Gunpowder booby trap in money pit

[n2mini]

Okay you never mentioned side tunnels.
I can see you feel strongly about the the validity of the conical shape of the dig.
Based on your pic, I don't agree unless there is something else. Agree to disagree?
I'll come back to the jewels business in a bit. There is a fine line between deductive reasoning and rationalization (I WANT there to be some kind of treasure).
Now I have to figure out how to get out of writing an essay for someone with a lot of questions. It REALLY IS annoying when other people figure out a job they want you to do for them.

As far as the hole Dunfield dig being a conical shape, atleast some what yes. Every pic we've ever seen would say so. Unless you think he used that grabbing bucket and only dug as wide as it was straight down. How do you think he dug it, based on the pics that are out there.. Here is another pic. Not very good quality but you can see it is much wider at the top then the bottom, or how far you can see down atleast. What do you call that shape?

 

Amazon Forum Fav 👍

Agony and Death on a Gold Rush Steamer: The Disastrous Sinking of the Side-Wheeler Yankee Blade - Grab it through Amazon!

[releventchair]

So many questions.
1) gunpowder leg is gunpowder keg. K and L are next to each other typewriter wise, spell check could not catch.
2) You're right, any gun would do.
3) The mental image I have of the actual trap has a gun loaded with powder and wadding but no ball inserted directly into a powder KEG. Hot gases from ignition of charge ignite the keg. S Ball was a grenadier/sapper - he knew how to set it up. Wire the trigger closed, set a piece between hammer and charged flashpan with a wire pull. Yank it, piece comes out, hammer comes down, flashpan ignites, hot gases flow into powder keg. BOOM.
4) Assuming it really is a ammo cache, either you or a friendly or an enemy will dig it up. You or a friendly will know what stone means, enemy not.
Next, rats.
Gotta admit, didn't think of this.
Am guessing rats don't burrow 90 ft down to nest or for food. Do they eat gunpowder? Anyone?

So you defer to S. Ball and no longer speculate ?

He may have known the secret to keeping a keg of powder dry in a damp environment ,and a flash pan too. That would have been a sight to see attempted . And quite the keg I'd imagine.
Depending on stability of the ground 90 feet below ground level it might have remained intact. Dry? Not so much.
Rats at 90 feet? humans were weren't they? IF Ball rat proofed all works involved , perhaps no rats.
I'd need to read his confidence in ascending after such a detonation rigging and how nothing was loose or dislodged or potentially dislodged enough to do the rigging without risk of something falling and tripping a flashpan rigged to go off..(Well you know how it was supposed to go off ...).
Descending after time elapsed on soft walled works ? A good job for someone else. Even if the powder should have been damp.
Old accounts of hand dogging well diggers in clay hint that non supported clay walls are by no means eternal. And among the worse for instability and risk of sudden collapse/closing.

Slope stability - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Armchair detective]

As far as the hole Dunfield dig being a conical shape, atleast some what yes. Every pic we've ever seen would say so. Unless you think he used that grabbing bucket and only dug as wide as it was straight down. How do you think he dug it, based on the pics that are out there.. Here is another pic. Not very good quality but you can see it is much wider at the top then the bottom, or how far you can see down atleast. What do you call that shape?
View attachment 2151621

I like good pictures, is good data, but I don't know what to make of that sewer pipe across from the clam bucket. I think I recognize the telltale signs of 3D enhancement - put on some 3D glasses and I bet it will jump out at you.
MORE PICTURES!!!

 

[n2mini]

FLOOD TUNNEL BABY!!! You didn't answer my question from above on if you don't think Dunfield dug a conical type hole what did he dig and how deep/wide was it. Got any pics of that type hole being dug during his time on the island to show any thing different then what I have posted? That's right you think the 3 photos I posted have all been photo shopped and are fake..

 

[Armchair detective]

So you defer to S. Ball and no longer speculate ?

He may have known the secret to keeping a keg of powder dry in a damp environment ,and a flash pan too. That would have been a sight to see attempted . And quite the keg I'd imagine.
Depending on stability of the ground 90 feet below ground level it might have remained intact. Dry? Not so much.
Rats at 90 feet? humans were weren't they? IF Ball rat proofed all works involved , perhaps no rats.
I'd need to read his confidence in ascending after such a detonation rigging and how nothing was loose or dislodged or potentially dislodged enough to do the rigging without risk of something falling and tripping a flashpan rigged to go off..(Well you know how it was supposed to go off ...).
Descending after time elapsed on soft walled works ? A good job for someone else. Even if the powder should have been damp.
Old accounts of hand dogging well diggers in clay hint that non supported clay walls are by no means eternal. And among the worse for instability and risk of sudden collapse/closing.

Slope stability - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I like this - a challenge.
How did they get out of the hole?
First problem. If you have a column 13 ft diameter and 98 ft tall and 77 lbs per cubic foot dirt, that's over 1,000,000 lbs sitting on the roof of the ammo room. Without working the math, I'll just assume that is too much for a single floor of logs, which explains why you flooring every 10 ft.
As a bonus the fill in keeps the clay walls from collapsing.
It wasn't a hair trigger, add 2 inches of slack.
I would build 3/4 of the ceiling of ammo room, run trip wire from the center of ceiling, lay blue clay on top as caulking to prevent dirt from sifting down into room between cracks of floor poles.
Now lay some dirt on clay.
Jump back down into ammo room, set the trap. Climb back out on an ammo keg, put flooring in, more clay , then dirt to fill cavity between 98 and 90 ft.
As you fill the dirt in, note the ceiling would sag making even more slack.
At least your posting didn't say impossible.

 

[Armchair detective]

Now something new - Samuel Ball goes to OI.
It is worth noting that SB was in an all black unit under Ward, probably white.
It's the way armies work - put blacks with blacks, Japanese with Japanese, etc. They understand each other and there is less friction.
Let's assume SB gained wealth in the burnt out portion of NYC. We know he was there, we know the opportunity was there.
Now Washington closes in from the West.
There is some differences of opinions by historians whether it was a retreat to regroup or simply a reason to go home to Britain.
The British tell all blacks "no you're not coming back to Britain with us".
Now they are back to their old status as runaway slaves, not allowed to own property, and if caught with any jewels or jewelry on their person, would be immediately hung.
So going east, west, south. not an option.
Tried to go north. Battle or storm damage, or simply ice pack prevented making Halifax.
Head to mainland, arrive OI.
In the swamp ship.

 

[Armchair detective]

FLOOD TUNNEL BABY!!! You didn't answer my question from above on if you don't think Dunfield dug a conical type hole what did he dig and how deep/wide was it. Got any pics of that type hole being dug during his time on the island to show any thing different then what I have posted? That's right you think the 3 photos I posted have all been photo shopped and are fake..

Well, #1 and #3 were faked, and way before they called it photo shopping.
If memory serves, for the aerial photo I saw I googled "oak Island photos". Somewhere in there there was a sequence of aerial photographs showing the changes to OI over the years. The Dunfield dig was shown. To me it looked like a crater with no rim, i.e. half a sphere with a flat bottom.
However one photo could be how it was at some point in the process of digging, and might not show how it would end up. Need the date of the photo I guess.

 

[pepperj]

In every treasure legend there's good amount of grabbing at different straws to make a

Now when it comes to the theories of Oak Island the pile of bales are a tad larger and there's plenty of grabbing it seems.

 

[releventchair]

I like this - a challenge.
How did they get out of the hole?
First problem. If you have a column 13 ft diameter and 98 ft tall and 77 lbs per cubic foot dirt, that's over 1,000,000 lbs sitting on the roof of the ammo room. Without working the math, I'll just assume that is too much for a single floor of logs, which explains why you flooring every 10 ft.
As a bonus the fill in keeps the clay walls from collapsing.
It wasn't a hair trigger, add 2 inches of slack.
I would build 3/4 of the ceiling of ammo room, run trip wire from the center of ceiling, lay blue clay on top as caulking to prevent dirt from sifting down into room between cracks of floor poles.
Now lay some dirt on clay.
Jump back down into ammo room, set the trap. Climb back out on an ammo keg, put flooring in, more clay , then dirt to fill cavity between 98 and 90 ft.
As you fill the dirt in, note the ceiling would sag making even more slack.
At least your posting didn't say impossible.

And you'd be able to disarm it safely upon return?
i certainly wouldn't volunteer to dig there!
But even without a "trap" the bottom of a 90 foot hole would be very safe from my intrusion.

Any time you have to look up to see the top of the hole ; you are subject to the mercy of anyone above you.

Dropped tools from above. Stones. Dirt. Squirrel. Multiplied by depth and gravity and a walnut sized stone bonking you at 90 feet in the head is going to ruin your party.

Out of necessity, pioneers took risks in well-digging

Tools and technique played role in the arduous task of hand digging wells

www.sctimes.com

 

[Charlie P. (NY)]

Could someone please explain to me how, in 1782, they managed to dig a 100' deep hole on a beach. View attachment 2151443

I'll go one further and add: why would anyone dig a 100' deep hole to hold treasure they might need to grab quickly in the future, perhaps with a small crew? Are there ANY historical presidents? No. It's just a dumb preposition.

And we have 12 years of proof thanks to the Lagina Brothers. Plus another 170 years of almost 30 some failed attempts. Give it up. We could have educational documentaries on the History Channel instead of this nonsense.

"The World at War". Now there was quality TV. And so appropriate to these current times vs. 1933 Germany. We need to be reminded frequently.

 

[Armchair detective]

I'll go one further and add: why would anyone dig a 100' deep hole to hold treasure they might need to grab quickly in the future, perhaps with a small crew? Are there ANY historical presidents? No. It's just a dumb preposition.

And we have 12 years of proof thanks to the Lagina Brothers. Plus another 170 years of almost 30 some failed attempts. Give it up. We could have educational documentaries on the History Channel instead of this nonsense.

"The World at War". Now there was quality TV. And so appropriate to these current times vs. 1933 Germany. We need to be reminded frequently.

 

[Armchair detective]

Please remember that I am talking about TWO events, the original digging of the mine shaft which was not filled in, and the burial of an ammo cache with a booby trap in the hole that was already there.
Note that as they got to OI it was WINTER.
The ship they arrived on was probably an ammo resupply ship from Britain, now caught in the retreat of 1782. I assume that for some reason this was end of road for the ship, yet there was some reason to believe there was some pursuit with the intention of recapturing the runaway slaves.
A nice hole already dug through the ice and snow must have been a great stroke of luck, and as a bonus warmer inside.

 

[TruthbeTold]

The problem is that no one has ever presented actual evidence that a 100’ foot shaft was ever present on oak island.

The only shafts found to date are ones from previous diggers most of which are documented.

 

[Armchair detective]

The problem is that no one has ever presented actual evidence that a 100’ foot shaft was ever present on oak island.

The only shafts found to date are ones from previous diggers most of which are documented.

The problem is that no one has ever presented actual evidence that a 100’ foot shaft was ever present on oak island.

The only shafts found to date are ones from previous diggers most of which are documented.

 

[Armchair detective]

I read the Truro history again.
So these guys who probed the hole and confirmed the Onslow report of more levels, then bored through 2 kegs of "loose metal" (grapeshot), then sunk 4 more shafts around the dig attempting to get to it, didn't know what they were doing because there is no evidence NOW that there ever was a hole.
They were there, you weren't. Assume some competence for them.
Evidence will be what people find/found.
Old histories which were insufficient to deduce what happened at OI must be integrated with new data coming from the OI series - yes it is a real treasure search.
By the way, it is helpful to turn off the sound.

 

[TruthbeTold]

The truro company was just like the others before and after it. They dug thru previous digger’s hole claiming they were digging in a money pit while making grandeous statements to lure investors as once truro discovered the original story was a lie they were trying to recoup thei money lost in digging based on a tall tale.

In all the subsequent digs including the Dunfield which exposed the truth that nothing had ever been there, none of the items truro or others claimed were in the hole were ever found.

A website logging the history of oak island used to exist with actual facts including photos that proved the money pit was fiction. It was so damning that the laginas purchased it and took it down.

 

[TruthbeTold]

I read the Truro history again.
So these guys who probed the hole and confirmed the Onslow report of more levels, then bored through 2 kegs of "loose metal" (grapeshot), then sunk 4 more shafts around the dig attempting to get to it, didn't know what they were doing because there is no evidence NOW that there ever was a hole.
They were there, you weren't. Assume some competence for them.
Evidence will be what people find/found.
Old histories which were insufficient to deduce what happened at OI must be integrated with new data coming from the OI series - yes it is a real treasure search.
By the way, it is helpful to turn off the sound.

But the “new data” coming in is proving that nothing was ever there.

 

[UnderMiner]

As a kid I was obsessed with buried treasure. Recently I was gardening and found a plastic box full of knickknacks I had burried in 1997 (according to the experiation date on an empty bag of chips I found inside). That made be remember that I had dug a very deep hole in my back yard during this same time. I remember burying a sewing machine at the bottom, but I think there is also a box full of pre-euro european coins down there too. Every few feet I think I remember putting wood planks and a smaller treasure of some kind (to confuse future treasure hunters into not knowing to keep digging for the big treasure at the bottom, the sewing machine and whatever else). It is very deep, at least ten feet deep and now there is an apple tree growing on top of it. Needless to say I will never be digging it up now. One day someone will dig up that hole and wonder where all the junk on all the layers came from. I wonder if they'll keep digging until hitting the water table.

 

[releventchair]

As a kid I was obsessed with buried treasure. Recently I was gardening and found a plastic box full of knickknacks I had burried in 1997 (according to the experiation date on an empty bag of chips I found inside). That made be remember that I had dug a very deep hole in my back yard during this same time. I remember burying a sewing machine at the bottom, but I think there is also a box full of pre-euro european coins down there too. Every few feet I think I remember putting wood planks and a smaller treasure of some kind (to confuse future treasure hunters into not knowing to keep digging for the big treasure at the bottom, the sewing machine and whatever else). It is very deep, at least ten feet deep and now there is an apple tree growing on top of it. Needless to say I will never be digging it up now. One day someone will dig up that hole and wonder where all the junk on all the layers came from. I wonder if they'll keep digging until hitting the water table.

Wait a minute...
What kind of chips?

 

[UnderMiner]

Wait a minute...
What kind of chips?

Either Smartfood or Wise I don't remember.