Dick Holmes clues

[nobodie]

Thanks again Mathew. Just wanted to know if there was more information.
come back out of the canyon. (Across the canyon and up it is a side canyon. Go up this side canyon to a cave. Opposite the cave is a tunnel and the mine.) You will never be able to find the mine

 

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[Idahodutch]

Thanks again Mathew. Just wanted to know if there was more information.
come back out of the canyon. (Across the canyon and up it is a side canyon. Go up this side canyon to a cave. Opposite the cave is a tunnel and the mine.) You will never be able to find the mine

Nobodie,
I don?t know if those ARE the secret directions, but they would make sense.

Trying to make sense of other parts about having to find the hidden camp first, as they seem to break context. Waltz seems to get mixed up, between mine directions for a minute. Tells Holmes to go to the hidden camp first, ... will not find the mine unless he does, ... but the direction to come back out, for more directions to the mine (the secret ones) seem to make the trip to the hidden camp meaningless. It would make sense that Waltz was intending the shaft mine to go to Holmes.
Again, when he is telling about the $75,000 of ore all ready dug out, but it is not the shaft mine ...
It would seem to make sense that Waltz was getting some of the info he wanted for Julia, mixed in by accident .... he was almost dead.

So ..... are those the secret directions? You have my attention

 

[Idahodutch]

Waltz? directions to Julia for locating the mine, was that it was not more than 200? directly across the canyon from his hidden camp. But the directional narrative that Julia had memorized, didn?t actually say for Julia to find the hidden camp, or how to find the hidden camp, ..... so maybe Waltz realized that he hadn?t said how to find the hidden camp, and he was almost dead, so he tells Holmes how to find it. ..... maybe.
But I don?t see another reason for waltz to tells Holmes how to find the hidden camp, since it doesn?t appear to be necessary for locating the shaft mine. Just thoughts, that?s all .... speculation, but I find it interesting

 

[Stevethepirate62]

I am new to the game, but have done a lot of reading and map scouting.....it seems the First Water/Second Water directions, and the directions from the board house, are mutually exclusive and contradictory for what part of the mountains you end up in. How do you all account for this?

 

[azdave35]

I am new to the game, but have done a lot of reading and map scouting.....it seems the First Water/Second Water directions, and the directions from the board house, are mutually exclusive and contradictory for what part of the mountains you end up in. How do you all account for this?

welcome to the nuthouse....none of these clues make sense because we don't really know where they came from

 

[ConceptualizedNetherlandr]

Good morning nobodie,

I personally believe that Holmes was given information, by Waltz, to use for locating Waltz? mine(s).

As far as I know, there were only a couple of things not passed along to us....
- What 1st and 2nd water referee to, in Waltz? time.
- how far after the military trail turns to the South, is the rock man.
- the secret directions given to Holmes, to apply once he locates Waltz? hidden camp in the canyon, below the viewing spot for Four Peaks.

There may be more, but those are the ones that come to mind.
I thought it curious that Dick?s son, Brownie felt that if he could locate the rock man, then he could have found it.
I personally don?t think Brownie had found the saddle or the view point for four peaks, because the rock man shows when to leave the trail..... to even get to the saddle, and view point.

Then he would have needed to locate the hidden camp after that.
Maybe I?m in the wrong spot, but it only to 12 years for me to locate what I think is the hidden camp, after going to the view spot to see four peaks looking like one peak.

I personally think that the earthquake of ~1888 caused enough loose debris, that once sufficient erosion had taken place, that the hidden camp became even more hidden. Not 100%, but almost.

I don?t think anybody got to see it the way Waltz left it.

Tell us about these 4 peaks of which you speak?

 

[Stevethepirate62]

Indeed.....after having read the whole PitMine/LDM thread, I used my google foo and followed another set of clues (north of WN) and found an area with a foundation, trail, and lots of digging; can I claim to have found the LDM?

 

[JohnWhite]

Indeed.....after having read the whole PitMine/LDM thread, I used my google foo and followed another set of clues (north of WN) and found an area with a foundation, trail, and lots of digging; can I claim to have found the LDM?

Anyone can make any claim they wish Steve. Hell, I have made a number of claims myself, though I have not filed a single claim yet. I do not want to let any cats out of the bag. lol

I wonder IF anyone has come close to finding any of my little playgrounds yet?

Ed T

 

[azdave35]

Indeed.....after having read the whole PitMine/LDM thread, I used my google foo and followed another set of clues (north of WN) and found an area with a foundation, trail, and lots of digging; can I claim to have found the LDM?

might as well ...everyone else has

 

[Idahodutch]

Tell us about these 4 peaks of which you speak?

CN,
You have heard of the Holmes Manuscript I’m sure.
The statement is attributed to Waltz.
There is part of the directions where we are instructed to go through a saddle, to where it ties in to a low ridge, and go to the highest point of the low ridge and look north. Four peaks looks like one peak.

To the north of the Superstitions, is a very large mountain, and at the top, it has 4 large peaks. The peaks eventually got names, but the mountain’s called Four Peaks.

From the highest point of the low ridge, behind the ravine (yeah it has a saddle tying in to it, but the Indian ruin is not there) I looked to the north and the top part of the mountain named Four Peaks is viewable off in the distance .... right on the skyline. That view of Four Peaks looks like one peak from that spot.

You or anyone else go to that spot, it is what you’ll see too.
Idahodutch

 

[Stevethepirate62]

Well ok, I found it then......obviously too late, if the trail and all the diggings are any clue. Who was working up just off Boulder Canyon where the iron mineralization is visible on GE?

 

[393stroker]

Just imagine Waltz laying on his deathbed telling some guys that he doesn?t really like some bogus clues that he knows they will follow and find nothing. Just like a classic ending to a Clint Eastwood movie.

 

[markmar]

nobodie,

Here are the directions Waltz gave to Dick Holmes and Gideon Roberts, word for word, no additions, no deletions, no interpretations.

" Go to first water, then to second water, then take the old government trail to San Carlos. Where the trail turns south you will see over the point of a ridge a rock standing in the brush that looks like a man. This is where I always leave the trail. Go to the left of the trail and follow up the long ridge and you will come to a saddle. In this saddle is a round Indian ruin of rocks. Go through this saddle and on up a low ridge, and when you get to the highest point of the ridge you can look north and the four peaks are lined up to look as one peak. In the other direction you will see a high needle. In the canyon under you is my hidden camp. You cant get down there because its too steep, go to the mouth of the canyon and then back. You can find the rock house with very little difficulty. You won't be able to see it until you are right up on it. After you find the camp then come back out of the canyon. (Here Waltz gave a direction to the mine that Holmes and Roberts kept secret). You will never be able to find the mine until you first find the rock house as the opening is completely hidden. A prospector won't find it because there is no ledge in view. In the mine you will find about $75,000 dollars in gold ore already dug out. I dug the outcropping away and covered all signs of my digging."


Anything else you have read or heard came from someone else and cannot be 100 % relied upon. If you are relying on clues or statements other than what you see here, you are following some bad information you got from someone or some Dutchman book.

Matthew

Matthew

Many people missed to understand the meanings of the words which was used in the route that Waltz told to Dick Holmes.

To begin with the first water and second water. Why Waltz told to Holmes these clues and to Julia told Green River and Rocky Shallows ( German Clues )? Because Holmes knew about these names at the time he was tracking Waltz to his mine.

When the trail turns south, Waltz said " you will see over the point of a ridge " , which means behind that point of the ridge is another mountain which has the " rock like a man " landmark. Also, the words " you will see " doesn't mean " you can see ". " You will see " is for a future event if: you go closer, you pay more attention, you have binoculars, etc. The best way to find out, is to go to the location of the point of the ridge. This Waltz description is the same view from the Perfil mapa.

Many people who used Holmes clues and claimed to have found the LDM region, their region is far away to match Waltz description from his deathbed confession. Few even can't see Weavers Needle from the saddle above their alleged LDM.

If someone believe the clues Waltz told to Holmes are words which were spoken in delirium, only to fit the route to his loved place, then he/she has to thinks again, if wants to change the story or wants to vindicate it.

 

[ConceptualizedNetherlandr]

CN,
You have heard of the Holmes Manuscript I?m sure.

not relevant.

The statement is attributed to Waltz.

attributed you say? tell us about how that is any way relevant? please ink us up with actual stuff

There is part of the directions where we are instructed to go through a saddle, to where it ties in to a low ridge, and go to the highest point of the low ridge and look north. Four peaks looks like one peak.

To the north of the Superstitions, is a very large mountain, and at the top, it has 4 large peaks. The peaks eventually got names, but the mountain?s called Four Peaks.

If it is not too much of a distraction from your current day dream can you share the lat long of those peaks? I did so years ago (long before you got here) on this very forum and they line up no where near where you think they do.

From the highest point of the low ridge, behind the ravine (yeah it has a saddle tying in to it, but the Indian ruin is not there) I looked to the north and the top part of the mountain named Four Peaks is viewable off in the distance .... right on the skyline. That view of Four Peaks looks like one peak from that spot.

You or anyone else go to that spot, it is what you?ll see too.
Idahodutch

so you claim to have done this? what is the lat long?

 

[ConceptualizedNetherlandr]

Just imagine Waltz laying on his deathbed telling some guys that he doesn?t really like some bogus clues that he knows they will follow and find nothing. Just like a classic ending to a Clint Eastwood movie.

esoteric as all get out he had nothing and did a parlay to burn the fools and all who followed. If only he could have been rewarded before his death

 

[Idahodutch]

not relevant. attributed you say? tell us about how that is any way relevant? please ink us up with actual stuff If it is not too much of a distraction from your current day dream can you share the lat long of those peaks? I did so years ago (long before you got here) on this very forum and they line up no where near where you think they do.

so you claim to have done this? what is the lat long?

Wow,
That some pretty vile ooze seeping out.
You barge in at the end of a movie, sling insults and demand answers.

I feel bad that you are having difficulty. So I will see if I can explain the view to you.
After climbing up to the high point of the low ridge, and look to the north, Four Peaks looks like one peak.
The parts you don?t see, (as in the rest of Four Peaks) are obstructed by the skyline ..... from that specific view spot.

Think of it as a sort of roofless window in the skyline, and from that very spot on the low ridge, everything lines up to produce the view.
I have already said and shown where this view spot is located, many times, and maybe it is your turn to do some reading, instead of slinging insults, and then demanding answers.

Have a good night,
Idahodutch

 

[ConceptualizedNetherlandr]

ido loser game ho

Wow,
That some pretty vile ooze seeping out.
You barge in at the end of a movie, sling insults and demand answers.

ConceptualizedNetherlandr Join Date Apr 17, 2014


Idahodutch Join Date Sep 25, 2019


which movie are you late for?

I feel bad that you are having difficulty. So I will see if I can explain the view to you.
After climbing up to the high point of the low ridge, and look to the north, Four Peaks looks like one peak.
The parts you don?t see, (as in the rest of Four Peaks) are obstructed by the skyline ..... from that specific view spot.

Think of it as a sort of roofless window in the skyline, and from that very spot on the low ridge, everything lines up to produce the view.
I have already said and shown where this view spot is located, many times, and maybe it is your turn to do some reading, instead of slinging insults, and then demanding answers.

Have a good night,
Idahodutch

lat long?

 

[Idahodutch]

I hope everybody has a good day.
It is a clear sky and nice and cool.

CN,
That goes for you as well.
I hope you get over it soon.
Idahodutch

 

[Stevethepirate62]

I have an area of interest just above Boulder Canyon; if anyone will be in that area, i will share the location. It is located between Palomino Mtn. and Battleship Mtn.

 

[skyhawk1251]

Yes Skyhawk, that is the place, Thank You! for the mine name, know much about it? I did find some articles online, I do not put much credence in the Mine Bureau stating no minerals were present, the mineralization can be seen from the air! Maybe no gold though. -- Stevethepirate62

The overburden at the Indian Paint Mine looks very much like the red clay soil I've seen in Georgia, where gold is not associated with the red clay. The mineralization present would be finely divided hematite (iron), and I would also expect clay to be present. The same type of overburden is found at the King Tut gold placers in northern Mohave County, AZ, although the reddish color of the soil is not as pronounced.

I have an area of interest just above Boulder Canyon; if anyone will be in that area, I will share the location. It is located between Palomino Mtn. and Battleship Mtn. -- Stevethepirate62

I have my own area of interest near the junction of Boulder and Needle canyons. I would like to do the trip there Spring, 2022. My physical training/diet regimen began yesterday, September 1. The triple-digit heat and monsoon rains/humidity shut down my physical exercise for the summer, but I'll be building back up to full day hikes in the foothills carrying a full pack. I want to travel in ultralight mode with a pack base weight between 8 to 10 pounds. Meals will be survival rations. The "mission" will take priority over comfort. My physical condition will dictate whether or not the trip takes place.

You can PM me, if you wish, with the location of your area of interest. I'll use GE to look it over carefully, and I'll comment if I think boots on-the-ground are warranted. For my area of interest, I know something is there to be inspected and photographed, so going there won't be a waste of time and money.