DOC NOSS-Victorio Peak OR The Caballo Mountains

I live in Albuquerque, and can serve as feet, but have no time to research the claims out. I'm already heavily invested research wise in three other projects, but love to find excuses to drive and hunt on sites. I was in the Narrows at the Malpais just last week, working on some leads with a friend from the Acoma Pueblo. If you are willing to feed me maps, directions, etc. I can go to claim sites and take photos & video, and have metal detectors too.
 

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Well Springy and Not,

I REALLY don't know what we are arguing about! Except for the fact that the two of you are denying there was gold in VP, we are kind of in agreement. The difference between my theory and y'alls is that I think Doc discovered more than one treasure cave based on Willie's Map. You two think there was only one treasure cave that was in the Caballos. I think there were seven treasure caves spread out between the Organs, San Andres, and Caballos. Willie got one. Doc got and lost one, and I think while he was getting screwed on VP, Doc was out looking for one of the other treasure caves he saw on Willie's Map. I think he found it and was murdered before he had a chance to exploit it.

See, we all think there is a still hidden treasure cave in the Caballos. I also believe that there are still five unexploited treasure caves to go.

Mike
 

gollum said:
Well Springy and Not,

I REALLY don't know what we are arguing about! Except for the fact that the two of you are denying there was gold in VP, we are kind of in agreement. The difference between my theory and y'alls is that I think Doc discovered more than one treasure cave based on Willie's Map. You two think there was only one treasure cave that was in the Caballos. I think there were seven treasure caves spread out between the Organs, San Andres, and Caballos. Willie got one. Doc got and lost one, and I think while he was getting screwed on VP, Doc was out looking for one of the other treasure caves he saw on Willie's Map. I think he found it and was murdered before he had a chance to exploit it.

See, we all think there is a still hidden treasure cave in the Caballos. I also believe that there are still five unexploited treasure caves to go.

Mike
Click to expand...

Slow down, Hoss - I've never denied the existence of gold in Soledad Peak. I suspect the huge hoard in the lower chambers of the peak was Pre-Columbian, as are possibly all seven sites. Yes, I've rejected the Noss stories as we have heard them.

I too strongly believe there is a large cache of gold bars in the Caballo Range - in Bat Cave Canyon not far from an old sheave block bolted into a rock outcropping, in fact, if it hasn't been removed (with a couple 1960's dead cowboys in there with the loot). Are there more sites in the Caballos? Don't know, maybe, maybe not. Wouldn't be surprised.

I suspect the Organs hold a cache or more too, although the government may have stolen them by now, ala Soledad.

I'll go along with the 'seven caves' theory too. If I had to guess, I'd place a couple of them west of the Rio Grande.

So, yeah, you're right. I don't know where Not is coming from, but you and I are definitely in the same ballpark.
 

NP, was wondering if you know what types of claims were filed in the Cabellos by Jerry? Mining, treasure, or something else?

And isn't Bat Canyon close to the TDA-6 mining/treasure trove claim? Coincidence?
 

Springy,

So I guess you and Shortstack are the "Ancient Ones" guys here? Or do you like the Phoenician Connection? I am game for the Phoenicians getting copper from Michigan. I am also game for Phoenicians in and around Mayas in the Yucatan. Two stories:

1. When they were building the extension for the airport in Yucatan, the construction company unearthed clay discs with Phoenician Writing on them. Historians called them fake, and they disappeared from history (I believe this was in the late 1960s early 1970's).
2. At a certain mountain in Northern Az, a cave was found (I want to say about 1986). Many things in the cave including artifacts that looked distinctly Mayan/Aztec, raw South American Emeralds, and gold coins. The finder showed them to Bob Marx in Florida who identified them as Phoenician Gold Staters from a time before Christ.

Best - Mike
 

Springfield said:
Slow down, Hoss - I've never denied the existence of gold in Soledad Peak. I suspect the huge hoard in the lower chambers of the peak was Pre-Columbian, as are possibly all seven sites. Yes, I've rejected the Noss stories as we have heard them.

I too strongly believe there is a large cache of gold bars in the Caballo Range - in Bat Cave Canyon not far from an old sheave block bolted into a rock outcropping, in fact, if it hasn't been removed (with a couple 1960's dead cowboys in there with the loot). Are there more sites in the Caballos? Don't know, maybe, maybe not. Wouldn't be surprised.

I suspect the Organs hold a cache or more too, although the government may have stolen them by now, ala Soledad.

I'll go along with the 'seven caves' theory too. If I had to guess, I'd place a couple of them west of the Rio Grande.

So, yeah, you're right. I don't know where Not is coming from, but you and I are definitely in the same ballpark.
Click to expand...

great stuff guys,enjoyed reading all the thoughts. i like like your thoughts on a couple of the 7 caves being west of the Rio, Springfield.I know for you to make that statement,it wasnt done by a roll of the dice.thats where iam looking for one.if i find it,ill let you know Springfield.Great info,guys,really enjoyed the read.
 

gollum said:
Springy,

So I guess you and Shortstack are the "Ancient Ones" guys here? Or do you like the Phoenician Connection? I am game for the Phoenicians getting copper from Michigan. I am also game for Phoenicians in and around Mayas in the Yucatan. Two stories:

1. When they were building the extension for the airport in Yucatan, the construction company unearthed clay discs with Phoenician Writing on them. Historians called them fake, and they disappeared from history (I believe this was in the late 1960s early 1970's).
2. At a certain mountain in Northern Az, a cave was found (I want to say about 1986). Many things in the cave including artifacts that looked distinctly Mayan/Aztec, raw South American Emeralds, and gold coins. The finder showed them to Bob Marx in Florida who identified them as Phoenician Gold Staters from a time before Christ.

Best - Mike
Click to expand...

I don't know about Shortstack, but, yeah, that idea is active in my noggin - and yours too, it seems. The Michigan copper mystery is very, very interesting, and if you consider the difficulty in logistics getting there from the Mediterranean, plus the Mexican Phoenician discoveries - and that Arizona cave anomaly too - well ... hello! Getting into the Southwest is almost a no-brainer.

The usual route conjectured into the Southwest was via the mouth of the Rio Grande. The river was navigatable in that age, and could have been followed to today's Organ and Caballo ranges (hmmm) - and to the Rio Puerco too, for that matter. The means of travel are apparent, but the big question is whether they were merely exploring or had maps to specific destinations.
 

Dr. Syn said:
NP, was wondering if you know what types of claims were filed in the Cabellos by Jerry? Mining, treasure, or something else?

And isn't Bat Canyon close to the TDA-6 mining/treasure trove claim? Coincidence?
Click to expand...

They were gold claims on the west side of the Caballos, NW of Sardine Canyon. np:cat:
 

img131.jpg
Notice the 7 circles on the head of the Serpent of Tayopa figure, followed by 7 arrows leading to a main trail to the Caballo Mountains. Look also at the building with the cross that has 7 circles with "oro" below. The trail from this also leads to the Caballo Mtns. The symbols on the upper left and upper right are legends of what to look for once you are in the Caballo Mtns. The dates of 1646 and 1861 tell us that the map has been copied at least once, probably more than that.
img099.jpg img100.jpg
All three of these maps were found together. One has "M Starr" on the bottom corner. And below it is "Carl".
img108.jpg img109.jpg
Notice the reference to 7 on these maps.
The main clue is a rock formation in the shape of rabbit ears with an entrance in the center of the ears leading 40 or 50 feet to a chamber. Jerry C found what he believed was the rabbit ear formation so he filed gold claims with the formation at the center. After having the claims surveyed, he brought in ground penetrating radar. Which produced nothing. But due to the rabbit ear formation, he thought he was in the right place. He was so sure that this was the place, he kept the search going on his claims for almost a year until his investors ran out of money.
Even though they had the clues to the small chest hidden by Doc at Rincon, they never took the time to search for it. np:cat:
 

gollum said:
Springy,

So I guess you and Shortstack are the "Ancient Ones" guys here? Or do you like the Phoenician Connection? I am game for the Phoenicians getting copper from Michigan. I am also game for Phoenicians in and around Mayas in the Yucatan. Two stories:

1. When they were building the extension for the airport in Yucatan, the construction company unearthed clay discs with Phoenician Writing on them. Historians called them fake, and they disappeared from history (I believe this was in the late 1960s early 1970's).
2. At a certain mountain in Northern Az, a cave was found (I want to say about 1986). Many things in the cave including artifacts that looked distinctly Mayan/Aztec, raw South American Emeralds, and gold coins. The finder showed them to Bob Marx in Florida who identified them as Phoenician Gold Staters from a time before Christ.

Best - Mike
Click to expand...
hi mike with all due respect , i am not sure the cave artifacts you are talking about , were described as having a Mayan/Aztec look to them. of course i did not get very far at all , with any kind of verifiable evidence so you could be right . i am going to assume this Bob Marxs is a solid reference in your book , so I'll file that information , along with the other stuffs for future reference. thanks .
you might find this interesting http://www.researchgate.net/profile...ician_Exploration/file/e0b495156fd4cc1c59.pdf

and more thoughts about maps from other places and earlier times , but I'm sure this is just the same old stuff for you and Springfield ,maybe its new to dog the treasure hunter , or anyone else interested The Asiatic Fathers of America - www.AsiaticFathers.com

all of this stuff needs to be scrutinized , cause there are lots or reasons for whomever to lie about treasures .IMHO
i don't have a dog in this rather sporty exchange , so please carry on .
take care .///bob
 

absolutely amigo , i find this interesting as well , perhaps just a coincidence , but still interesting . another meaning of the hooked x i guess lol . the Chinese letter 7 :dontknow:
Chinese Character qi1 -- Seven
 

Hi Friends. If you haven't seen these, enjoy.
img104.jpg img105.jpg
img106.jpg img107.jpg
np :cat:
 

Hi All,
There's so much that I could say about these maps but I'd rather wait and see your comments after you've had some time to look at them in depth.np:cat:
 

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