Ruger with 140 grain AccuBond ,.....any of you hunt elk or mule deer ... out there ...?

 

[Peerless67]

I've been a lurker on this thread for a long time now and haven't posted until today. Whether you think someone is telling the truth, purposely lying or delusional and confused, I personally think there is value in everyone's opinions and thoughts on the LDM.

Many inventions have been made when a person has that "aha" moment that allows them to think outside of the box for just that briefest of moments. Personally I don't see the point of ridiculing someone just because you don't happen to believe them for whatever reason. Every comment under this thread has led to further discussion, more information, theories and even some possible evidence that likely would never have come out if certain posts hadn't been made.

I think wise treasure hunter takes in absolutely every scrap of information they possibly can from whatever source is available and keeps compiling it every which way they can. Theories are presented and then reworked and thought out and information is sorted, compared, validated, invalidated etc... until either the final goal is achieved or until one finally gives up.

It serves little purpose to belittle anyone with the same hopes, dreams and idealism that all treasure hunters possess. Disagreeing is fine, but it crosses lines when personal attacks and ridicule is heaped on. If you don't believe someone, fine, state that and move on.

Imho, you never know when that "aha" moment will happen or what tiny shred of information may lead to it. I for one look forward to the day the LDM is actually found (perhaps it already has been), and I can hear the story behind it's discovery. It's that kind of optimism and idealism that fuels the hearts of every treasure hunter.

Good luck to all of you out there searching!

AHH the voice of reason, great input, but you have missed a lot of the posts that blindbowman posted and then removed. as has been stated elsewhere his storys just get bigger and wilder, thats not to say they are not true, but they seem to be made up as he goes along. I have not been here long but in the short time ive been here II have learned the following about the quest for the LDM (as told by bowman)

He first saw the LDM from inside of an aeroplane in 1979 as he passed over the supers in a storm. the storm was so bad that they expirienced a complete white out. But bowman was the only passenger on the plane with the foresight to cover his eyes. he then shielded his eyes as he peered out of the window of the plane and saw the LDM.
At some stage he became a shaman, apparently it was his destiny and he has been enlightened during his shaman trances.
His evidence, or rather lack of it as of to this time has consisted of a picture of his friend standing in front of a cactus at the peralta trail.
He also claims that there is a magnetic field there, strong enough to destroy his camera, infact that magnetic field cost him $650.00 which is awful bad luck and rather silly, why do I say silly? because it was "expedition 2" and he never learned from "Expedition 1" to take precautions.
He makes claims, sometimes realistic sometimes so unbelievable that people question him. when he claims to have evidence and then is asked if he would like to share it, he comes up with some wild story that is just so out there people have started to treat him as a joke.
You are absolutely correct with what you say in your post but you need to research a bit further as far as bowmans posts go, and remember that a good many of them have been removed.

Ever watched Forrest Gump? that guy had some great storys ha? well you just wait till they release Mountain Bowman.

 

[Cubfan64]

I've been a lurker on this thread for a long time now and haven't posted until today. Whether you think someone is telling the truth, purposely lying or delusional and confused, I personally think there is value in everyone's opinions and thoughts on the LDM.

Many inventions have been made when a person has that "aha" moment that allows them to think outside of the box for just that briefest of moments. Personally I don't see the point of ridiculing someone just because you don't happen to believe them for whatever reason. Every comment under this thread has led to further discussion, more information, theories and even some possible evidence that likely would never have come out if certain posts hadn't been made.

I think wise treasure hunter takes in absolutely every scrap of information they possibly can from whatever source is available and keeps compiling it every which way they can. Theories are presented and then reworked and thought out and information is sorted, compared, validated, invalidated etc... until either the final goal is achieved or until one finally gives up.

It serves little purpose to belittle anyone with the same hopes, dreams and idealism that all treasure hunters possess. Disagreeing is fine, but it crosses lines when personal attacks and ridicule is heaped on. If you don't believe someone, fine, state that and move on.

Imho, you never know when that "aha" moment will happen or what tiny shred of information may lead to it. I for one look forward to the day the LDM is actually found (perhaps it already has been), and I can hear the story behind it's discovery. It's that kind of optimism and idealism that fuels the hearts of every treasure hunter.

Good luck to all of you out there searching!

AHH the voice of reason, great input, but you have missed a lot of the posts that blindbowman posted and then removed. as has been stated elsewhere his storys just get bigger and wilder, thats not to say they are not true, but they seem to be made up as he goes along. I have not been here long but in the short time ive been here II have learned the following about the quest for the LDM (as told by bowman)

He first saw the LDM from inside of an aeroplane in 1979 as he passed over the supers in a storm. the storm was so bad that they expirienced a complete white out. But bowman was the only passenger on the plane with the foresight to cover his eyes. he then shielded his eyes as he peered out of the window of the plane and saw the LDM.
At some stage he became a shaman, apparently it was his destiny and he has been enlightened during his shaman trances.
His evidence, or rather lack of it as of to this time has consisted of a picture of his friend standing in front of a cactus at the peralta trail.
He also claims that there is a magnetic field there, strong enough to destroy his camera, infact that magnetic field cost him $650.00 which is awful bad luck and rather silly, why do I say silly? because it was "expedition 2" and he never learned from "Expedition 1" to take precautions.
He makes claims, sometimes realistic sometimes so unbelievable that people question him. when he claims to have evidence and then is asked if he would like to share it, he comes up with some wild story that is just so out there people have started to treat him as a joke.
You are absolutely correct with what you say in your post but you need to research a bit further as far as bowmans posts go, and remember that a good many of them have been removed.

Ever watched Forrest Gump? that guy had some great storys ha? well you just wait till they release Mountain Bowman.

I haven't missed that many of his posts (except for some that were posted and then taken down within a couple hours). And to be honest, although yes my post was primarily directed towards his, I've seen other signs of disrespect and ridicule and it's always surprised me.

Are there inconsistencies and things that sound more like figments of immagination than fact in some people's posts here - absolutely, but I've always felt there may be nuggest of truth in some of the same comments that other people view as delusional rantings. Treasure Hunters are definitely an interesting breed and had I never married, I believe I would have become a serious one myself rather than a weekend metal detectorist, because my heart and mind reaches new heights when I read and listen to stories about REAL treasures.

I think probably what happens, is that people have invested so much of their time, lives and money into their personal searches that it can be infuriating to think that someone else may have "stumbled" onto something they think they deserved to find due to their hard work and research. I think also, once you've invested so much time, work and effort into your search, you begin to put more and more faith into your theory(ies) which makes it significantly more difficult to believe anyone elses theories if they don't agree.

That's the only real explanation I can come up with for why Treasure Hunters who by nature have to be optimistic, open minded and idealistic, can be so skeptical, close minded and mistrusting also.

I guess in my mind, if I were searching hard for the LDM personally and was discussing it with other folks also on the hunt, and I believe BB was delusional at best and a sociopathic liar at worst, I'd just stop wasting my time replying and reading his threads and move on to information that might prove to be useful to me. If however, I believed that anyone who has any potential information (even perhaps some they don't know they have) that could lead me to the ultimate goal of finding my treasure, I'd listen and just weed out the stuff that I can prove factually is not true.

Too many geniouses, discoverers and inventors have been ridiculed prior to their ultimate successes for me to judge anyone's comments unless I'm absolutely 100% confident they are wrong.

On the other hand, perhaps some of you DO know that others here are 100% wrong in some of their statements. Perhaps BB knows where the LDM is and is afraid some of you may find it first so is throwing all sorts of nonsense and "facts" out there to throw you all off his track. Perhaps he's insane and doesn't have a clue what he's talking about. Perhaps some of you believe BB, but are trying to "goad" him into giving up some vital information that he wouldn't normally pass along unless he got pissed off.

Ahhhh hunting treasures and internet forums make for a strange and mighty interesting combination. Take my advice for what it is - probably an idealistic naive viewpoint that everyone has valuable information, and if it's all combined, mixed up, sifted and clarified.... the right answer will pop up.

No matter what, it's all interesting reading and keeps my blood pumping and perhaps one day my "treasure hunting" will consist of more than detecting beaches, lakes and the ground looking for my treasures one at a time.

As I said before - best of luck to all of you out there searching for the "big one." I respect you all!

 

[Seventytwo]

Randy, La barge Spring Number 2 to be exact.
"Fact" this is in the written directions, and part of the Lost Dutchman lore, "First you must pass first water then you must pass Second water."
La Barge Spring Number 2 = second water.

Now if one of you treasure hunters could help me out here. I still haven't mastered my computer, and I need to know how to size down the file of the letter from Wood. Then you all can see what happens when you try for a treasure trove permit for within the Superstitions.

Thanks
Dan Adams

 

[Peerless67]

Randy, La barge Spring Number 2 to be exact.
"Fact" this is in the written directions, and part of the Lost Dutchman lore, "First you must pass first water then you must pass Second water."
La Barge Spring Number 2 = second water.

Now if one of you treasure hunters could help me out here. I still haven't mastered my computer, and I need to know how to size down the file of the letter from Wood. Then you all can see what happens when you try for a treasure trove permit for within the Superstitions.

Thanks
Dan Adams

cant argue with that

 

[Cubfan64]

Personally I don't see the point of ridiculing someone just because you don't happen to believe them for whatever reason.

I think you are correct - and, while my post may have come across as that also, it certainly was not intended that way.

Though, I will say that asking questions about statements made, IMO, is not ridicule.

I think my coordinates were wrong if the area is LeBarge - 2nd water.

B

Please don't think I was trying to single anyone out - I never intended to do that at all - I've just noticed a trend towards more and more uncalled for comments is all.

And I absolutely agree that asking for clarification or questioning something in itself is not ridicule or disrespect at all.

Best of luck

 

[cactusjumper]

All,

Just an opinion here, but we all should expect to receive the same respect, or lack thereof, that we give out.

Some of us habitually show little respect for those who disagree with us. How you disagree is usually more important than the fact that you do disagree.

There are hundreds of examples of folks disagreeing on this site. Here are just two:

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cactusjumper
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Re: The Peralta Stone Maps, Real Maps to Lost Gold Mines or Cruel Hoax?
« Reply #597 on: Jan 19, 2007, 12:53:16 AM » Quote Modify Remove

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Oro,

Someone did find a treasure on the Stone Map trail. His name was Harry LaFrance. One man, that I know of, is still alive and he held the LaFrance gold bars in his hands. My Uncle did as well.

Don't know how familiar you are with the Superstition Mountains, but I made my first trip in forty-eight years ago. There are monuments everywhere! Most of my exploring was done in higher elevations with no trails at all. There were still monuments everywhere.

Everyone will now claim how "easy" it was to figure out the maps. In thirty-five years I have never met a single person who had a clue. Most of them were following someone else's ideas. By all means, I would encourage everyone to seek the end of the trail on Herman's Mountain.

Mike says he probably knows more about those maps than anyone alive. Perhaps that is true.

cj

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the blindbowman
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Re: The Peralta Stone Maps, Real Maps to Lost Gold Mines or Cruel Hoax?
« Reply #598 on: Jan 19, 2007, 06:29:06 AM » Quote

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thats totally bs.. i know where the maps start and end .. .. and yes i have found the LDM and the IMHO the tayopa tunnle and the rock house and the hiden camp , and where the trail starts and ends .. i have seen the LDM in 1979 , anyone else seen it ? , i can prove i found it .....and i will get my permits ....

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I have crossed the line many times, but there was a huge crowd over there.

We should all try to be a bit more civil, but it's not always easy........as you well know.

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Seventytwo]

The Woods Letter, for all of you that have questioned what would happen if you where to find a treasure within the Superstition mountains. this letter says everything that a treasure hunter needs to know. the date is January of 2005 six weeks before I found the Lost Dutchman goldmine a 1/4 mile away from the Heart Stone location.

The thing that gets me most is the wording, he never once tells me that I can not have a treasure trove. But he sure lets me know, that it will be a cold day in hell when I get one.
This letter is only half the reason that I copyrighted the coordinates.

 

[the blindbowman]

"Perhaps BB knows where the LDM is and is afraid some of you may find it first so is throwing all sorts of nonsense and "facts" out there to throw you all off his track"

well stated .. fact

i have found LDM but there is unanswerd questions ....

its not what you think i dont to miss anything .iam creative artistic with autistic tendences ,i cant leave missing parts of the puzzle .. its my nature ...i will not stop untill i have put every peice in its place ... if i fix clocks and locksmith i will find every peice and where it goes ... no matter how unbeleiveable the thoeries around those peice get i will come out of it clear minded and dirrected to a goal ...

if i had one full day there i would have made a find that needs to be in place before i can get the treasure trove permits ... . yes i have part of the evidence now ...it takes leveage to get those permits i well have that after expedition 3 ...

we have deguss what to do if we find the hiden camp frist .. we will try to recover the large cache frist . then back away unseen . and vanish untill we get back to NY..... when i can post picture and have ore samples and have hiden all other evidence where it can not be found , then i will make the clam legal.....

you for got one thing . my brother was on expedition 2 with me ...

he will be back on the 5th of next month !

now where did he go ?

 

[Seventytwo]

Thanks to all of you that help in teaching me how to re size pictures.

Many Thanks
Dan Adams

 

[the blindbowman]

The Woods Letter, for all of you that have questioned what would happen if you where to find a treasure within the Superstition mountains. this letter says everything that a treasure hunter needs to know. the date is January of 2005 six weeks before I found the Lost Dutchman goldmine a 1/4 mile away from the Heart Stone location.


The thing that gets me most is the wording, he never once tells me that I can not have a treasure trove. But he sure lets me know, that it will be a cold day in hell when I get one.
This letter is only half the reason that I copyrighted the coordinates.

what heart stone are you talking about ?

because the real heart stone is not 1/4 mile away from the LDM .

and thank you for proveing my piont ... i need to black mail the danm permit out of their hands ... i told him a total fair tail to see what others had told me was true ..i got the same song and dance you did ...


but got a better idea . if they dont know whats in the treasure they cant prove it can they ! .. its called leverage......i will get my permits even if they dont want to give them out ...... they will not have a choice .....its to easy to cover up things now days ...