JESSE JAMES AND THE KNIGHTS OF THE GOLDEN CIRCLE A JOINT VENTURE

[Rebel - KGC]

just knowing the biblical story is all they expect from you. Translations are for preachers. LOL! L.C.

LOL!

 

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[Rebel - KGC]

"Hay Guys. I know it is not a credible book, But "Jesse James Was One of His Names" has some good information in it on these matters. J. Frank Dalton (Jesse W. James) " I found it on disk for 75$. It's a good read, but it seems to be simi fiction to me. Just my 2 cents.

It was FREE, on the "Net", years ago; read it & thought it was interesting. Felt like it was 1/2 truth stuff...

 

[Pinwheel]

It was FREE, on the "Net", years ago; read it & thought it was interesting. Felt like it was 1/2 truth stuff...

Yes it is, But is that not how you hide something in plain sight? To do it in such a way folks just will not pay attention to it?

Pinwheel

 

[Hillbilly Joe]

Yes it is, But is that not how you hide something in plain sight? To do it in such a way folks just will not pay attention to it?

Pinwheel

My wife said if she ever wanted to hide something from me she would just put in the refridgerator, as I cant find the ketchup, so I am not likely to find anything else in there!

 

[Rebel - KGC]

My wife said if she ever wanted to hide something from me she would just put in the refridgerator, as I cant find the ketchup, so I am not likely to find anything else in there!

Want fries with that...?

 

[Citiboy289]

LC - any link between JJ and Oklahoma ? I have an elderly neighbor who told me a story a few years ago , I plan to see him this weekend maybe I can get additional facts You never know

I took my friend to brunch this AM ( he is 83 ) and we discussed his story about JJ in Oklahoma He is what he said on his grandfathers farm in Sapula OK , He and his grandfather ( when he was about 10 ) found a cave on a hill side , They crawled into the cave and among iron pots , and junk the found a stone with JJ carved into it --- They took the stone from the cave and went back to the farm. It sat there for about 5 years till my friend mentioned it to someone at the local museum , The grandfather took it to the SAPULA Museum in town and about 6 months later A person from the Museum contacted the grandfather and said that the writing on the stone matched JJ , The grandfather said he would donate it to the Museum ------ According to my friend the piece was still at the museum in 1990, when he visited the town, the stone has a plaque stating it was donated by his family ( I am not at liberty to leave his last name on a public board ) But the stone has the family name on the plaque.

Now does it link JJ to the KGC I have no idea just and interesting story BTW SAPULA is about 27 miles from Tulsa

 

[Rebel - KGC]

I took my friend to brunch this AM ( he is 83 ) and we discussed his story about JJ in Oklahoma He is what he said on his grandfathers farm in Sapula OK , He and his grandfather ( when he was about 10 ) found a cave on a hill side , They crawled into the cave and among iron pots , and junk the found a stone with JJ carved into it --- They took the stone from the cave and went back to the farm. It sat there for about 5 years till my friend mentioned it to someone at the local museum , The grandfather took it to the SAPULA Museum in town and about 6 months later A person from the Museum contacted the grandfather and said that the writing on the stone matched JJ , The grandfather said he would donate it to the Museum ------ According to my friend the piece was still at the museum in 1990, when he visited the town, the stone has a plaque stating it was donated by his family ( I am not at liberty to leave his last name on a public board ) But the stone has the family name on the plaque. Now does it like JJ to the KGC I have no idea just and interesting story BTW SAPULA is about 27 miles from Tulsa

You know, it IS hard to make a Jesse James-KGC "connection", since membership rolls are NOT available. As an OUTLAW, it appears that JJ WAS there; MAYBE not part of KGC; MORE likely to be OAK; it depends on when JJ was "out & about". I read SOMEWHERE that ALL Outlaws knew of each other, and MAY have "worked together", having a COMMON enemy... the FEDS (US Army, gov't, etc.); in a way, they ALL wanted individual & STATE(S) RIGHTS... EVEN Belle Starr! "Google" Jesse James in OK.

 

[Hillbilly Joe]

I think many of the outlaws knew of each other, and maybe worked together on various things. But at the same time, I think about how the most notable were leaders, and may not follow another. So I would think they may have carved out niche jobs or territory, so they did not wind up stepping on each other.

 

[Citiboy289]

You know, it IS hard to make a Jesse James-KGC "connection", since membership rolls are NOT available. As an OUTLAW, it appears that JJ WAS there; MAYBE not part of KGC; MORE likely to be OAK; it depends on when JJ was "out & about". I read SOMEWHERE that ALL Outlaws knew of each other, and MAY have "worked together", having a COMMON enemy... the FEDS (US Army, gov't, etc.); in a way, they ALL wanted individual & STATE(S) RIGHTS... EVEN Belle Starr! "Google" Jesse James in OK.

I was just passing it along to the folks that follow this topic I had promised LC I would get back to him about it Wasn't tryng to connect any dots

 

[L.C. BAKER]

You know, it IS hard to make a Jesse James-KGC "connection", since membership rolls are NOT available. As an OUTLAW, it appears that JJ WAS there; MAYBE not part of KGC; MORE likely to be OAK; it depends on when JJ was "out & about". I read SOMEWHERE that ALL Outlaws knew of each other, and MAY have "worked together", having a COMMON enemy... the FEDS (US Army, gov't, etc.); in a way, they ALL wanted individual & STATE(S) RIGHTS... EVEN Belle Starr! "Google" Jesse James in OK.

no roll calls...but not impossible to tie him to the O.A.K. he is tied like a calf.

L.C.

 

[Citiboy289]

LC out of having a researches mind I looked up SAPULA Look at the map see any connections of interest ?

 

[Crosse De Sign]

I think many of the outlaws knew of each other, and maybe worked together on various things. But at the same time, I think about how the most notable were leaders, and may not follow another. So I would think they may have carved out niche jobs or territory, so they did not wind up stepping on each other.

An old family story, my nearly Full Blood Cherokee Choctaw Indian Grandmother told me about her Daddy: He was always gone, off making moonshine and gambling with other Indians and White Locals... A restless rounder, He was gone often, and for long extended times, maybe 2 or more months at a time... His family never knew when he would come or go, or want to move... One time she said, he was in need of a grubstake, and he heard that the Doolin Dalton gang had pulled a robbery of some notice, in Texas... The word was that there was a posse, including Rangers on their trail... Well, crazy bs as it may sound, Grandma said he supposedly went out to an area, where he thought them boys might be likely to be passing through, and laid up near a cave that was somewhat known to be used a lot back then, and waited quietly, without moving hardly at all... A Wild Hillbilly Indian Outlaw, Gonna Try TO Bushwack Real Outlaws, LOL!... So, A couple days later, he got pretty thirsty, gave up and went home, having never seen "no sign" of them at all... As far-fetched as that little story sounds, I really don't doubt it based on other things I'd heard... Because they said that one of his first "workin' out" ventures, was him lieing to the US Feds that he was 18 at just 16, so he could ride for US pony express... I guess they payed him in US Gold Coin... He also supposedly did time in Ft. Smith, for killing (knife in self defense) a man for jumping up hitting him on the hands with a steel rod at a poker table, accusing him of cheating, because he was about to take the pot... He was known to be a good Blacksmith, and had worked a lot in timber, even hacking ties, and at gunpoint refused any allotment, Gold, supplies, or Signing The Dawes Rolls... They thought he lived to about 92... No, I probably couldn't prove a word of it, It's Just One Of Them... Old Family Stories... ~: CDS :~

 

[L.C. BAKER]

I talked to a man that used to hold Jesse James's horse for him when Jesse would stop by his house to visit his folks who hailed from Clay county. The boy who held the horse was only 5 or 6 years old when Jesse would come by. He always stopped at the house for what seemed like normal visits. The little boy that stood outside and held Jessie's horse has passed away now, he was a very old man when i spoke to him and that was over 25 years ago. It still makes my skin crawl to think of it, and to see the excitement in the old mans eyes when he told the story. There is no doubt it was one of the highlights of the mans life, just to know he got to hold Jesse James's horse outside his parents house.
We highly suspect that the frequent visits that Jesse was making there were anything but casual.

L.C. Baker

 

[Crosse De Sign]

I talked to a man that used to hold Jesse James's horse for him when Jesse would stop by his house to visit his folks who hailed from Clay county. The boy who held the horse was only 5 or 6 years old when Jesse would come by. He always stopped at the house for what seemed like normal visits. The little boy that stood outside and held Jessie's horse has passed away now, he was a very old man when i spoke to him and that was over 25 years ago. It still makes my skin crawl to think of it, and to see the excitement in the old mans eyes when he told the story. There is no doubt it was one of the highlights of the mans life, just to know he got to hold Jesse James's horse outside his parents house.
We highly suspect that the frequent visits that Jesse was making there were anything but casual.

L.C. Baker

Interesting L.C., That does make the hair stand up a bit... It seems Jesse had places to stop in a few states he traveled? Enough to probably help his movement a lot, ... I have no idea who my Great Grandpa may have known, or even just seen in passing back then, other than locals I been told... But I'd say he was very possibly in some of the right places, at the right time frame, pretty young when Jesse was passing thru... They said he would give you the shirt off his back, but if you crossed him... He Supposedly Shot the saddle horn off of the Game Rangers Saddle once, because he tried sneaking up on him at the lake fishing, someone told that he got a deer for table meat... He Shot, Then he yelled: (His Name) You SOB Don't You Ever Sneak Up On ME! The Game man turned his horse around and left him alone... Later that same man was found out in the woods barb wired to a tree, alive... Don't know who else was upset, Grandpa didn't do that... Wish I could have known him... Though he did sound a little mean... Maybe because he was raised in Broken Arrow Indian Settlement, in Ark., in pretty hard times, after the Civil War... He said he didn't want his children to be called Indians, you see he was about a quarter or third part white, (looked suntan) with Blue eyes ... He died before I was born, my oldest Uncle told me he could make anything out of wood or metal... Wish I could see what he saw... ~: CDS :~

 

[L.C. BAKER]

For every 100 wives tales there is maybe one true story concerning the particulars about Jesse Woodson James. Even during his lifetime he was accused of many things he never took part in. He even went so far as to write the newspaper and try to set the record straight on one occasion. He was not larger than life, and he put his pants on just like you and me. He was a real person with real habits and a real life. Sorting through all of the B.S. is time consuming, and leaves the reader not knowing what to believe. He was a legend and very secretive about a lot of the things he did, and for good reason. He is a true mystery and when you get close to anything he had a hand in, it makes your blood race.

L.C. Baker

 

[Rebel - KGC]

WHO was he REALLY...? Jesse James was only ONE of his names...

 

[Pinwheel]

WHO was he REALLY...? Jesse James was only ONE of his names...

Makes one wonder, does it not? Jessie James was only one of his names and he shared that one with two others.

Most of the time I think it was all just a big nut and shell game. But then Again I have to ask Why?

Did The Rebels need a hero who would stand up in defiance of Uncle Sam, Or did the wealthy figure out how to get richer? I guess with all that confusion going on no one could keep their eye on the shell with the pea inside it.

Pinwheel

 

[Crosse De Sign]

Makes one wonder, does it not? Jessie James was only one of his names and he shared that one with two others.

Most of the time I think it was all just a big nut and shell game. But then Again I have to ask Why?

Did The Rebels need a hero who would stand up in defiance of Uncle Sam, Or did the wealthy figure out how to get richer? I guess with all that confusion going on no one could keep their eye on the shell with the pea inside it.

Pinwheel

Seeing how much Jesse obviously loved to explore, and discover all he could... It seems very reasonably possible, he could have had special places he found, and used, easily enough... If so, and something was left, Did He, Or Anyone Else Get To Recover Them?... ~: CDS :~

 

[ECS]

You know, it IS hard to make a Jesse James-KGC "connection", since membership rolls are NOT available. As an OUTLAW, it appears that JJ WAS there; MAYBE not part of KGC; MORE likely to be OAK; it depends on when JJ was "out & about". I read SOMEWHERE that ALL Outlaws knew of each other, and MAY have "worked together", having a COMMON enemy... the FEDS (US Army, gov't, etc.); in a way, they ALL wanted individual & STATE(S) RIGHTS....

...and don't forget former "REDLEGS".
Jesse James first "gang" was composed of cousins and others who were Missouri Confederate guerillas.During the 1869 DAVIESS COUNTY SAVINGS BANK robbery in Gallatin,Mo,James killed a teller he believed killed "Bloody" Bill Anderson,which gave him his first write up in a newspaper.
James also corresponded with the editor of the KANSAS CITY TIMES,John Newman Edwards,a former Confederate who rode with CSA Gen Joe Shelby.Edwards wrote articles that made James "the Robin Hood of the West",protecting honest farmers against the evil Republican Union of Reconstruction.It is no sectret that Edwards,James,Youngers,Shelby,knew each other-Shelby testified on the behalf of Frank James in court.
This site is well worth the read,it provides different insight on James:
Jesse James - Biographer T.J. Stiles

 

[Rebel - KGC]

Well, THIS is what I think... "JESSIE JAMES" was a "fake" name utilized by MANY... as a "cover-name" like THOMAS J. BEALE (Beale Story/Treasure); by CSA Secret Services (spies, etc.) to hide "assets" ($$$$$$$$$$, guns, etc.) from the FEDS... YET! Notice that the FEDS (with some states) have designated areas as Parks, etc. that MAY have "Treasures of Interest", THUS! NO TH'ing nor MD'ing!