She was only 3 days old.

[Bigcypresshunter]

I posted this here last year, but have yet to positively ID. We have some new members and I could get some new thoughts. It is silver and very THIN like a tag and the size of a quarter. Its hand engraved on the front in Old English copperplate script:

Jo-Ann L. Hall
12-30-43--1-2-44

There are some official looking numbers on the back: G-1506.

The back is also hand engraved. The numbers may coincide with a US military grave plot but what cemetery?... What century?

Plot G- Row 15- Grave 06?

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

Wow could I go for hunting that beach right now LOL!

Happy Hunting
J2

Problem now is heavy beach renourishment has buried everything.

 

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[gemee]

For what it's worth, you might keep this in mind; the name JoAnn is a 20th century name. I do not believe I have ever heard of anyone having that name in the 1800's. If they did, it was extemely rare. My vote is for this being from the 1900's., and from an urn-like device.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

For what it's worth, you might keep this in mind; the name JoAnn is a 20th century name. I do not believe I have ever heard of anyone having that name in the 1800's. If they did, it was extemely rare. My vote is for this being from the 1900's., and from an urn-like device.

If its from the 1940's, I am wondering why I cannot find a birth or death record of this child. I actually found a JoAnna Hall born in 1843 Virginia, I believe, but no other record. I can find no record of a 1944 creamation either. Someone found a JoeAnn Hall 1944 Florida Death Index. Maybe a mistake on the engraving? Could a child die in the mid-20th century United States and there be no record of it?
Its been a while since I searched this name. Maybe time for another geneology search.

 

[intimer]

just wanted to add...for what it's worth.

i wouldn't stop with the idea that it's joann hall....just a thought!
i can see joann lohall, lohull, lo.hull, lo. hull. personnally i've never heard of either surname but i notice the o's are all 'closed' at the top. the a in hall may not be.

also, reaching a little further is 'to ann lo. hull' . back in the early 60's late 50's as kids in school we use to write a cursive T like the first letter and we would cross the T about half way done to make an F. we were getting away with it at school.

it was difficult to find an example but the link below gives a variation. also the link has a heck of a lot of fonts to view ...for that odd need to write oddly or say....creatively!
http://www.fonts.com/findfonts/detail.asp?pid=4335330

anyway the topic goes on....

mike

 

[Angelo]

intimer, I thought the same thing and had last week found the following: So, just maybe.

http://www.facebook.com/people/Lo-Hall/1528061468

Tony

 

[Heavy Chevy]

Hello,

I doubt that i can add any information that hasn't been mentioned.
I do wish to thank BigCypress for sharing his story of his hard work in trying to ID the person on the tag.

It is possible that the tag isn't from Florida at all.
Just lost there.

There was something about the two dates that caught my attention.
The two dates are exactly the same dates i have for my great,great,great grandfather and ggg grandmas wedding. I finally came to the conclusion that they were married that Friday evening
(12-30-1843) and then had it recorded at the courthouse on Monday( 01-02-1844.)
Weird how the dates match.

I am of the opinion that it may be grave or cremation tag.
But i have no evidence of that.
But cemeteries are sometimes numbered such as this.

But which cemetery?
It may not even be in Florida.

My mother was born at her home in 1941 in rural Louisiana, delivered by a local doctor.
It is possible someone that lived in a rural area, could have been born and died without notifying the authorities.
There could be a record but where would you begin to look?

Anyway thanks for a very interesting post,
Big Mike

 

[SomeGuy]

Perhaps it's JoAnn L. Hull ?

 

[scubatreasure]

I will go into work tomorrow and check on tags , take some pictures and post my findings....but I'm seeing....Lo hull....the top of the a in hall isn't closed off leading me to believe that it says hull...kinda looks like a period after Lo. so maybe that's an abbreviation of a middle name?...but from what i do know the tags are stamped out on the back....like yours is ....and engraved on the front ....like yours is.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

i wouldn't stop with the idea that it's joann hall....just a thought!
i can see joann lohall, lohull, lo.hull, lo. hull. personnally i've never heard of either surname but i notice the o's are all 'closed' at the top. the a in hall may not be.

also, reaching a little further is 'to ann lo. hull' . back in the early 60's late 50's as kids in school we use to write a cursive T like the first letter and we would cross the T about half way done to make an F. we were getting away with it at school.

mike

intimer, I thought the same thing and had last week found the following: So, just maybe.

http://www.facebook.com/people/Lo-Hall/1528061468

Tony

Perhaps it's JoAnn L. Hull ?

....but I'm seeing....Lo hull....the top of the a in hall isn't closed off leading me to believe that it says hull...kinda looks like a period after Lo. so maybe that's an abbreviation of a middle name?...

Thanks mike, Tony, Limo Bob and SomeGuy. I will have to go back and search geneology under these different names hoping to find a match. I originally thought it was JoAnn LeKull. I am posting another pic highlighting in red the areas in question.

First the bottom "J" loop appears to go way under the other letters. There is a very high dash after "o" that I originally thought crossed the "A". Would that make it Jo-Ann or To- Ann?

Second the loop after "L" doesnt seem like an "o" because it starts on the right and loops around back to the left. Writing an "o" would be the opposite. There is also a period.

Next the "a" or "u". It seems more like an "a" because there is a small turn at the top of the "a", seen under magnification, even though it doesnt touch.

And last, after looking carefully again at the "2's", I believe its possible that the second date is 1-9-44, as Baldingboy suggested. This would make the child 10 days old if a death date. (I dont know if this changes anything). If she lived 10 days in 1944, she may have died in a hospital.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Hello,

I doubt that i can add any information that hasn't been mentioned.
I do wish to thank BigCypress for sharing his story of his hard work in trying to ID the person on the tag.

It is possible that the tag isn't from Florida at all.
Just lost there.

There was something about the two dates that caught my attention.
The two dates are exactly the same dates i have for my great,great,great grandfather and ggg grandmas wedding. I finally came to the conclusion that they were married that Friday evening
(12-30-1843) and then had it recorded at the courthouse on Monday( 01-02-1844.)
Weird how the dates match.

I am of the opinion that it may be grave or cremation tag.
But i have no evidence of that.
But cemeteries are sometimes numbered such as this.

But which cemetery?
It may not even be in Florida.

My mother was born at her home in 1941 in rural Louisiana, delivered by a local doctor.
It is possible someone that lived in a rural area, could have been born and died without notifying the authorities.
There could be a record but where would you begin to look?

Anyway thanks for a very interesting post,
Big Mike

Thanks Big Mike for showing an interest. I was hoping I wasnt boring everyone to death. I am going to have to search more outside of Florida. That area was very lightly populated in 1944. The beaches were used for bombing and Navy Seal training and that makes it unlikely to be lost by someone on the beach or a swimmer. I may check Navy Seals. Could be shipwreck.

 

[rwsnc]

I'd guess that it was a memorial token that the mother wore around her neck on a chain after her baby died. Sad...

 

[relichunters]

I agree with it being a death date tag.

 

[intimer]

that red marking is great. how did you do that

you bring up L. not Lo. and it makes a lot of sense. it's just a heck of a T and L with fancy ending......stuff!
it looks a little like the H is also fancy. then an a or u To - Ann L. Hall or Hull (there's no way it's Hill...right? it's pretty far apart)

as for the dash after To. would the engraver need to save space, so he raised it? the dashes in the 12-30-43 are not in line.

i can't help on the reverse, but the # had to be very important.

good luck with this

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

The red markings are from the old Windows Paint program.

Some members looking at the back numbers, on another thread, tell me that it is modern machine stamped. Under magnification it looks engraved to me. What do yall think on the letters G-1506...STAMPED or ENGRAVED?

I will go into work tomorrow and check on tags , take some pictures and post my findings....but I'm seeing....Lo hull....the top of the a in hall isn't closed off leading me to believe that it says hull...kinda looks like a period after Lo. so maybe that's an abbreviation of a middle name?...but from what i do know the tags are stamped out on the back....like yours is ....and engraved on the front ....like yours is.

sure like to see the tag pics.

 

[pcolaboy]

Man that tag would have given me the chills! Still a very cool find. I wonder if there's a way to determine if a funeral procession would have gone through that area?

Pcola

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Big CH, I have stayed out of this one because I have no idea what your tag is. I do have an idea that I thought I would toss out onto the table though.

Maybe we are looking at this the wrong way.

Go with me here...

It is 1943, you are about to be sent off to die in in the war in Europe. You decide to take a final vacation to go see the ocean that you have never seen. You meet the girl of your dreams, but both of you know that it will only be a couple days of bliss. (I checked, these days were a Thursday, Friday, Saturday and Sunday.) You live it up and she decides to give you a token to remember her by.

Two years later, you finish you duty and return to find this girl you left. You go back to where she lived in Lakecity, only to discover that she has married and has a baby. So you return to the beach where you met... and toss the token that she gave you when she said she'd always remember you!


This story has a thousand different versions, but it can always play out with the token in the surf.

Just an idea for you guys to kick around.

Maybe Dig was onto something...maybe I am looking at this the wrong way. The high dash after Jo- is making me reconsider.. You wouldnt vacation at a test bombing area but some soldiers and maybe workers were stationed here in 1943/44.

I received an e-mail that I thought I would share from a TN member familiar with the area. (I highlighted a sentence in red).
"The Tracking Station was in use during WWII, with a number of soldiers stationed there and at the Vero Beach airfield. This corresponds with the dates on your tag. I don't think that is a mere coincidence. It could be 1843/44, but that part of the east coast of Florida was extremely desolate at that time. Neat find."

Maybe I should be looking for an Ann L. Hall born in the 20's and possibly still alive. The dates may have some other meaning. Love tokens were not popular during 1940's but it may be a momento from a lover before leaving off to war. The numbers could be a phone number or something else of importance. G-1506 could also be a Government number. I wish I could get a list of names stationed at the Tracking Station during WWII to see if there was a Hall. Dont forget German subs were patrolling those waters.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I may be boring some older members but Im bringing this old post back every year so the new members like Breezie, Bramblefind, and many others can get a look at it and may have some ideas.

The best ideas seem to be love token or coffin tag but nothing is definite. If its a medallion, why the engraving G-1506? And why doesnt JoAnn L. Hall's name show up on any search?

Thanks for taking a look.

 

[Breezie]

BCH, I've been studying on this tag, and so far here are my thoughts:
#1 I think the back was stamped because the 5 is slightly higher than the other numbers.
#2 I don't think it is a love token because if the love affair only lasted 3 days, it would have taken longer than that to have it engraved.
#3 Right now, I'm going with the obvious, a 3 year old child died who's name was Jo-Ann, and this is her Coffin Plate, and the number on the back was the plot number.

Bramblefind has access to lots of genealogy; hopefully she can find the name. Remember too, most children born before the 1950s were born at home.


Here is some interesting info:
Silver Casket Plate
This is a silver casket plate from 1888 and came to our
collection from an antique shop in Jackson, Michigan.
It was very common, primarily East Coast, to have an
engraved casket plate present with the body for the
funeral and viewing. At the cemetery, it could stay for
burial or come off for a memorial to the family. This
one is engraved with the deceased’s name, dates and
designs and was framed for a keepsake. Many were
buried to assure identity of the deceased. In the book
“Gone With the Wind”, the Southerners talk about the
disrespect of northern soldiers when they would violate
cemeteries and steal the silver handles and plates ofthe caskets.
http://www.mitchellfh.com/Downloads/FuneralMuseum.pdf

Breezie

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

BCH, I've been studying on this tag, and so far here are my thoughts:
#1 I think the back was stamped because the 5 is slightly higher than the other numbers.

Thanks a lot Breezie for commenting. Many others say its stamped for the same reasoning but I have to wonder. I need to remember that I am seeing it in person under magnification and you are only looking at a pic.
I have tried to enlarge it. I can clearly see the many engraving strokes such as where the top of the 5 comes to a point. It took eight strokes to make the 5. The strokes and points are also visible on the 1 and the other numbers. Anyone that looked in person under magnification said it was engraved.
With all the contradicting opinions on this makes it hard to pic one. I have seen love tokens for a child or birth but I have never seen numbers on the backside of one.

 

[Breezie]

Yes, it is hard to see via a photo, and I'm glad you're able to magnify it in person to make the judgment call. Whether it is engraved or stamped, I still think it is a plot number. I've added a pic for the Silver Coffin Plate. Also, check out this site:
http://www.leviticusjewelry.com/product/164736/Our-Darling-Harness_795595.html
Breezie