She was only 3 days old.

[Bigcypresshunter]

I posted this here last year, but have yet to positively ID. We have some new members and I could get some new thoughts. It is silver and very THIN like a tag and the size of a quarter. Its hand engraved on the front in Old English copperplate script:

Jo-Ann L. Hall
12-30-43--1-2-44

There are some official looking numbers on the back: G-1506.

The back is also hand engraved. The numbers may coincide with a US military grave plot but what cemetery?... What century?

Plot G- Row 15- Grave 06?

 

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[Bigcypresshunter]

BUMP: I decided to bring back this old post to see if anyone has any ideas. It may be a silver love token or mourning token but I still cant figure out what the numbers G-1506 on the back mean or why they are there. I found it at Vero Beach Florida on the Treasure Coast at a known shipwreck location. (a 17oo's Spanish and an 18oo's unknown) about 10 feet deep after 2 consecutive hurricanes washed away the beach in 2004. This location had a small colony and fort (Fort Vinton) in 1842 that failed and was abandoned by 1850. I cannot find the name JoAnn L. Hall in the Florida Death or birth records. Its the exact size of a quarter, but thinner. It says JoAnn L. Hall 12-30-43 -- 1-2-44 Any thoughts?

 

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[trikikiwi]

Bigcy, it's a real treasure, regardless what it was another time.
I would suggest that you have the only remaining 'written record' of JoAnn's short life.

Mike

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Bigcy, it's a real treasure, regardless what it was another time.
I would suggest that you have the only remaining 'written record' of JoAnn's short life.

Mike

I would like to return it to any living relative/descendant.

 

[Kevo_DFX]

It seems to me that if you can find one small piece of the original coin, you can determine age, thenyou narrow down your time frame. The problem is with the possibility of it being an old spanish coin all the way up to SLQ, you don't know where to search effectively.

Have you tried to look at it under a super magnified lighted loupe?

I know that you can use muriatic acid to bring out original detail, but, i don't think I'd want to do this to a beautiful piece of history like you have. I really don't know what the reaction would do though, it may not damage the coin. Are there any chemists on here?

Good luck, and nice piece.

Kevo

 

[trikikiwi]

Bigcy, it's a real treasure, regardless what it was another time.
I would suggest that you have the only remaining 'written record' of JoAnn's short life.

Mike

I would like to return it to any living relative/descendant.

I admire your spirit, Sir

Mike

 

[Woodland Detectors]

It most certainly is some sort of memorabilia of a death I am presuming. Start by finding some Hall family's. It might take a lot of work but if you get lucky maybe you can find the relatives! I do know that the Hall's are prevalent in Naples FL. try there! mike

 

[Baldingboy]

It says JoAnn L. Hall 12-30-43 -- 1-2-44 Any thoughts?

I submit that the date is 12-30-43 -- 1-9-44

Look closely. Just my two cents. It doesn't look like the other two.....Rather a script nine.

Baldingboy

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

It says JoAnn L. Hall 12-30-43 -- 1-2-44 Any thoughts?

I submit that the date is 12-30-43 -- 1-9-44

Look closely. Just my two cents. It doesn't look like the other two.....Rather a script nine.

Baldingboy

I originally thought that myself. I understand it is hard to tell by the picture. My Macro camera is down at the moment, I may try scanning and cropping. I do not know what century it is from but after very close examination with a loupe, I concluded that it does indeed say 1-2-44. I will study it again. If you are correct, then the child would have been 10 days old, died 1-9-44 and I might have to recheck the Florida Death Index.

I want to ad that it is also hand engraved. The letters G-1506 also appear to be engraved not stamped.

Thank you your thoughts, I appreciate all comments and ideas.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

It seems to me that if you can find one small piece of the original coin, you can determine age, thenyou narrow down your time frame. The problem is with the possibility of it being an old spanish coin all the way up to SLQ, you don't know where to search effectively.

Have you tried to look at it under a super magnified lighted loupe?

I know that you can use muriatic acid to bring out original detail, but, i don't think I'd want to do this to a beautiful piece of history like you have. I really don't know what the reaction would do though, it may not damage the coin. Are there any chemists on here?

Good luck, and nice piece.

Kevo

I have a 10x loupe. I cannot see any original coin detail. It is corroded and hard to tell. It is also pretty thin. Holding it in my hand, I tend to believe this is a tag with a nail hole rather than a jewelry piece. Maybe a coffin tag. I originally discarded this as a worthless meter tag. This was found after two huge hurricanes at a Treasure Beach 1715 wrecksite. It may have an 1800's English or American wreck mixed in, I was told by the salvagers. I was disappointed it wasnt a cob. My friend cleaned it (ugh) and revealed the engraving. It is pretty thin and light for jewelry, but maybe. I cannot find any mourning tokens like this online. I was told love tokens were prevalant in the latter half of the 19th century, not 1840's. I wish I knew the century of this piece. I dont think its 1944 because of the engraving style. I believe its from one of the shipwrecks. Very few people lived here in the 1840's. (only the failed colony) Actually, very few people lived here until after WWII. This beach area was used for bombing practice and Navy Seal training during WWII. I think the engraved letters G-1506 are the clue to solving this, or a birth or death record. The "G" may stand for "Government" or "Grave".

Thanks.

It most certainly is some sort of memorabilia of a death I am presuming. Start by finding some Hall family's. It might take a lot of work but if you get lucky maybe you can find the relatives! I do know that the Hall's are prevalent in Naples FL. try there! mike

Thanks Sage.

 

[Michelle]

Hi Cy, this one has been in my mind also since you first posted it...this is a link to Find a Grave...it has a Joann Hall who was born in 1947 died in 1948 in florida cemetery, usually there are email address's attached to family members who can be contacted.,they may have some answers. Meanwhile I too will keep this in mind.

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=12093819&ref=wvr


http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=mr&GRid=12093819&MRid=47018225&

Also, look to the left on the page and there are other cemeteries listed in Florida...Check through those names and contacts as well....Good Luck to You.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

Hi Cy, this one has been in my mind also since you first posted it...this is a link to Find a Grave...it has a Joann Hall who was born in 1947 died in 1948 in florida cemetery, usually there are email address's attached to family members who can be contacted.,they may have some answers. Meanwhile I too will keep this in mind.

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=12093819&ref=wvr


http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=mr&GRid=12093819&MRid=47018225&

Also, look to the left on the page and there are other cemeteries listed in Florida...Check through those names and contacts as well....Good Luck to You.

I see you found a child with the same name that lived only a few months, but the dates dont match. Thanks for searching.
A few years back I was in contact with the Supervisor of the Genealogy Dept. at the Indian River Co. Main Library. She said several Hall families were living there (Indian River County) in 1944. She has an index to all burials and obituaries in the county. Joann is not in these indexes.
She looked in the Florida Death Index for 1944 and there was a Joeann Hall, black female, who died in 1944 in Palm Beach County, 50 miles south.
She also checked the digitized and keyword accessible Vero Press Journal, but nothing came up.
She said there is a possibility of her being part of the Indian River Colony which arrived in 1843 and left in 1849.
She spent much time herself and invited me to come to her library and research for clues.

original 2005 old post: http://forum.treasurenet.com/index.php/topic,19394.0.html




Here is a high resolution scan. The scratches were made by my friend when he scratched off the encrustations, revealing the engraving. He called me up telling me he found writing on the meter tag.

 

[detector de metales]

I agree with PBK, its a mourning token. Given as a token of rememberance. Mourning tokens go back as far as roman times. From metal to textiles to gifts of white gloves ( 1700's) to hymns etc..
What the back represented probably was the grave marker number. Hurricanes can wreak havoc on cemeteries..
J2

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I agree with PBK, its a mourning token. Given as a token of rememberance. Mourning tokens go back as far as roman times. From metal to textiles to gifts of white gloves ( 1700's) to hymns etc..
What the back represented probably was the grave marker number. Hurricanes can wreak havoc on cemeteries..
J2

Most likely... PBK's usually correct...but from what century? What cemetery? From the 1843 failed colony? I guess census, birth and death records were not complete in sparsly settled Florida of the mid-19th century. 20th century deaths should be recorded. It could be shipwreck but I think its American by the way the date is written (M-D-Y) Have you ever seen a grave number marked that way on any token, anywhere? I have a complete name and some dates but I just wish I knew more. Hopefully a descendant surfing the web will google her name one day and this will pop up. Thanks for your comment.

 

[scubatreasure]

I work at a cemetery and that looks like a grave marker with the lot and block number on the back , used today to make it easy to find the spot where the head stone must go

I'm not to good on the historical ones which that would definitely be

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I work at a cemetery and that looks like a grave marker with the lot and block number on the back , used today to make it easy to find the spot where the head stone must go

I'm not to good on the historical ones which that would definitely be

This is what I like about TN we have a wide variety of professions and experience. 8) I already heard from a creamationist and he told me no way to being a creamation tag.

I googled grave marker but cant find anything. Can you explain what the modern grave markers look like and how they are used? Are they round? Do they have a nail hole in them? In your opinion, could the G stand for grave or would it be more likely the lot number? Thanks.

 

[scubatreasure]

I will take some pictures of the ones we have at work and ask some questions...
I've been in the business part time mostly , in 3 different states, for over 27 years
and they look the same as long as I can remember seeing them, these days i mostly see them on the crate that the granite head stone comes in on , then the tag is transferred to a board that denotes that it has arrived and needs to be put in place.

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

I will take some pictures of the ones we have at work and ask some questions...
I've been in the business part time mostly , in 3 different states, for over 27 years
and they look the same as long as I can remember seeing them, these days i mostly see them on the crate that the granite head stone comes in on , then the tag is transferred to a board that denotes that it has arrived and needs to be put in place.

OK great ty. Do they have a name and/or dates on them?

 

[detector de metales]

BigCypress,
Depending on where you found this and the proximity of the "possible" cemetary. You might be able to locate it through a "Cemetary plan" which shows where the plots ( or lots) are.
All newer cemetaries have them and a lot of "Friends" of older cemetaries are reviving the older ones.
Just a thought..
J2

 

[Bigcypresshunter]

BigCypress,
Depending on where you found this and the proximity of the "possible" cemetary. You might be able to locate it through a "Cemetary plan" which shows where the plots ( or lots) are.
All newer cemetaries have them and a lot of "Friends" of older cemetaries are reviving the older ones.
Just a thought..
J2

It was on the beach, about 10 feet deep, near the duneline, across from the Vero Beach Tracking Station, after 2004 hurricanes Frances and Jeanne. She may have been buried on the beach, by the 1842 failed colony, that totaled near a hundred people, mostly Army. This fort was abandoned at the start of the Seminole Indian War in 1850 due to Indian hostilities and records of this failed colony are few. There was a Michael Hall listed in the 1850 Indian River census but its a common name. Maybe a small colony of pilgrims fearful of disease might bury bodies on the beach. I will check into it. I remember teeth and bones being found on other Treasure Coast beach locations presumingly Indians or shipwreck victims.

 

[detector de metales]

Wow could I go for hunting that beach right now LOL!

Happy Hunting
J2