Lue Map

[Daryl Friesen]

Does anyone there know just how Karl Von Mueller died?

Daryl

www.spindlequest.com/treasuremaps3.html

 

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[Lenablu]

I'm new to this, and I find this a fascinating topic, and thanks for all the insight in so many new directions.

 

[bevo]

I have never met karl.but his writing practically oozes with truth.I still read #7 over and over.
he was an old schooler,and I wish there were more like him.

 

[Old Bookaroo]

Friends:

I was going through a bound collection of Karl von Mueller's National Prospector's Gazette newspapers (writing it up to put it on eBay) when I came across a fascinating article on the LUE.

For all practical purposes, everything known about the LUE treasure comes from "Karl" (Charles Dean Miller). If you see a copy of the famous map, it was copied from The Treasure Hunter's Manual #7.

The NPeeGee piece is the most detailed examination of the legend I've found to date. I remember a brief reference to the LUE in a Western Treasures magazine question and answer column written by Karl. And Fred Dorick's book Treasures Galore (published in Segundo, by the way) has a chapter on it. Karl sold that book himself - but later didn't think much of it.

"The word LUE is derived from the first letters of three words that appear on the map...The original map copied and reproduced in THM-7 was owned by a man in Phoenix. The map had been in his family for years and has been seen by dozens of people prior to 1960. Despite this, there are several others who claim to have the original map in their possession."

I found this fascinating: "A book published in the 1890s has an almost exact copy of the original map in it. The map is also in an unpublished manuscript in the library or archives in Santa Fe."

Experienced treasure hunters know there is a sign in "Deek Gladson's" Treasure of the Valley of Secrets that is quite similar to parts of the LUE map.

Karl wrote "One thing that has been completely ignored by almost everybody who has engaged in the successful or unsuccessful pursuit of the LUE is that several or possibly as many as 10 caches similar to the LUE have been uncovered in Mexico."

Remember - THM #7 describes the LUE as a "natural Fort Knox."

Finally, researchers might find it useful to know that "Certain documents of the Smithsonian Institution and at lease one bulletin of the Bureau of American Ethnology have glaring references to the LUE but under entirely different nomenclature...Here is where the experienced researchers who is fully informed and aware of his subject is able to capture facets that are ignored by or elude the inexperienced or unperceptive researcher. There are also publications of at least one, and possibly two, state historical societies that provide almost pipeline directions."

The article may be found in the October-November 1969 (Vol. 6, No.2) issue.

Good luck to all,

~ The Old Bookaroo

 

[Corporate Investigations]

Some interesting comments here.

If any one is interested I might have a lead that might uncover the origins of the story.

Corp

 

[Springfield]

Some interesting comments here.

If any one is interested I might have a lead that might uncover the origins of the story.

Corp

Of course we're interested. Care to elaborate?

 

[Corporate Investigations]

Of course we're interested. Care to elaborate?

Charles Dean Miller at one time had associated with a Californian treasure hunting club where some have claimed he first saw a copy of the "Lue map" Even back then there was speculation of its origin.

I congratulate Old bookaroo on some brilliant observations as that was origins of the Lue. Two key points he raised one that an unpublished document in the Santa Fe Archives and references in the Smithsonian institute. The Date of 1890 is interesting as it predates the alleged Nazi theories as the Nazi party did not exist in its last form, except for Thurle ultima society in Germany from memory. So I leave that line of thought to the conspiracy theorists.

One should ask why would such a institution as the Smithsonian institute mention such a document? Clearly this connection is some thing to be investigated deeper.

The Smithsonian at one time acquired the papers of George Davidson from the Californian academy of Sciences after his death. George Davison had an friendship with a man called James Lick.

James Lick was one of the most wealthiest men in California who was known by some as a grumpy old miser but could be at times a marvelous benefactor to society.

Despite his eccentricities, Lick is best remembered for his strong will and determination, his ambition and drive, his honesty and generosity. Yet there lingers about the edges of these harder qualities, a shade of resignation, even fatality. Once, while carrying an ox-yoke on his shoulders, he was overtaken by a friend with a horse and wagon who offered him a ride. Lick thanked the man but declined. His friend then asked if he wouldn't at least put the heavy yoke in the wagon. "So far in life", he replied, "I have born my yoke patiently, and I will not shirk my duty now".

One evening in his 77th year, alone in the kitchen of his Santa Clara homestead, Lick collapsed from a severe stroke. In the morning he was found, alive but helpless, by his foreman, Thomas Fraser, a man who, years before, had earned a job by unquestioningly following Lick's orders to stack and restack a pile of bricks in the rubble of a burnt house. Lick lived another three years, but never completely regained his health.

His estates now included, in addition to many properties in San Francisco and the Santa Clara Valley, holdings on the shores of Lake Tahoe, a huge ranch in Los Angeles County, and all of Santa Catalina Island off the southern California shore. He was among the richest men in a state noted for its riches.

Lick's infirmity forced him to move to a room in his San Francisco hotel, where he could be more easily cared for. It was there that he turned his attention to the disposition of his fortune, formulating a variety of bequests ranging from public baths to a home for aging widows, from a generous donation to an orphanage to one for the prevention of cruelty to animals, from the foundation of a vocational school to monuments honoring his parents and grandfather.

Never far from his mind, however, was the monument he wished to leave to his own memory. At first, Lick wanted to set aside a million dollars to erect enormous statues of himself and his parents, so tall as to be visible far out to sea. This plan was abandoned when a friend pointed out that the monumental statues would make vulnerable targets in the event of a naval bombardment. The scheme was replaced by an even grander one: a pyramid, larger than the Great Pyramid in Egypt, to be built in downtown San Francisco upon a block which he entirely owned! But, to the lasting benefit of science - if not to the San Francisco tourist trade - Lick's thoughts were turned from pyramids to telescopes by the efforts of George Davidson of California Academy of sciences.

The "Lue" was I believe part of series of drawn ideas of monuments by James Lick during the years before he died. His drawing was later taken out of context by others as a possible treasure map few years after Licks death with the originator and context of the drawing forgotten.

The lost James Licks drawing via the scattered papers of George Davidson became this alleged mystery "Lue" map to a fortune in treasure.

Corp

 

[Old Bookaroo]

CI:

Thank you for a very interesting post! Perhaps James Lick was the "Big 1/2." Although today I guess that would be "0.50."

I certainly appreciate your kind words, and I will take them in the spirit in which they were offered. However, I can't sail under false colors. I was quoting an article written by the Old Man - KvonM. Any wisdom found in that post is his.

Any errors? Probably mine.

Good luck to all,

The Old Bookaroo

 

[Old Bookaroo]

I believe I've posted this before - however, I think it is worth repeating.

This is a page from Treasure of the Valley of Secrets (Segundo, Colorado: 1971). It's a rare item (I'm asking about $250 for the one copy I'm willing to part this at this time).

Anyway - because it is so scarce I'd like to share this sign. I think it has a remarkable similarity to the LUE Map.



Good luck to all,

~The Old Bookaroo

 

[Springfield]

... This is a page from Treasure of the Valley of Secrets (Segundo, Colorado: 1971). It's a rare item (I'm asking about $250 for the one copy I'm willing to part this at this time). ...

Pricey, but this publication, like the 'Black Book' and others, is, IMO, a message - 'a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma', as Churchill once said. KvM is an enigma himself - some say he was an insider, some say he was a fraud. Certain other TH writers were also suspected of providing coded inside information in their writings, eg Dobie, Fish. IMO, treasure researchers are well-served reading what KvM had to say, and TVS is one of my prized possessions.

I think you are right on target linking TVS with the LUE and the LUE map. Lots of folks have opinions about the LUE, but exactly what it is, where it is, who put it there and why it's still there (at least as presented by KvM) is still blowing in the wind. I have no strong opinion on the matter, but I think it's interesting that KvM's residence was near the Purgatoire headwaters.

 

[Old Bookaroo]

springfield;

We all know people can say whatever they want. KvonM's body of work speaks for itself. For my money he is largely responsible for the modern version of treasure hunting most of the people here on TN practice.

Dobie was a folklorist who sent out into the field and gathered the legends and stories first-hand. Fish, in my opinion, portrayed himself as a professional treasure hunter but he found very little himself. His booklet certainly isn't going to help anyone find anything. There are several folks out there today who are remarkably similar to him.

I think KvonM often moved to be close to a Big Casino. Your guess is on the money.

Good luck to all,

~The Old Bookaroo

 

[markmar]

I believe I've posted this before - however, I think it is worth repeating.

This is a page from Treasure of the Valley of Secrets (Segundo, Colorado: 1971). It's a rare item (I'm asking about $250 for the one copy I'm willing to part this at this time).

Anyway - because it is so scarce I'd like to share this sign. I think it has a remarkable similarity to the LUE Map.

View attachment 851499

Good luck to all,

~The Old Bookaroo

Lue map , nice challenge . I agree how the carvings in the book , was a inspiration for the Lue map .
I have a work about Lue map and I will explain soon ( maybe tomorrow ) .

 

[markmar]

And now , the Lue map description .



The Lue map , has two parts :
The left ( first ) , which describe the location and how to use the gap signs in the right ( second ) map to find the entrance of the cave .
The right ( second ) , which is up side down , is a map , and shows the location of the triangle ( pyramid ) and the dimension of the triangle in relation with the eye .
All the important clues ( drawings ) are ground shapes .
And now , the description of the first map :



The triangle is vertical to a mountain side and has orientation NW . This mountain , on the other side , has six peaks ( or more ) and five canyons . Under the triangle are gold bars like a wall and warning how the entrance is closed ( builted ) . The triangle is divided in three parts , and shows how to use the gap signs in the second map .
The second map :
This map is up side down , and must to turn it . The eye is under the real triangle ( the small in the centre ) and for that has the same orientation NW . The sawtooth arrow on the left , shows how the mountain with the peaks is to the left and up from the eye . The triangles on the top , show how we must to find a method to make a triangle , and the triangle with a circle warning how if we find a method to make a triangle , we will find the entrance of the cave in the real triangle .
To make a triangle , you must to draw straights lines in the scheme of the map in the directions which shows and after , two lines from the corners to the top of the small ( real ) triangle . Like in this picture :



We see a triangle like in the first map . The centre of the eye shows the entrance . The only thing which remain is to find the location . From my investigation the entrance is few decade yards out of wilderness area . I post pictures with the eye and the real triangle , such as they can be seen in the area .

 

[markmar]

Nobody do comments ? Never mind . Maybe you are not interested to find the location , and you want just to debate about his origin .
When I have an egg and a chicken , I don't think , and I don't care who of these been the first in the evolution , but I eat both .

 

[Old Bookaroo]

I was going through a bound collection of KvonM's National Prospector's Gazette; Geological Digest for the Miner and Lapidary that just sold on eBay and I found this interesting piece on the LUE:



This is from the December [1969] - January 1970 issue - Vol. 6, #3.

Good luck to all,

~The Old Bookaroo

2.0: I am also packing up a copy of KvonM's Encyclopedia of Buried Treasure Hunting (San Francisco: 1990). I looked in this remarkably comprehensive book - and the LUE isn't mentioned!

 

[markmar]

Old Bookaroo

IMO , the Lue is closer to the Mexican border .

 

[Corporate Investigations]

Some interesting posts here.

Once again thanks Old bookaroo for the interesting posts. It certainly highlights one various interpretations. I gather that was all from 20th century books?

Markmar interesting and clear interpretation of the alleged map. However one can only claim they have actually found the location when they have the treasure in their hands does it not? Otherwise all you have is an interesting theory just as interesting as many other alleged theories.

Corp.

 

[Old Bookaroo]

CI TN:

Yes - those references are all from the 20th Century.

Good luck to all,

~The Old Bookaroo

 

[Corporate Investigations]

In some respects looking at this alleged Map. It does seem to give a 1930's art deco type style to it?

Perhaps that betrays 20th century origins?

Markmar you have made some interesting observations on the symbolism so far. Have you done any in depth research on the origins of the document?

Thanking you in advance.

Corp

 

[Springfield]

Old Bookaroo

IMO , the Lue is closer to the Mexican border .

Interesting ... why do you say this?