Reality?

[Springfield]

Thanks Tramp. It seems so much easier from our distant perspective, but you are the one on the spot. We all hope the best for you ... and will redouble our patience.

 

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[Oroblanco]

Bodi wrote

If the Jesuits never mined, or had/owned slaves then why the reference and the name in the waybill of tayopa? Or the reference to the cross in the Molina document?

The Tayopa inventory list simply lists Church property, as one argument, items which were probably obtained by generous gifts from benefactors. This would be tax exempt and not require the use of slaves or mining. As to the Sister Molina document, my friend, it allegedly refers to the Tumacacori mission and most believe it to be a hoax.

Bodi also wrote

I would agree with you, if the treasure was on a current property owned by the church or Jesuits. What if it were found on private property? Government property? Obviously it originally belonged to them, however since they lost it, (I am assuming that they don't know where it is) would they have any claim to it?

If any treasure were found on private property or government property which was clearly originally the property of the Church, then the Church will very likely sue to try to obtain possession. The Church is eternal, so it does not matter if the property was misplaced for a day or a century, it still is Church property my friend.

Cordially,
Devil's Advocate

PS (not speaking as the DA) but I love the photos Don Jose - and I too am still keeping fingers crossed that you will get to see that chamber opened in your lifetime.

PPS - how am I doing amigos - does it sound like our absent friend L-----?

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

G'd morning DA, join us for coffee?? but bring yer own sock. A side thought, while I posted the pictures simply to show progress on the combined Tayopa project, there isn't enough basic data in them, or any that I post, to do any ill wisher any effective good. This is one reason I cannot post far more photographs, they have to be heavily censored.. Apologies room.

While there is no doubt on what we have Oro de Tayopa, there is a delicate line between Gov't cooperation and confiscation. While we do have some serious political backing, it is still a long drawn out process, typical of any gov't.

Sorry my friends but I cannot go into further detail at the moment. While the gov't knows exactly what I post, as soon as I post, and keeps the project under view, one must remember each and every word posted goes out to the entire world, not just here in this forum.

There are others with a share plan in mind, some without a share thought.

Incidentally, this applies to both Gov't's since all em's of American citizens out side of the us 'are' monitored.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Bodie: your coffee. you posted ==>I am not saying that anyone has found Tayopa, and personally I have my doubts. My question is if someone has, then where are the pics? Where is the church treasure? Why hasn't it been revealed to the public? Nat Geo would certainly do some kind of show
~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Perhaps Nat GEo might, but since I am a duly elected member of the Elite Explorers Club they would (will) have first opportunity. Incidentally both organizations often work together.

For fun check --> The Explorers Club.

Don Jose de La Mancha

View attachment 908880View attachment 908881

 

[Oroblanco]

G'd morning DA, join us for coffee?? but bring yer own sock. A side thought, while I posted the pictures simply to show progress on the combined Tayopa project, there isn't enough basic data in them, or any that I post, to do any ill wisher any effective good. This is one reason I cannot post far more photographs, they have to be heavily censored.. Apologies room.

While there is no doubt on what we have Oro de Tayopa, there is a delicate line between Gov't cooperation and confiscation. While we do have some serious political backing, it is still a long drawn out process, typical of any gov't.

Sorry my friends but I cannot go into further detail at the moment. While the gov't knows exactly what I post, as soon as I post, and keeps the project under view, one must remember each and every word posted goes out to the entire world, not just here in this forum.

There are others with a share plan in mind, some without a share thought.

Incidentally, this applies to both Gov't's since all em's of American citizens out side of the us 'are' monitored.

Don Jose de La Mancha

Speaking as Devils Advocate;

Well my friend, you seem to have no evidence showing in your photos, that there ever was any Jesuit activity of any kind there. I see no crosses nor mission church, not so much as an IHS inscription. Clearly what you have found then is not a Jesuit mission but more than likely an old unknown Spanish mining area, which as you know was what the Jesuits were working so hard to protect the poor innocent Indios from being enslaved to work in. Therefore there is no Jesuit treasure nor Church treasure to be found, since it was not a Jesuit mission.

Sincerely,
Devils Advocate

PS - not as DA: I know that all of our words are being read, almost as fast as we type them, however as none of us are involved in any kind of illegal activity, the only danger is in giving away too much information as to the exact locations of the mines etc. I don't expect you are planning to do that, nor would I wish you to.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

He He now I need coffee, even if it 'is' made by an unbeliever, Oro de Tayopa, you posted---> I don't expect you are planning to do that, nor would I wish you
to.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Right you are, you have been waiting for almost 400 years, you can wait a few more weeks/months. if necessary a year.
But you will see it.


Don Jose de La Mancha

p.s. Do you honestly believe that if any of those things were visible, that it would hve been lost for over 400 years?

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Oro de Tayopa, after you serve coffee, I will let you solve a thingie with crosses, it is inside of shallow cave on the entry to the Tayopa zone/ complex.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

ED you too?? My father always confided that they had found mi in a corrall under an ole squatchie.

Yer in luck Ed they are still having a Christmas sale on self hypnosis discs,,including a recall one

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[Oroblanco]

HaHaHa...Don Jose...Maybe I'll take one of those hypnosis discs...If they'll barter a teeny piece of my ore for it...LOL...I had a sudden realization after I posted my last message...IMHO...It may be best that I can't convince my family of my discoveries...They may become flooded with sudden urges for riches of this world... And I just may have a slip up by letting someone follow me to their locations...I could handle losing one location...But what would I do IF by some unforeseeable circumstance someone followed me to two seperate locations Maybe it is best if I don't sell any of my specimens...Dang...Does God love me or what I wonder how many people have had the fortune to discover a Platinum and a Diamond deposit Oh well...I wonder if I could become rich if I really wanted to

Ed T

Ed you are already rich - think of your platinum and diamonds as bank accounts, and besides you are rich in friends as well. It is far harder for someone to hijack your assets when they are still inside the rock, and only you know where the rock is located. Precious metals and gem stones do not usually lose value, unlike paper currencies, so your "hard assets" hidden in the rock are actually a much safer and more sound way to store your wealth, than to have it in a bank account where it loses value daily (inflation/devaluation of currency) and attracts the wrong kind of attention - including long-lost relatives seeking financial help.

One last thing Ed - the Lord speaks to all of us, just that some of us fail to listen.

Which brings up a part of the issue for Don Jose and Tayopa. It is true that a mining claim does not cover treasure troves, and vice-versa; however to obtain a treasure trove claim, you first must prove that you have found the treasure trove, meaning it will have to be opened up and documented enough to apply for the claim. As I understand Mexican law, if it is on govt land, the govt gets half off the top for treasure trove. A big bite but judging by the Tayopa Inventory, would still leave a sizable amount to cut up between the partners. If it is on private land I don't think the govt gets half, the landowner gets it, but still this would be taxable I think as a capital gains but then Mexican tax law is not my area of expertise.

Don Jose, el Tropical Tramp - speaking as Devil's Advocate - you have assumed that an IHS inscription and/or crosses would be sticking up somewhere like a billboard sign, which is not necessarily the case. A cross even if left standing, could have fallen over or been knocked down, and an inscription could be on the entrance to a tunnel etc and not readily visible to passers by. So your case is far from solved, my friend!

Oroblanco

 

[Oroblanco]

Ed - choosing to NOT stick your hand into a bear trap is not cowardice, it is wisdom!

Have patience and faith - no crime group has ever managed to take over a state or a country for any extended length of time. The people will not stand for it. Maybe it is time for a revolution in old Mexico. Where is Pancho Villa and Zapata when you need them?

To try to tie this back into the topic - this raises another issue for Tayopa and its current owner - the danger from drug lords and smugglers. This is a much more immediate and acute danger than governmental interference or meddling. As the location is fairly far from the US border, perhaps it is not as bad as it could be, but remains something to keep in mind.

Oroblanco

 

[Oroblanco]

Hmm Ed can't find a thing to argue there - seems you are already a wealthy man in many ways!

Good luck and good hunting amgio, I hope you always find the treasures that you seek.
Oroblanco

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Ed, there is alarming trend in your post, please watch it in the future. You posted -->
I hope that Don Jose truly has discovered Tayopa.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\

Hope ?? hope?? nah, it is a done fact. Go review the Tayapa posts if you have any silly doubts. Maybe I can repost any missing points.


Oro, a treasure that is found on private land is generally split between the landowner and the searcher, if the split is arranged before finding, then it is split accordingly , if not, the it belongs to the land owner.. In the case of a mineral deposit, basically the same , with the exception that a previous agreement is not necessary, and mineral rights, being important to the economy, have a basic priority, so if the land owner and the title holder can't come to an agreement, the case is referred to the proper dept in Mexico city for arbitration.

Course sneaky gringo landers will always resort to equally devious manners to grab all.

However rest free, "Real de Tayopa" is not one of them, it will be handled as an Executor of an Estate.


Don Jose de La Mancha ( Tilting windmills, such as a 'Devil's advocate')

 

[Oroblanco]

Hola amigo - I was going by the old Spanish law, in which a landowner gets half, or if on public lands, govt gets half. Half of the Tayopa inventory list would still be quite a chunk of change.

 

[Rawhide]

I love the pictures. This is all good info, no matter what you believe. I keep waiting, and will wait.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

open for mineral fileings in any event my friend.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

See you in the morning for coffee ED

Don Jose de La Mncha

 

[Oroblanco]

ED you have disappointed me - you are a poet, correct? You should have had NO trouble coming up with a "family oriented" saying for the young, as

Young and dumb and full of RUM

Young and dumb and my head was NUMB

Young and dumb and all left THUMB

Young and dumb and just a BUM

Young and dumb and just plain AWESOME

etc.

Good luck and good hunting amigo, I hope your platinum lode pays you well!

I have no idea how to tie this in to the thread.

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

Drink yer coffee while it is hot, ya sheep herder in disguise. Remember eventually you have work to do up at Tayopa as well as writing the book.

Don Jose de La Mancha

 

[Oroblanco]

Drink yer coffee while it is hot, ya sheep herder in disguise. Remember eventually you have work to do up at Tayopa as well as writing the book.

Don Jose de La Mancha

No amigo, it has always been your destiny to recover the treasures of Tayopa, you ought to know that by now. And as far as the book goes, you have already promised to do that, while I never did agree to it. It would hardly be right for someone that had never even seen Tayopa, to write the book, and besides, it is your life which is so intimately interwoven with Tayopa, which remains just a vision for me.

Many people are waiting for YOUR book amigo. Including me!
Oroblanco

 

[Real de Tayopa Tropical Tramp]

k Oro de Tayopa --> Veni vidi vinci <-- does that cover the Tayopa Story adequately?

Don Jose de La Mancha

p.s. sides many authors have written about things or occurances in which they personally never participated.