REDs PATRIOTIC BUNKER

[Chadeaux]

it lives!! where you been lately Chadeaux ?

Busy ... Just finished a couple of websites, converted some material into a working ebook for a friend, worked on a bunch of computers, then one of my clients just went and bought a trio of radio stations and now I'm working on some websites for them along with some print stuff for a facebook group and thinking of writing an ebook on one of my favorite subjects - Native American Trail Trees.

 

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[Limitool]

Red, Viking and some others.... I used to shoot competition target archery for years out of Kalamazoo MI. I didn't use re-curves. I shot unlimited freestyle. When I was at Starlight Archery I sat up so many bows and taught so many people how to shoot I can't even remember them all. I won several MI. state titles and qualified in the top 10 two years in a row at the Las Vegas Open in 92' & 93' in the Pro Class (after 2 days only the top fifty in the world qualify for the finals). I was 7th in qualifying in 92' and 2nd in 93'. Both years I fell to 31 place. When I sat up my arrows (for competition) I'd get 4-6 dozen and weigh each shaft and put into like weight piles. After that I'd check each pile for straightness. After that I'd fletch and nock each arrow and re-weigh each pile. Then I'd spend hours with a spotter shooting each pile with the arrows numbered and tracking them where they "hit". During competition if I had to change an arrow out... I'd change the whole set and adjust scope from the data.

When I switched to hunting it was like throwing a basketball into the ocean as compared to target archery at the highest level. I remember in 93' a guy by the name of Dee Wilde and I going shot for shot for 2 days. Dee shot 600 and I shot 599 and lost. Later that afternoon I walked into a bar and there was some other shooters licking their wounds. Terry and Michelle Ragsdale and Frank and Becky Person and others... They were all seasoned pros and I was still learning "how to win".... not shoot. There is a HUGE difference. I realized and learned a lot talking with them... and it wasn't about shooting a bow anymore. Long, long story. If you couldn't AVERAGE 300-w/57-60 spots (every time) you can't begin to learn what these folks know. I'll try and find my old Vegas pics and post.

Wish you guys were closer because that's one thing I could really help you guys out with if you wanted it.

 

[Red James Cash]

Wish you guys were closer because that's one thing I could really help you guys out with if you wanted it.

Before I started shooting a bow a couple of my friends were into compounds.I went over the house one day to have a few beers.One of my friends gave me his old recurve.I took to archery like a duck to water.After a couple of days messing with it I had no problem at all out shooting them.Its in my genes

 

[Oregon Viking]

I'am going with a long bow I believe.

 

[Red James Cash]

I'am going with a long bow I believe.

Thats the only way.I never liked compounds.If a cable breaks in the field your screwed.I just put a new string on my recurve,the old one went into my bugout bag.

 

[Oregon Viking]

Thats the only way.I never liked compounds.If a cable breaks in the field your screwed.I just put a new string on my recurve,the old one went into my bugout bag.

The good thing about compound bows is at full draw you are only holding about 21 pounds. not to mention the 350 FPS and carbon arrows.
So I will still use compound bows. My father in law has a longbow somewhere. It is 20, 30 years old, if not older. I need to find a recurve! What I did with the one I had.......I have no idea.

How many great threads are hiding out there? Like this and the Wolfpack? This forum is to damn big to read everything!

 

[Red James Cash]

Yeah compounds might have their place,just not for me.

How many great threads are hiding out there?

Lots of them before the great purge

 

[Limitool]

JUST SOME INFO, FACTS AND THOUGHTS:

1. High poundage bows are way over-rated. They are much harder to shoot. They are less accurate. Only a VERY seasoned shooter or pro can reproduce accurate shots with a high poundage setup.

2. Arrow speed is very over-rated. The faster the arrow the harder it is to control. Any archer mistakes during the draw, anchor, aim, release and follow through are extremely magnified resulting in larger groups and less accuracy. Especially at longer distances.

3. When you combine a high poundage bow with a light fast arrow it is one of the hardest setup's to control unless your a VERY seasoned shooter or pro. Hitting any bull-eye from 10-30 yds. is EASY... very easy!!! The true measure is can you repeat this feat at a 90% rate. And on a hunting bow that's cranked up with light arrows the test is... Can you hit it on the first shot? These setup's exploit archers flaws not cover them up as some would believe. Other's believe... "Well I can shoot further" but this is a myth. QUESTION: How many arrows out of 10 can you put into a 3" circle at 20 yds.?

4. The less the let-off on a compound bow the more accurate it will be. Only a seasoned shooter or pro can properly exploit the advantages of large let-off ratios. Large let-off ratios exploit archer flaws and the further your target the more it's exploited. And this statement does not include heavy bow weights and light arrows which further compound inaccuracy.

Now if your deer hunting it doesn't take much to bring down a deer (not hogs, bears etc.). To me it's like hitting a marshmallow. I shot MANY, MANY deer using different hunting bows all set up around 50-55 lbs. I always used the Easton chart for the correct high quality shaft and a multiple tipped head. I wanted all the bows stored kinetic energy to be transferred to the arrow so it hit HARD.... NOT FAST. This does NOT happen with a light fast arrow and a high poundage bow.

Think of it like this... If your back or ribs had to take one lick from a 31" willow switch or one from a 31" ball bat which one would you most dread. Both suck but which one? HINT: One will piss you off and the other will completely ruin your day.

Recurve and Long bows do exactly what I tried to explain above concerning transferring energy to the shaft correctly.

 

[releventchair]

The Spaniards were given a demonstration of the longbows effect on chainmail on a stump,Florida I think,and were dismayed at the effect of those slow arrows delivering the amount of energy those small heads produced while penetrating. An arrow is a knife with wings. When used correctly as such it is lethal.
I'm shooting crossbows now, it takes a pair of legs and a solid rotater cuff for a decent long bow shot, but started very young with recurves. When I got into compounds a man last name of King who trained some Olympians started me on the right path with them. Draw,anchor,touch nose to string ,aim and release, let hand drift back.Going to sight pins required changing my anchor point from corner of mouth to bottom of jaw. That was the hardest thing and was a constant concern to remember when hunting for years..
Compound required more time than I was accustomed to shooting instinctively. My first shot of a trial new bow with out sites he coached up/down before the shot and was dead on at twenty. Once form is proper and a lot of arrows are shot it is only shooting a few a day to keep pace with changing vision and muscle memory to keep that first shot right on the money. Some muscles seem only to be used for archery. Some of those archers in olde England were molested from there rests and after being x-rayed were found to have altered shoulder joints and arm bones from years of shooting those stout yew bows.

 

[Limitool]

Many people decide to shoot a bow by the dominate hand they use. I shot left handed for 2 years because I was left hand dominate. Then I learned that I was right eye dominate and switched to shooting right handed. THAT TOOK SOME TIME AND PATIENCE! But after I switched and a few years more I was shooting professionally. I was one of those "weird" people who did many activities both handed. Ping pong left handed, archery right handed, pool right handed, bat left handed, write left handed and shoot gun right handed....?

As releventchair stated above about muscle memory... it is a beautiful thing when it honestly becomes "memory". But this takes 10 of 1000's of correct shots being taken. Unless you can put 9-10 arrows out of 10 into a 3 inch bulls eye at 20 yds. you do NOT have "muscle memory". Or, you are shooting an incorrect set-up or you do not have the correct form on how to set up an archery shot to be repeatable.

When I shot the huge national tournaments I did just the opposite of what "logic" would dictate. I shot low poundage @ 36 lbs. with then the largest shaft available... 2512's. I shot very heavy tips @ 175 grains and with my arrows cut 5" TO LONG. My arrow speed was 131 ft./p/second. But shooting this set up was just as hard as shooting the opposite setup's because only a seasoned shooter or pro could do it. So why do it? At 36 lbs. pulling this weight as correctly after 60 shots was easier than 60+ lbs. And shooting the largest arrow shaft made my bulls-eye "larger". But it was VERY HARD to shoot this very heavy weight out of a low weight bow. The arrow needed to paradox so I had to add weight and length until I got it "just right" to repeat. In 92' Vegas Shoot 5 out of the top fifty shooters shot this set up. And all five were in the top 10 of the fifty. Next year many of the worlds best shooters had figured it out also and thus the new "Vegas Round" was invented. The bulls eye was greatly reduced. But the best shoots just shot better "because" of the smaller bull.... Go figure!!!!

 

[Oregon Viking]

JUST SOME INFO, FACTS AND THOUGHTS:

1. High poundage bows are way over-rated. They are much harder to shoot. They are less accurate. Only a VERY seasoned shooter or pro can reproduce accurate shots with a high poundage setup.

2. Arrow speed is very over-rated. The faster the arrow the harder it is to control. Any archer mistakes during the draw, anchor, aim, release and follow through are extremely magnified resulting in larger groups and less accuracy. Especially at longer distances.

3. When you combine a high poundage bow with a light fast arrow it is one of the hardest setup's to control unless your a VERY seasoned shooter or pro. Hitting any bull-eye from 10-30 yds. is EASY... very easy!!! The true measure is can you repeat this feat at a 90% rate. And on a hunting bow that's cranked up with light arrows the test is... Can you hit it on the first shot? These setup's exploit archers flaws not cover them up as some would believe. Other's believe... "Well I can shoot further" but this is a myth. QUESTION: How many arrows out of 10 can you put into a 3" circle at 20 yds.?

4. The less the let-off on a compound bow the more accurate it will be. Only a seasoned shooter or pro can properly exploit the advantages of large let-off ratios. Large let-off ratios exploit archer flaws and the further your target the more it's exploited. And this statement does not include heavy bow weights and light arrows which further compound inaccuracy.

Now if your deer hunting it doesn't take much to bring down a deer (not hogs, bears etc.). To me it's like hitting a marshmallow. I shot MANY, MANY deer using different hunting bows all set up around 50-55 lbs. I always used the Easton chart for the correct high quality shaft and a multiple tipped head. I wanted all the bows stored kinetic energy to be transferred to the arrow so it hit HARD.... NOT FAST. This does NOT happen with a light fast arrow and a high poundage bow.

Think of it like this... If your back or ribs had to take one lick from a 31" willow switch or one from a 31" ball bat which one would you most dread. Both suck but which one? HINT: One will piss you off and the other will completely ruin your day.

Recurve and Long bows do exactly what I tried to explain above concerning transferring energy to the shaft correctly.

This was my father in laws. 68 1/2 long. not sure of the poundage. My wife thinks it could be 50 + years old. It was maybe his as a kid. Wife said....nope leave it be, hang it on the wall. Tomorrow, I will take a look at the recurve, not an heirloom, I might use it!!

 

[Oregon Viking]

Oh hell yeh!! I read all 44 pages. Apple pie moonshine, toys (junk), V8 vegas, big caliber air rifles, 10 mile Wi-Fi, fishing...and those who don't, cold weather, sheds..big snails,....and a slight distubance in the force.

 

[BC1969]

Figured you read through the thread from the like spam I should repost that 10 mile WiFi dish, best thing ever.
by the way, that bow you posted above...beautiful.

Mike

 

[Oregon Viking]

This was my father in laws. 68 1/2 long. not sure of the poundage. My wife thinks it could be 50 + years old. It was maybe his as a kid. Wife said....nope leave it be, hang it on the wall. Tomorrow, I will take a look at the recurve, not an heirloom, I might use it!! View attachment 1051052View attachment 1051053View attachment 1051054View attachment 1051055View attachment 1051056View attachment 1051057View attachment 1051058View attachment 1051059View attachment 1051060View attachment 1051061View attachment 1051062

So......I see the numbers, on this bow...info? bros? Lemon wood...brand?

 

[Oregon Viking]

Figured you read through the thread from the like spam I should repost that 10 mile WiFi dish, best thing ever.
by the way, that bow you posted above...beautiful.

Mike

Thank you!
Thats one thing I was always good at...speed reading. Teacher in school tested me well, always thought I was cheating! Louis L'Amour books?
"bout an hour..hour and a half.

 

[Crispin]

Anybody have any thoughts on the Springfield XDS 9mm?
Thanks,
Crispin

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

I have the Springfield XDs .45, same gun just different caliber.... Springfield makes some nice guns...

Use 124gr or 142 gr hollowpoint ammo for self-defense and the 115gr FMJ for target practice...

 

[GMD52]

Hey Crisp, handgun well made, functional, lightweight, and simple to manipulate.....easily concealed and most important accurate......use 115 JHP ammo, and fear nothing....good to hear from you again......Gary

 

[Red James Cash]

Anybody have any thoughts on the Springfield XDS 9mm?
Thanks,
Crispin

Do yourself a favor crispin,stay away from 9mms.To under powered.It is not a reliable man stopper.A .357 magnum revolver is much more versatile.You can fire 3 different cartridges in a .357 revolver, .38 special,.38 special +P and full load .357magnum,each of those cartridges is a step above the other in power.If youre buying for home defense a pistol isnt it.It either a 12 gauge or a 20 gauge shotgun.

 

[Treasure_Hunter]

9mm has more stopping power than .38... You will be fine with 9mm...

"The 9mm Luger meets these requirements with quality ammunition just as good as the .40 S&W and 45 ACP. The FBI 9mm test don't lie! Any brand of premium 9mm 124gr or 147gr JHP has the stopping power do the job!

My favorite is the 124gr hollowpoint ammo for defense. I use any brand I can get a good deal on. The reason for the 124gr choice is; I can practice with the low price 115gr FMJ made by Remington UMC and Winchester white box. The 124gr point of impact out to 15 yards is almost identical to the 115gr FMJ.

Your Captain, Chief, or sheriff may be old school and remember some of the 9mm pistols from 25 years ago that were cheap made or very heavy. He may also remember the crappy 9mm ammo from 25 years ago too. This is why so many officers are required to carry lower capacity 40 S&W or 45 ACP pistols, even though you may run out of ammo in a gunfight. The FBI has tested todays 9mm ammo and it has proven to be just as terminal as 40 S&W or 45 ACP. Cops carry 9mm pistols In Europe, Russia, Japan, China, Korea, India, and the middle east. Over 90% of the world's police use 9mm!
Premium 9mm ammunition cost as much as 45% less, thus giving police officers more range time without breaking the budget."

CCI Speer Ammo (Gov. Test) Bare Gelatin Expansion
9mm Gold Dot JHP 115gr 12.8" 0.67"
9mm Gold Dot JHP 124gr +P 13.40" 0.68"
9mm Gold Dot JHP 147gr 14.80" 0.57"
40 S&W Gold Dot JHP 165gr 13.05" 0.65"
45 ACP Gold Dot JHP 185gr 11.95" 0.68"

http://www.best9mm.com/9mmballistics.html