DUTCHMAN ORE?

[cactusjumper]

Wow, 50-years Joe?! That's a long time to come up completely empty isn't it? I think you illustrate perfectly my "theory" that the LDM is nothing but air, and a darn good way to separate greenhorns from their hard earned money.

I'm not insulting you or anyone else. I am very tired however, of the same bad information and speculation being parroted over the internet and in books sold by modern day snake oil dealers.

There are people that make their living off of this legend. Some of them are actual believers and I feel sorry for them. As for the others, all I feel is disdain because in my mind they are con-artists preying on the hopes and dreams of greenhorns.

Terry,

Actually, it's 54 years. Try to pay attention.

As I have said many times before, I never searched for the LDM....on my own. On the other hand, I have assisted others in their own searches.

I don't make money off of other people's dreams of finding lost mines or treasures. In fact, I have sent out a great deal of material at no cost.....not even shipping. You are the one who takes money from people for (leading) them in their hopes of finding something.

"As for the others, all I feel is disdain because in my mind they are con-artists preying on the hopes and dreams of greenhorns."

That comment is much closer to what you do, than anything I have ever done. Each year, for the last seven, I have provided food and water to the people who come to the Dutch Hunter's Rendezvous to share their knowledge and experience with others. I spent over $1000 each year and never charged a penny.

I assume you have donated just as much time and money to the treasure hunters who have come your way looking for help.

Joe Ribaudo

 

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[Terry Soloman]

Terry,

Actually, it's 54 years. Try to pay attention.

As I have said many times before, I never searched for the LDM....on my own. On the other hand, I have assisted others in their own searches.

I don't make money off of other people's dreams of finding lost mines or treasures. In fact, I have sent out a great deal of material at no cost.....not even shipping. You are the one who takes money from people for (leading) them in their hopes of finding something.

"As for the others, all I feel is disdain because in my mind they are con-artists preying on the hopes and dreams of greenhorns."

That comment is much closer to what you do, than anything I have ever done. Each year, for the last seven, I have provided food and water to the people who come to the Dutch Hunter's Rendezvous to share their knowledge and experience with others. I spent over $1000 each year and never charged a penny.

I assume you have donated just as much time and money to the treasure hunters who have come your way looking for help.

Joe Ribaudo

I run a real business Joe. We sell knowledge and adventure - not gold or pipe dreams and we have Hundreds of real and satisfied customers that have spent hundreds-of-thousands-of-dollars in Arizona, my home state, in the towns and Counties I grew up in.

Arizona Gold Adventures does not give away money to "treasure hunters" Joe, we give free day trips and vacations to local soldiers, pilots, air crews - and their families from Luke AFB and Ft. Huachuca, and TEACH them how to prospect for gold on their own using the finest equipment money can buy, on some of the richest gold claims and meteorite strewn fields of Arizona. My prospecting instructors donate their time and equipment, and I pay the liability insurance, transportation and claim fees out of my pocket. You can take your lame "I donate to treasure hunters" shtick, and put it in that mine you swear is there, because it’s meaningless.

When WE do something for charity, it is to make the SOLDIERS, AIRMEN and their FAMILIES feel better, not to make us feel like we are the stars of the show. We don’t go around throwing it in people’s faces either, in fact, we have turned down several requests by local media and the DOD to publicize our deeds.

I sell real knowledge Joe, and experience that saves the average greenhorn a full year in the field learning and experimenting on their own. We don’t sell detectors, or drywashers, not even pans. We are a school, pure and simple. In fact, we are the Arizona “Harvard” of gold prospecting, and have the guests from all over the world to prove it. I'm sorry about the rant to my fellow forum members, but I really hate our business being compared to some blow hard that puts on an annual meeting for "true believers." It just makes me want to tell Joe I really feel..

 

[cactusjumper]

I run a real business Joe. We sell knowledge and adventure - not gold or pipe dreams and we have Hundreds of real and satisfied customers that have spent hundreds-of-thousands-of-dollars in Arizona, my home state, in the towns and Counties I grew up in.

Arizona Gold Adventures does not give away money to "treasure hunters" Joe, we give free day trips and vacations to local soldiers, pilots, air crews - and their families from Luke AFB and Ft. Huachuca, and TEACH them how to prospect for gold on their own using the finest equipment money can buy, on some of the richest gold claims and meteorite strewn fields of Arizona. My prospecting instructors donate their time and equipment, and I pay the liability insurance, transportation and claim fees out of my pocket. You can take your lame "I donate to treasure hunters" shtick, and put it in that mine you swear is there, because it’s meaningless.

When WE do something for charity, it is to make the SOLDIERS, AIRMEN and their FAMILIES feel better, not to make us feel like we are the stars of the show. We don’t go around throwing it in people’s faces either, in fact, we have turned down several requests by local media and the DOD to publicize our deeds.

I sell real knowledge Joe, and experience that saves the average greenhorn a full year in the field learning and experimenting on their own. We don’t sell detectors, or drywashers, not even pans. We are a school, pure and simple. In fact, we are the Arizona “Harvard” of gold prospecting, and have the guests from all over the world to prove it. I'm sorry about the rant to my fellow forum members, but I really hate our business being compared to some blow hard that puts on an annual meeting for "true believers." It just makes me want to tell Joe I really feel..

Well.......I'm convinced.

"We sell knowledge and adventure".

I don't sell either. Most of those who do, are what you have classified as "modern day snake oil dealers". You, on the other hand, are better than many of those folks, or so you claim.

Personally, I don't give a damn who you sell your own personal brand of "snake oil" to. Bottom line is, you're
still selling......something.

Good luck,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[Terry Soloman]

Well.......I'm convinced.

"We sell knowledge and adventure".

I don't sell either...

That is self evident Joe.

 

[cactusjumper]

That is self evident Joe.

Terry,

The topic here is "LDM ORE?". If you don't have anything constructive to add, try starting a topic of your own.

Thanks for your input,

Joe Ribaudo

 

[sgtfda]

First off I'm not a Dutch hunter. But! I can't say if it exists or not. Only the Dutchman can answer that. Even if you find a gold hole who is to say that's it. Years ago I found a site many said did not exist. Many still have that opinion in spite of artifacts found at that site. Such is the nature of treasure hunting. It's best to keep these things to yourself. It's a snake eating it's tail. I find it interesting reading the opinions on the subject. Some believe everything and some nothing. Some like myself hold judgement and wait and see.

 

[Cubfan64]

I'm not insulting you or anyone else

Guess my definition of insulting is different than other folks. I guess all I can say is I found "treasure" the first time I went exploring in the Superstitions. I go out there exploring with one single purpose (well, 2 I guess).

1) Because my soul cries out now and again to experience raw nature - to be alone with my thoughts for a few days - to just BE for awhile and to remind myself of what's important and good in this world and to test my body and mind against the elements like I used to when I was a kid.

and

2) Because the "treasure hunter" within me desires that experience of seeing something, touching something or experiencing something that may not have been seen, touched or experienced in hundreds or perhaps thousands of years. Seeing an arrowhead tucked away in the crevice of a cave where there are no footprings in the dust. To gaze thoughtfully at native american petroglyphs imagining the life and times of the person who put them there.

I find treasures of one kind or another every time I explore off the beaten paths out there. I've never tried to sell anyone else ANYTHING associated with the LDM or the Superstitions.

Yes I've seen gold ore and placer gold that I have every reason to believe was indeed found within the Superstition Mountains. Do I have any illusions about "stumbling across" the LDM or any other gold mine out there? Not really - there have been how many hundreds of people who have searched for a hundred + years - I'm not arrogant enough to think I might randomly come across it by accident....

but then again....

And THAT'S what keeps the heart and soul of one of "Coronado's Children" pumping.

I'm sorry to hear the attitude in your posts Mr. Soloman. A couple years ago I got some information from you about your services and was hoping to take advantage of it sometime along with my wife during one of our vacations. People often are different in real life than they are on forums, but as has been said many times by others wiser than myself, "you only have one chance to make a first impression." I'm sure you don't care about my business, but it's still a shame to have lost it this way.

Paul

 

[Terry Soloman]

... I'm sure you don't care about my business, but it's still a shame to have lost it this way.

Paul

Yep, darn shame Paul. Best of luck to you and your wife.

 

[Some Dude]

Gentlemen,

While no doubt people today are making money from the legend of the LDM, the fact remains that in the beginning nobody was making any money. The Petraschs and Holmes spent their lives looking for the mine that Waltz told them about.

And WHY would Waltz lie about having a rich gold mine that he was going to personally lead them to? If Waltz was lying about the whole affair then he would look like a complete liar and an idiot once they got into the mountains and – oops, no mine (maybe the Indians moved it).

If there is an LDM in the Superstitions, it wouldn’t be the first time a rich gold mine was discovered exactly where all the geologist ‘experts’ said that no mineral formation could possibly exist.

Just sayin,
Some Dude

 

[ELBAYO]

Joe take a look at this??

 

[ELBAYO]

It is funny to see that photo Joe!! Tell us all, where did you get that?


Double-Jack

 

[vor]

View attachment 697478 It is funny to see that photo Joe!! Tell us all, where did you get that?


Double-Jack

Are those tweezers? Trying to get an idea of the size. Was it taken by a camera or microscope?

 

[roadrunner]

Joe, that piece of gold and rock sure looks like a match of Waltz match box.

 

[cactusjumper]

Joe, that piece of gold and rock sure looks like a match of Waltz match box.

RR,

As I have mentioned many, many times, I don't know $#!t about rocks. Just threw the picture out there to generate some discussion.

Take care,

Joe

 

[ELBAYO]

VOR, The sample piece is about the size of your thumb..

 

[Azhiker]

 

[Azhiker]

Julia Thomas, who was caring for Jacob Waltz in Phoenix when he died, filed as the locator of a gold lode mining claim on February 23, 1894. The claim was located in the Salt River Mountains mining district of the Territory of Arizona. The claim was 1500 feet of a gold lode and was named the Montezuma mining claim. Filing with Julia on this claim was her husband Albert Schafer and her brother in law, Englebert Schafer. Julia Thomas was known at the time of the filing of this claim as Mrs. Julia Schafer.

 

[Azhiker]

See the top of the page for the signatures of Mrs. Julia Schafer, Albert and Englebert Schafer dated Feb. 23, 1894.

 

[Cubfan64]

Hmm - so what is it you are trying to imply AZhiker? That the ore in your photo came from Julia's claim? That the ore in your photo is a visual match to the jewelry ore? That perhaps Julia, her husband and brother in law actually did locate the LDM?

Can you clarify?

 

[Azhiker]

Cubfan64, clarification:

The photo on the left is of the matchbox said to have been made from LDM gold ore.

The 4 photos on the right are cactusjumper's photos of LDM ore.

The photos are side by side merely for comparison purposes because it was posted by someone here who said the two ores looked like a match.

Julia had a lode gold mining claim. I cannot say if it was the LDM or if it wasn't. If you know the location of the LDM we can rule out Julia's mine.

The photo of gold under the post about Julia's mining claim may be LDM ore. If you know it is not LDM ore, we can rule that ore out.

I don't know where the LDM might be located. I have my own idea of what might be LDM ore just like cactusjumper does.

Thats about all. I hope that helps to clarify.